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When to end the taper and jump to zero?

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#1 Damienpryan

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Posted 22 December 2014 - 06:01 PM

Hi All,

 

Apologies if this has been done to death...

 

I was playing around in excel with a taper protocol and thought I'd share.

 

The 10% is a good rule and very good at encouraging people to go slowly.

Something a lot of us have trouble with. (well me anyway...)

 

But like Achilles catching the tortoise, reducing 10% will never get you to 0.

(An aim a lot of us have).

 

I've plugged the following rule into excel (attached) to see how it comes out.

Rule 1:

new dose = old dose - (9% of old dose) - (1% of original dose).

You plug the starting dose in and it will always taper to 0 in 24 months.

Now this may be to quick for some which brings us to ....

 

Rule 2:

If you feel moderate to nasty withdrawal effects then stop and stabilize.

After stabilizing restart taper from current dose.

(which will also reset the end 0mg end point to 2 years from current dose).

 

 

Here is an example of the output for a 20mg taper (though just an example!!)

Month Dose

1 20.0

2 18.0

3 16.2

4 14.5

5 13.0

6 11.6

7 10.4

8 9.3

9 8.2

10 7.3

11 6.4

12 5.7

13 4.9

14 4.3

15 3.7

16 3.2

17 2.7

18 2.2

19 1.8

20 1.5

21 1.1

22 0.8

23 0.6

24 0.3

25 0.0

 

I'll probably look to start this from my current 2.5 mg Lexapro , thus aiming to be at 0 in 2 years.

 

Cheers

 

Damien

Attached Files


Edited by ChessieCat, 11 April 2016 - 08:18 PM.
corrected fee to read feel

Been on SSRIs (mainly Lexapro) for around 15 years.

failed attempts to go cold turkey before I got proper info on it.

Over last 2 years I've slowly gone from 20 mg Lexapro to 2.5 mg Lexapro.

on 25th Jan 2015 I've now moved to home made liquid Lexapro.

Plan is to drop roughly 0.2 mg per month over the next 1-2 years.  

25th Jan 2015 2.5 mg Lexapro liquid.

24th Mar 2016 1.0 mg lexapro (crushed tablet mixed and refilled into capsules)

Planned to be at 0.0 mg lexapro by about October 2016. 

I also take 50-100 mg modafinil per day, no short term plans of stopping/tapering modafinil but will re-evaluate after I'm off lexapro. 


#2 mustangwoman

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Posted 24 December 2014 - 06:00 AM

What do most people here recommend as the drop off dose, or last dose before stopping ssri?


zoloft 2004-08 tapered too fast(2 weeks)
Luvox 5/08 100 mg 07/10 40mg via small reductions, 08/10 39mg, 09/10 38mg, 10/10 37mg, 11/10 36mg,2/11 35mg, 5/11 34mg, 8/11 33mg, 11/11 32mg, 01/12 31mg, 03/12 30mg, 4/12 29mg, 5/12 28 mg, 8/12 27 mg, 11/12 26 mg, 1/13 25 mg, 3/13 24 mg, 4/13 23 mg,6/13 22 mg, 7/13 21 mg, 8/13 20mg, 10/13 19 mg, 11/13 18 mg, 12/13 17 mg, 1/14 16 mg, 3/14 13 mg, 9/14 10.9 mg,  1/15 10 mg, 3/15  9 mg,  5/15 8 mg. 11/15 7.12 mg.  4/16  5 mg, 6/16   4.5 mg,  9/16 4.2 mg, 1/17 3.48 mg, 2/17  3.2 mg 


#3 Petunia

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Posted 24 December 2014 - 07:26 PM

Its really an individual decision, based on how your symptoms/nervous system has been responding to cuts through your taper.  Everyone seems to be different about how low they need to cut to and how much to slow down as the dose gets lower.  See: 

Tapering down to zero: Achilles and the tortoise 10% rule

I'm not a doctor.  My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal.

 

My Introduction Thread

 

Full Drug and Withdrawal History

 

Brief Summary

Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety)

Xanax PRN

Various other drugs over the years for side effects

2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010

Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal

DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms

Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal)

May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins.

Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes animal25.gif

 

Supplements which seem to help:  High doses of Vitamin C, Magnesium, Garlic and Ginger.  Taurine, Vit D3, L-Theanine and Inositol. I'm one of the rare people who react badly to fish oil.

 

June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens.

 

VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from?



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VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes?



VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects?

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#4 DLB

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Posted 25 December 2014 - 02:12 PM

Thought I could do it at 1 mg. but I dropped to .8 and had real bad couple of days so I think I will go all the way down to a miniscule amt.


Paxil start September 2003 due to Fluoroquinolone adverse reaction that I wish doc. knew what it was. 10mg. most of the time with a few short runs of 20mg. FAST tapered 3 times and finally hit poop out or a reaction to nsaid's in Nov.2013. Started a 10% taper Jan. 2014 and have been ok until Sept 14 and went through a short hell. Now plodding through and looking for the light with unrelenting insomnia and pain, fog, loss of interests....<p>12/20/14 - .8mg.
1/01/15 - .75 mg.
1/15/15 - .42 mg. better sleep now, hope it continues...
2/11-15 - .25 mg. doing really good!! 2 weeks feel 85% of old me!
3/17/15 .14 mg. Knee pain bad!
4/07/15 .05 mg. this is so small now that I am estimating and just licking it off palm small as a "." And I'm using small text..
4/13/15 NOTHING !!!! Took my last little micro dose on 4/12/15. 😃👍👍👍

#5 Ever

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Posted 25 December 2014 - 02:15 PM

I ain't jumping off till I do the 10% down to almost zero. Too many bad experiences jumping off too soon. Learnt my lesson and now think what's another year or two matter when the alternative might be suffering for years.

Put on Prothiaden for severe depression in 1989.  Recovered.   Prescribed Paxil for another bout of depression around 2000.   Have been trying to taper ever since but always crash about 2 months after getting to zero.   Because of the crashes, for years I thought that there was something wrong with me.   Then found that the crashes were simply withdrawal.   Now following a maximum of a 10% reduction every month or so and ready to slow down any time I feel any symptoms whatsoever.  Feeling good:).

7th Jan 15 - 3.6mg

28th Jan 15 - 3.2mg


#6 mammaP

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Posted 26 December 2014 - 03:11 PM

I jumped off Effexor at 1mg, (5 beads) and had awful withdrawal. I reinstated 20 months ago and

have only reduced by 3 beads in that time. Everyone is different but it is astonishing how bad things get

when stopping too soon at such a small amount. 


**I am not a medical professional, if in doubt please consult a doctor with withdrawal knowledge.

 

See how to create a signature here http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/12364-please-put-your-withdrawal-history-in-your-signature/

 

Many drugs for many years, prescribed diazepam first 1973, took occasionally. 3 or 4 tricyclics  for short periods.

1993 had a breakdown leading to 10 years of drug experiments with all classes of psych drugs.

2002  effexor. 

Tapered by counting beads from March 2012 to March 2013, ending with 5 beads.

Withdrawal April 2013 . Reinstated 5 beads reduced to 4 beads May 2013

Restarted taper  Nov 2013  

OFF EFFEXOR Feb 2015    :D 

 

Also tapered atenolol and omeprazole Dec 2013 - May 2014

 

Tapering tramadol, Feb 2015 100mg , March 2015 50mg -hold- Feb2016 46mg  March 8 2016 45 April 44mg  May 11  43mg June 14 42mg

Taking fish oil, magnesium, pro biotic.

 

My story http://survivinganti...king-in/page-33

 

Lesson learned, slow down taper at lower doses. Taper no more than 10% of CURRENT dose if possible

 

Following every sunset is a brand new day


#7 Rhiannon

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Posted 26 December 2014 - 06:20 PM

As always, though, your body is the expert on tapering, not a preplanned calendar. We just say 10% of the current dose as a general rule of thumb, a starting off point. How we tolerate reductions is very individual. Making up a plan or calendar ahead of time can give you some ideas, but I can't tell you how many of those I've had to throw out the window when my body made it clear that it does not heal according to a schedule I devise. 

