Rachel1963

Rachel1963: Up and down symptoms.

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I have been off mirtazapine after a slow taper for five weeks. I am doing okay except I have a few days of bad symptoms. The past week I have been drinking a lot of milk, trying to increase my calcium. Yesterday I woke up and was having constant adrenalin all day. I only slept an hour last night. I was so frightened by the feeling of wanting to crawl out of my skin and burning up from heat that I broke down and took a piece of pill as tiny as the head of a pin. Finally I was able to calm down enough to sleep. The surges are still there but are much better today. My question is, could the extra calcium cause a surge in my withdrawal symptoms? I don't want to go back on this stuff again. It has given me fatty liver. I don't even drink. Just in case I have stopped with ththe extra calcium for now. Or is this just the way of the withdrawal?

Edited by scallywag
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Hi Rachel

 

Welcome to SA.  You have found a great site with plenty of information and helpful members.

 

I'm not able to help with your question.  However I suggest you make a Signature which will show up whenever you post and makes it easier for people to see your recent medication history.  Click this link which will tell you how to do this.

 

Also, one of the moderators will probably set this up as your Intro/Updates topic so your screen name will appear with your topic Up and Down Symptoms.  This topic will be your thread which you can use as a "diary", for asking questions about your individual situation and for members to offer suggestions.  If you click on the Follow this Topic (top right) and/or bookmark this page in your browser you will be able to find it more easily.

 

If you click on the Surviving Antidepressants logo (top left) it will take you to the main page where you can check out Topics that might answer some of your questions.

 

Someone should be along soon who may be able to help with the question you have asked.

 

CC

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Rachel1963. Welcome, despite i am new here. I know very few, but i suggest you dont drink animal foods or derivatives, because this make you acid and your organism must be alkalin. The acid foods make you acid and the milk is so acid . If you will try this do it  very, very slowly, according you could.And the worst than milk is sugar. It cause depression and bad mental symtoms (http://www.zentrum-der-gesundheit.de/zuckerfrei-leben-der-test-ia.html)

Dont stress for dont eat animal food, but do it how you could. The better calcium is from dark green vegetables like broccoli, spinach, kale, watercress, chard, lettuce, endive, chicory, brussels sprouts, kale, mustard greens, escarole, broccoli leaf, beet leaf, arugula, etc...and to fix calcium the D Vitamin is from sun between 11am and 1pm ONLY for 15 minutes,pls. "Hypercalcemia may be caused by increased gastrointestinal absorption or by an increase in calcium intake. People who ingest large amounts of calcium, as sometimes happens in the case of those with peptic ulcers and taking milk and calcium-containing antacids can develop hypercalcemia. An overdose of vitamin D may also affect the concentration of calcium in the blood to increase in the coming exaggerated form calcium absorption from the gastrointestinal tract" (http://www.manualmerck.net/?id=163&cn=1287), but i am not right if your symtom was by calcium. Maybe??!!. If you want some "milk" do it with alpist and almond. The food is the basis to left us (in tapering, in ilssnes and taking drugs)  better , maybe cured. The more acid is his blood, more diseases, including mental illness, you will have and the more alkaline your blood is more healthy and disease-free you will be. Than , dont care only about drugs but find to care your foods too.

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Hi Rachel-- welcome o the group.  I added your name to the title so it will be easier for you to find.   The big things we need to know are how much were you taking and for how long, then how did you taper off of it?  Like CC suggested adding a signature block will really help us to understand what is going on.  There are several other threads that it would be a good idea for you to read:

 

What is withdrawal syndrome?

 

Tips for tapering off Remeron (mirtazapine)

 

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

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Thank you all for welcoming me and providing this service. I will make a donation at some point for sure. My symptoms have calmed down today and I am exhausted. I believe they were related to my increase in calcium. I read a couple of articles about excess calcium in the blood causing palpitations and anxiety. I was drinking all the milk for my bones as they are not dense enough. But I guess I didn't think that now that my system is fresh off every slight change will be noticed and acted upon by my frazzled nervous system as it fights to put me back together again. No sudden moves is the order of the day for awhile. I'm sorry I took the .5 mg dose of mirt last night and I hope it doesn't affect me. But as most people here know when you are in the panicky moment there is no telling someone what to do sometimes. I don't want to reinstate and I hope so much that I won't but those bad days are soooo bad! For now I'm hanging in there. The fatty liver has me really frightened. The doctor has me hooked for an ultrasound in 3 months to see if it has decreased since being off the mirt so it is really important I stay quit. I have to say that for most of these five weeks my symptoms have been bearable most of the time and much milder than coming off at 3.5. No more of last night please!

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I've notice that I can drink raw milk with no problems, but if I heat it up for a hot drink it causes my symptoms to get worse.  I've been experimenting with that on and off over the last three or so weeks, and it seems to be a factor (for me anyway).