 

Overall, at the lowest doses it's best to go very slowly, in my opinion. The upside of that approach is large: You can minimize the chance of going too fast, getting sick, having to reinstate and start over, and all the disruptions and misery that come with withdrawal. And the downside is very small: at such a low dose, the side effects and dangerous drug effects are minimal, and if you go slow enough to keep feeling good you'll already be enjoying many benefits of coming down to such a low dose so you won't be feeling the need to hurry.

 

So I would say, make those last cuts small and the breaks between them long. Take your time. I have seen many many people get into trouble and fail tapers because of going too fast at the end, but I've never seen anyone fail by going too slow.

 

Let me add, as someone tapering, I know this is easier said than done! You get close to that finish line and you want to rush there. But this is really the time when going slow will give you the maximum benefit for the minimum price.


Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease" as I was told. Long and tragic story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything.

 

Now tapering, ironically (but not surprisingly) healthier and more functional than I ever was during the years on the "meds," even with withdrawal (usually fairly mild at this slow pace).

 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 14 2011:   86 mg Neurontin   144 Lamictal,    5.5 Celexa   0.42 Xanax      1.9 mg Valium

Feb 16 2012:   10 mg Neurontin   115 Lamictal     3.7 Celexa   0.285 Xanax     2.0 Valium

Feb 22 2013:   86 Lamictal    2.05 Celexa       0.23 Xanax      1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

Now:                43                    0.625                 0.0775            1.3

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.


#8 cymbaltawithdrawal5600

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 05:54 AM

You may want to read this journal, talk about a microtaper and when he 'jumped off'. His ending dose was so small it reminded me of homeopathy. But he had symptoms the whole time and he was willing to be patient.

 

It is always a good idea to taper as slowly as you can. This is not a race, you only hurt yourself by jumping off prematurely. If you have to updose, your taper is prolonged.


What happened and how I arrived here: http://survivinganti...ion/#entry50878

July 2016 I have decided to leave my story here at SA unfinished. I have left my contact information in my profile for anyone who wishes to talk to me. I have a posting history spanning nearly 4 years and 3000+ posts all over the site.

Thank you to all who participated in my recovery. I'll miss talking to you but know that I'll be cheering you on from the sidelines, suffering and rejoicing with you in spirit, as you go on in your journey.

#9 AmyK

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 07:18 AM

Hi! At what dose would you stop sertraline/zoloft? I am down yo 2.23 mg now. But I guess I am not ready yet. The last drop was totally awful.

Tapering Zoloft since 2011. Current dose: 0,019 mg

 

0,039 mg 18 March? 0,052 mg 16 March 0,079 mg 4 March 0,086 1 March 0,099 mg 22 February 0,11 mg 15 February 0,13 mg 6 February 0,145 mg 24 January 0,15 mg 19 January 0,19 mg 10 January 0,20 mg 3 January

 

2016: 0,98 to 0,22 mg

2015: 2,35 to 1,01 mg

2014: 4,9 to 2,5 mg

2013: 9,1 to 5,1 mg

2012: 15,7 to 9,7 mg

2011: Started on 25 mg - then 50 mg- dropped to 25- to 12.5 mg - back to 25 mg - after 18.75 mg started tiny tapering to 16.6 mg

 

Started on 25 mg Zoloft in March 2011 due to stressrelated tinnitus that gave me panicattacks, then after two weeks up to 50 mg, which dose I was only on for five weeks. Had a terrible reaction to Zoloft from start, but was told to "hold on". After four months on 25 mg/12 mg/18,75 mg I was stuck. Therefore the long taper. Crazy, I know... Super sensitive to drops and have dropped by 4-6 % from the prevoius dose all the way from 17,5 mg.


#10 Altostrata

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Posted 08 March 2015 - 01:29 PM

AmyK, I moved your question here. I think maybe you answered it yourself.

 

If you're having withdrawal symptoms as you get close to the end, a long hold may be called for so your nervous system can settle down for the final push.

 

As to how low you'll need to go -- maybe others have a guess?


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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#11 Risperdrawlin

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Posted 24 May 2015 - 06:35 PM

Hi, can anyone who has come off Risperdal safely and relatively easily tell me at what dose they jumped off? I'm currently on 0.0625 mg. Today was my sixth day on it. I had cut 50% from 0.125 mg. I am thinking I will jump off after spending a month or two at 0.03 mg or 0.01 mg depending on how I feel. I might also jump off after some time on this dose, 0.0625 mg, if a decent amount of time goes by and I do not experience withdrawal symptoms. What have other folks done?

 

Thanks!


Was taking: 2 mg Risperdal

50 mg Lamictal

100 mg Zoloft

 

Currently taking:

0 mg Risperdal- finished 6/20/2015

0 mg Lamictal- finished 10/6/2015

0 mg Zoloft- finished ~March 2016

 

I am med-free!!

 

My intro thread: http://survivinganti...ion-eventually/


#12 kristinacc

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Posted 11 January 2016 - 01:30 PM

I'm sure this has been asked already in the forum. However, I've looked and can't seem to find it. 

 

I'm currently at 4 mg Prozac. I've been reducing by 10%. It seems you could go forever with the 10% reductions so, my question is at what level do you quit tapering and go to 0. Would it be 1mg? My withdrawal symptoms have never been anything more than chest pain, and agitation when doing it this slow, but I fear for that actual point in which I stop medication altogether. 


- 2006 - 2009 Prozac 20mg 

- June 2009- February 2010 OB/GYN recommended switching to wellbutrin while pregnant with 2nd child.

- February 2010 switched back to Prozac 20mg

 

Have been weaning since 2013ish - Currently at 4mg

 

 

 

 My intro: http://survivinganti...istinacc-intro/


#13 brassmonkey

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Posted 11 January 2016 - 03:53 PM

Hi Kristin-- yea, we have a thread about that: Tapering to zero -- when do you just drop off?

 

It is best to go as low as possible before jumping off.  It makes the taper frustratingly long, but it sure beats having reinstate, stabilize and retaper.  According to the charts the range from 5mg to 0mg is the place where most of the changes take place.  A very small change in dose makes for a very large reaction in the CNS.  Many people I know, myself included have really noticed this.  It is generally recommended that people go to 0.5mg and if possible even lower before taking the plunge.


20 years on Paxil starting at 20mg and working up to 40mg. Sept 2011 started 10% every 6 weeks taper (2.5% every week for 4 weeks then hold for 2 additional weeks), currently at 7.9mg. Oct 2011 CTed 15oz vodka a night, to only drinking 2 beers most nights, totally sober Feb 2013.

Since I wrote this I have continued to decrease my dose by 10% every 6 weeks (2.5% every week for 4 weeks and then hold for an additional 2 weeks). I added in an extra 6 week hold when I hit 10mg to let things settle out even more. When I hit 3mg it became hard to split the drop into 4 parts so I switched to dropping 1mgpw (pill weight) every week for 3 weeks and then holding for another 3 weeks.  The 3 + 3 schedule turned out to be too harsh so I cut back to dropping 1mgpw every 4 weeks which is working better.

Current dose 0.008mg 03-17-2016

 

"It's also important not to become angry, no matter how difficult life is, because you can loose all hope if you can't laugh at yourself and at life in general."  Stephen Hawking


#14 Rhiannon

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Posted 16 January 2016 - 12:34 AM

Be sure to take a look at the charts here:

http://survivinganti...-concentration/

 

You can see why it's particularly important to go slowest at the end. 

 

At 40 mg of Prozac you have something like maybe 85% receptor occupancy, but it goes down in a curve not a straight line, so at 1 mg you still have something like 15% receptor occupancy.  So people often find that's still a bit high to jump off.

 

It's highly variable from person to person though, and it sounds like you're doing well with your taper. I don't know, I'd be inclined to say go on down to 0.5 mg, anyway, if you don't have some pressing reason to need to get off faster (like pregnancy or something.)


Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease" as I was told. Long and tragic story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything.

 

Now tapering, ironically (but not surprisingly) healthier and more functional than I ever was during the years on the "meds," even with withdrawal (usually fairly mild at this slow pace).

 

Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010.  Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea.