 

KarenB

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Are you still tapering Karen? I think our bodies must be very sensitive now. I could see how the hot milk could make your system rev up a bit. After all, they tell us women not to drink very hot drinks during menopause so we don't get a hot flash. I am hoping that most of my symptoms will be pretty well gone by three months since I didn't cold turkey and then fully recovered by six-nine!

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I slept last night for seven hours. Could it have been that little .5 mg? Either way, I am feeling much better today and not seeming to have much in the way of symptoms. I have to be careful of my crazy little ideas for awhile. I like the idea of getting all my calcium from veggies but I don't think it's very realistic.

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Yup, still tapering.   Will be for years :blink:.  So I'm just getting settled in really, ready for a long-haul.  But living life along the way too.  One thing I actually like about w/d is how much I'm getting to know myself, and all these little things that I might not notice otherwise.  I don't know about menopause yet - guess that will be another adventure ;).

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There is no better way than slow I think. I wish I had gone slower but it's okay now. I feel fine most days except a little anxious in the morning which soon passes. Don't do any unusual or extreme with your body. Just eat well and rest as much as you can. That has worked the best for me during this taper and when I tapered a benzo.

Not every woman has severe issues with menopause like I did. My body dropped its levels really quickly for some reason and I was the 1 in 10 with severe symptoms. So I will be tapering my fake estrogen for years too ????. Sigh! It's always something lol!

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Welcome, Rachel.

 

Many people do better with fish oil and magnesium supplements, see
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1300-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/
 

and the magnesium is good for your bones, too!! With vitamin D and a vitamin K spectrum, you're probably doing more for your bones than ingesting calcium.

 

It sounds like maybe fish oil and magnesium might help you get past withdrawal syndrome. Please let us know if your symptoms get worse.

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Thank you AS...

I take 500 mg mag every night. I couldn't have done my benzo taper without it. I have taken it for years. It helped my hot flashes and helps me sleep. My symptoms are much better now thanks, I feel normal for much of the day...still a little yucky on the mornings. So many symptoms are barely perceptible, it's a relief, and I have no reason to believe the pattern won't continue.

As for the vitamin D, I am loathe to try it right now, or the fish oil after my near disaster with the calcium lol, but I'm okay because I'm a peskatarian and eat fatty fish at least once per day.

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Another bad day and night! I need some advice ASAP please! I had another bad day yesterday full of anxiety and electrical zaps and couldn't sleep one wink. I had to take a couple of milligrams to help settle me and so I could sleep a tiny bit. I feel so awful! I am nearly six weeks off. I don't know whether I should reinstate at one milligram and try again in a little while or just keep taking a bit when I have a bad day. I feel so awful! Can anyone give me some advice? What is the best thing to do?

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I am filled with anxiety today. I'm so sad.

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But not depressed. Sad because I think I went too fast and now I think I have to go back on again for a bit because I can't stand this. I'm worried about my fatty liver and my weight gain. But I didn't gain any more weight at the lower numbers. I just wanted off so bad and I'm so disappointed.

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Hi Rachel,

 

I think you tapered too fast.  It is probably not too late to reinstate a small amount . Maybe , 1 mg.  It sounds like it helped you settle & sleep .  Please don't just take a bit, if you have a " bad day".  That will just destabilize your C.N.S.    Please read these links :

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7562-about-reinstating-and-stabilizing-to-reduce-withdrawal-symptoms/

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6632-the-rule-of-3kis-keep-it-simple-keep-it-slow-keep-it-stable/

 

I hope this helps.  Try and keep notes on your symptoms. You might have to reinstate a little more, but hopefully not. 

 

Ali.

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Thank you for posting Ali. I suspected you might say this as when I took a bit of pill last night it didn't stabilise me as quickly as it did last week. So I will start back at 1 mg daily and wait a couple of months before I do anything. I am slowly feeling better now. I read the two posts that you mentioned and they are very sensible and helpful. Your response has made my anxiety calm down now that I know what to do. Thank you very much. Rachel

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Hi: it has been three days and I'm still having anxiety come over me in waves. My other symptoms are much less, prickly, burnt skin, but the funny waves of anxiety are pretty bad and seem to get worse after I wake up for several hours. I think I may have to go back to 3.5. Maybe the 1 mg is not enough. I've read here that it can take several days or even a week to feel better. I'm a bit scared to be honest. Thanks for any advice, Rachel

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Hi Rachel-- I'm sorry to hear that you're having such a rough time of it.  You did hear right though, it takes a minimum of four days for any dose change, up or down, to become steady state in the blood, only then can things start to stabilize.  It's a frustratingly slow process, but every dose change resets the clock.  It would be a good idea to wait another week before making any changes.  Try not to be scared, it's all just unpleasant feelings and sensations and won't actually hurt you, and given time it will calm down.