 

Feb 15 2010:  300 mg Neurontin  200 Lamictal   10 Celexa      0.65 Xanax   and 5 mg Ambien 

Feb 14 2011:   86 mg Neurontin   144 Lamictal,    5.5 Celexa   0.42 Xanax      1.9 mg Valium

Feb 16 2012:   10 mg Neurontin   115 Lamictal     3.7 Celexa   0.285 Xanax     2.0 Valium

Feb 22 2013:   86 Lamictal    2.05 Celexa       0.23 Xanax      1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2014:   62 Lamictal    1.1 Celexa         0.135 Xanax    1.8 Valium

Feb 10 2015:   50 Lamictal      0.875 Celexa    0.11 Xanax      1.5 Valium

Feb 15 2016:   47.5 Lamictal   0.75 Celexa      0.0875 Xanax    1.42 Valium    

Now:                43                    0.625                 0.0775            1.3

 

I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion.


#15 nonliving

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Posted 09 February 2016 - 04:25 AM

What is the last dose to just quit it ? I beleive dose below therepeutic dose would be safe as the drug is no longer doing anything to our system. Is it so ?!
age 15 :: put on risperidone 4mg for depression. lost my mind and emotions ever since.... took for. 1.5years with a break of 2months.
age 17 :: stopped risperdal and put on klonopin ,luvox 200mg and abilify 20mg..
age 18 :: started tapering both abilify and luvox. now on 25mg luvox

#16 Altostrata

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Posted 03 May 2016 - 03:32 PM

"Therapeutic dose" means absolutely nothing. It's an arbitrary number from the drug companies.

 

You may not be feeling anything from the drug but your system can still be dependent on it. That is not a valid way to decide when to simply quit.


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

#17 Junglechicken

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Posted 04 May 2016 - 12:11 AM

Have been thinking about when I should do my next drop.

Although I feel as though I have stabilised over the last few weeks, I should probably hang on a couple more months to be sure.

Also, I could be starting work soon so all the more reason to wait I guess.

Have answered my own question, lol
Feb 2014 -Cipralex/Escitalopram 10mg daily June 2015 - Started taper, 5mg every other day July 2015 - 5mg every 2 days August 2015 - 5mg every 3 days September 2015 - 5mg every 4 days Sept 14th - Completed tapering, but at 7 weeks "drug free" I suffered serious WD symptoms as a consequence of "incorrect" tapering. Nov 25 2015 - Re-instated Cipralex @ 2.5mg daily. WD symptoms disappeared over a few days. Have been on this dose ever since and am experiencing "windows" and "waves". Nov 15th 2016 Re-started Therapy Jan 19th 2017 Started CBT. Jan 2017 Homeopathic Treatment starts 4th Jan 2017. Mar 2017 Naturopathic Treatment starts - anti-Candida diet starts as diagnosis of Systemic Candida.
Plan to re-start taper (liquid Cipralex/Escitalopram)

#18 marie123

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:48 PM

I had to reinstate 1 mg Trazodone after I jumped at 4 mg. I was surprised with withdrawal at 1 1/2 months. I did not have too much of a problem tapering to 4 mg, but when I got hit with withdrawal I had so much nausea for another 1 1/2 months. The reinstatement worked and I am waiting another month before I slowly taper from the 1 mg. I wonder how slow I should go?

 

Marie


10/13--10/14 Ambien   Done                                                                                  

3/14  7.5 Remeron  still taking this.                              

2/14         75 Trazodone   -    Tapered by dry cutting all the way down.

2/22/15    69 Traz

3/13/15    63 Traz

4/12/15    56 Traz

5/14/15    50 Traz

6/3/15      47 Traz

7/3/15      45 Traz

9/10/15    37 Traz

10/10/15  33 Traz, 10/24/15 30 mg 11/5/15 25 mg 11/20 12.5 mg 12/9/15 9 mg 12/22 6 mg 1/1/16 4 mg JUMPED.4/2/16 Rein 1 mg, 6/7/16 updose 2mg

8/13/16    1.1 Traz tapered from 2 mg, 10/26/16 1 mg Traz .92 mg CURRENT DOSE


#19 KarenB

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 05:12 PM

The 10% rule still holds at this lower end, in fact it is especially so at this end.  I'm just looking at your last sig. line of tapering details and seeing a fairly quick taper then a big jump to 0.

 

I'd suggest tapering by 10%, holding a month, and then considering your next move.  I don't want you to end up having to up-dose again, cause each change causes further instability for your CNS.  Slow and steady is your safest bet. 


2010 May Fluoxetine 20mg. Raging mostly stops, become more functional.
2011 February Escitalopram 10mg (sudden switch). 2012 January Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Early June Feeling great, decide to taper. Doc advises alternate days 20mg/10mg for 4 weeks.  Late June Steady. Drop to 10mg daily. Early July Not coping, raging, flu symptoms, shaky, anxious, low, spaced-out, self-destructive.  Mid July Return to alternate days 20mg/10mg - minimal improvement. Early August Return to full dose 20mg. Lost.
2014 February Switch to Venlafaxine. (First reduced Esc. to 10mg/day for a week) Feb-April Lost, 'light' self-harm, exhausted.
April Increase Ven. to 150mg/day. Dizzy. July 75mg twice a day to improve dizziness. Deep depression remains.  2015 Feb Vigilant dose spacing partially eases dizziness. Mar Switch to Effexor 75mg 2x/day. May Cut 10% to 135mg - bad w/d 2 mths, held 1 mth.  Aug 1.3% cut - bad 1mth, held 1mth. Oct 4 wkly 0.4% cuts held 6 weeks. Jan 2016 2 wkly 0.4% cuts. 8 month hold. Sept Wkly cuts: 0.5%, 3 1% cuts.  Oct 4 wkly 1% cuts, hold 3-4 weeks.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamins E & C, magnesium, iron, MSM, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.  My story of healing: ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor or counselor; please do your own research and be prepared to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.


#20 marie123

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 06:20 PM

KarenB thanks for your advice. I know slow and steady is the way to go. I can't help, however, thinking about the Remeron taper I'll have to deal with when the Trazodone is finished. You know the longer I'm taking the Remeron the harder I think it will be to taper. That's my train of thought. I've taken it for 2 years now and it's time to go!

 

Marie


10/13--10/14 Ambien   Done                                                                                  

3/14  7.5 Remeron  still taking this.                              

2/14         75 Trazodone   -    Tapered by dry cutting all the way down.

2/22/15    69 Traz

3/13/15    63 Traz

4/12/15    56 Traz

5/14/15    50 Traz

6/3/15      47 Traz

7/3/15      45 Traz

9/10/15    37 Traz

10/10/15  33 Traz, 10/24/15 30 mg 11/5/15 25 mg 11/20 12.5 mg 12/9/15 9 mg 12/22 6 mg 1/1/16 4 mg JUMPED.4/2/16 Rein 1 mg, 6/7/16 updose 2mg

8/13/16    1.1 Traz tapered from 2 mg, 10/26/16 1 mg Traz .92 mg CURRENT DOSE


#21 KarenB

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 06:23 PM

I know - so frustrating.  However the whole thing will be faster if you don't take risks and have to backtrack etc.


2010 May Fluoxetine 20mg. Raging mostly stops, become more functional.
2011 February Escitalopram 10mg (sudden switch). 2012 January Escitalopram 20mg.  2013 Early June Feeling great, decide to taper. Doc advises alternate days 20mg/10mg for 4 weeks.  Late June Steady. Drop to 10mg daily. Early July Not coping, raging, flu symptoms, shaky, anxious, low, spaced-out, self-destructive.  Mid July Return to alternate days 20mg/10mg - minimal improvement. Early August Return to full dose 20mg. Lost.
2014 February Switch to Venlafaxine. (First reduced Esc. to 10mg/day for a week) Feb-April Lost, 'light' self-harm, exhausted.
April Increase Ven. to 150mg/day. Dizzy. July 75mg twice a day to improve dizziness. Deep depression remains.  2015 Feb Vigilant dose spacing partially eases dizziness. Mar Switch to Effexor 75mg 2x/day. May Cut 10% to 135mg - bad w/d 2 mths, held 1 mth.  Aug 1.3% cut - bad 1mth, held 1mth. Oct 4 wkly 0.4% cuts held 6 weeks. Jan 2016 2 wkly 0.4% cuts. 8 month hold. Sept Wkly cuts: 0.5%, 3 1% cuts.  Oct 4 wkly 1% cuts, hold 3-4 weeks.
Supplements: Fish oil, vitamins E & C, magnesium, iron, MSM, oat-straw tea, nettle tea.  My story of healing: ContinuedHealing

***I am not a doctor or counselor; please do your own research and be prepared to take responsibility for decisions you make.*** 

           'The possibility of renewal exists so long as life exists.'  Dr Gabor Mate.