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Hi Brassmonkey: thanks for sharing that. I have been thinking that yes, since I've been off a whole six weeks it will likely need some time to build up again and undo the withdrawal symptoms. I started getting frightened it wouldn't work because something has happened to my system and all that but then I told myself about needing to rebuild the amount to undo what is happening and I have calmed down quite a bit. When I stabilise and start again I'm going to wait a lot longer between cuts because obviously it takes at least six weeks for it to drain out of the system, for me anyway, just like it took to get into my system the first time. I guess I came charging down like a bull thinking that if my symptoms 'seemed' to be going away after a couple of weeks, that's all it took and it would be the same after coming off! Not! Thanks so much!

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So after several days I am starting to feel better. Three days ago I started taking 3.5 mg which was the last time I really felt stable. The trouble is now when I take my estrogen tablet in the morning I become hyper and have anxiety and chills and shaking for a couple of hours. I forgot to take it yesterday and I was fine all day but when I took it this morning within half an hour I started feeling the anxiety. It is calming down now but it scared me. I was thinking that maybe I shouldn't take the estrogen for a couple of days until my body stabilises a bit more and then introduce it again slowly. What do you think?

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Have I messed my whole body up completely? I'm a bit worried :(

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Hi Rachel ,

 

What oestrogen are you on ?  You feel stable , though on 3.5mg ? ( Mirtazapine ) .  I'm so confused.  You say in your sig , that you quit , Oct 5 , 2015, and the only drug you are on is the hormone .  Maybe if you could update your signature, that would be great . :unsure:   I would hold off the hormones , until you get this sorted, particularly if you feel better off them .  

 

Ali.

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Hi Ali; I need to update my signature, sorry. I reinstated after 5-6 weeks off. I have been back on at 3.5 mg for a few days. I started feeling a lot better yesterday when I forgot to take my estrogen 2 mg). I took it this morning and started to feel really bad symptoms about 1/2 hour after taking it. Could the estrogen be causing issues if my system is too sensitive right now?

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Rachel,

 

I would think so .  Obviously , no one can say for sure, but it certainly sounds like it .  Which one are you on ?  Synthetic ?  Have you heard of " Bio- identical" hormones ?  If your system is sensitive, anything could set it off !  Have you changed anything else ?  Caffeine, antibiotics , stress, sleep  ?

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No I haven't changed anything else. I take the Premarin and a bioidentical patch together to make up the estrogen. I had very bad menopause symptoms. I'm going to not take a Premarin tomorrow and see what happens. Maybe the synthetic estrogen is stirring things up right now. I can go a few days without it and if I feel better I can reintroduce a little bit at a time a little bit later. I think I will try that. It's almost as if the two drugs, Mirt and Premarin are vying for receptors. I don't know, I could be speaking nonsense.

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I've been reading that estrogen boosts epinephrine so I suspect that is what is happening. I'm going to not take the Premarin tomorrow and if I'm okay then I guess I have my answer. If I'm not, then I don't know what to do.

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I'm afraid that uprising may be too late for me. On the other hand I have only been at the 3.5 updose for a few days. I just want to feel better...I feel like a scared baby.

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I feel like I have drank 20 cups of coffee.

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 Rachel ,

 

See how you go . 3.5mg  for at least 4 days to make a difference.  Re - assess then . I think hormones are secondary . You will work this out ,in time . Trial & error. It can be so hard sometimes to figure out what is going on. 

 

Ali.

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Thank you Ali; I will give it a try...I'm still going to miss a couple days of my Premarin though, it was just too strange how the bad crap anxiety/adrenalin feelings came 1/2 hour after I took it. Couldn't hurt for a couple of days.

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I had a not bad day yesterday and an awful day today with every symptom and I'm needing reassurance. I was at 2 mg for five days and nothing happened, then at 3.5 mg for four days and nothing happening again either. I talked to my nurse practitioner today and she wants me to go to 15 mg because that is closest to where I would be if I was tapering properly. She said I need to go very slow. I just feel so awful right now. How long does it take to stabilise? I've seen 1 week, 2 weeks, 3 weeks, months! I was off five weeks before it hit the fan. I am keeping track to see what is coming and going and there are a few things seeking to get better but not much. Feeling scared and blue...

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Sorry, I'm talking about my reinstatement and feeling very afraid.

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You were right Ali, it wasn't the Premarin. I met with my doctor and they want me to start back on 15 mg, which 2 nights ago. I am still having some adrenalin and ramped up feelings but they are not as bad. I am going to wait until I feel a lot better and then taper down very slow. Thank you for helping me. It's not my fault, I had no idea. I feel very disappointed but I have to be patient and allow time to heal.

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I just want to apologise for panicking and not listening. I want to update here when I feel better and when I start tapering again. Thank you for everything you do.

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What bothers me the most is these days that started at five weeks out where I feel full of adrenalin all day. I have a day without this adrenalin and wound up feeling where I feel normal and then a day or two with it where I feel just awful. Will this adrenalin stuff go away again?

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