#22 rapunzel2

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 04:12 AM

What's the jump off dose of seroquel? any insight, experiences?


in 2002- cipramil for half a year, ended it uneventfully. in 2006 - citalopram for half a year, ended in horrific state, ditched the drugs CT. 2006-2008 not feeling well but drug free. in 2008 prozac 20mg + quetiapine 25mg. 2009 tried to stop, ended up in hole after couple of months, started zoloft. 2009-2011 zoloft 50mg. went to 25mg in 2011 summer, it resulted in half a year horrible suffering. reinstated, changed drugs, nothing happened. by 2012 beginning suddenly felt great and CT meds. after 4 months came suddenly most horrible human suffering that's possible. started tapering slowly, GFCF diet and Hardy Nutritionals vitamins in 2013 summer. 

current medications: 1) fluoxetine and quetiapine since Aug 2012; 2) Daily Essential Nutrients by Hardy Nutritionals 10 capsules / since May 2013 + omega3; 3) Gluten-free-casein-free diet since june 2013; 4) free form amino acid complex 3 capsules 5) milk thistle 6) niacin 1500mg

25. april'13 fluoxetine 40mg -> 36mg (10%); 25. may'13 fluoxetine 36mg -> 32mg (1 month inbetween, 11%); 4. july'13 fluoxetine 32mg-> 28mg (5,5 weeks, 13%); 27. july'13 quetiapine 50 -> 45mg (10%); 15. aug'13 fluoxetine 28mg -> 24mg (6 weeks, 14%); 29. sept'13 quetiapine 45 -> 40mg (1,5 months, 11%); 14. oct'13 quetiapine 40mg -> 35mg (2 weeks, 13%); 16. oct'13 quetiapine 35mg -> 40mg; 17. oct'13 fluoxetine 24mg -> 22 mg (8%); 4. feb’14 fluoxetine 22mg -> 21mg (3,5 months hold inbetween, 5% cut); 21. feb'14 fluoxetine 21mg -> 20,5mg (2,5 weeks, 2,4% cut); 27 feb'14 fluoxetine 20,5mg -> 20mg (1 week, 2,4% cut); 30 mar'14 fluoxetine 20mg -> 19,5mg (4,5 weeks, 2,4% cut); 17 may'14 quetiapine 40mg -> 31mg (22% cut); 31 may'14 fluoxetine 19,5mg -> 17,56mg (9,9%); 13 july'14 quetiapine 31mg -> 25mg (19% cut); 19 july'14 quetiapine 25mg -> 18, 75mg (25% cut, 6 days); 28. july'14 quetiapine 18,75mg -> 22mg (-15%); 9. aug'14 fluoxetine 17,52mg -> 17,12mg (2,3% cut, 10 weeks, over 2 months); 19. aug'14 back to 17,52mg due to bad withdrawal symptoms; 20. oct'14 fluoxetine 17,52 -> 17,2mg (1,8% cut); 28. nov'14 fluoxetine 17,2 -> 15,6 (9,8%); 9. feb’15 fluoxetine 15,6 -> 14,4 (7,7%); 3. may’15 quetiapine 22mg -> 19mg (-14%); 27. may’15 fluoxetine 14,4mg -> 12,6mg (-12,5%, 1,8mg); 2. july’15 fluoxetine 12,6mg -> 10,6mg (15,9%, 2mg); 26. oct'15 fluoxetine 10,6mg - 9mg (15%, 1,6mg); 18. jan'16 quetiapine 18mg -> 15mg (17%); 16. mar'16 fluoxetine 9mg -> 7,4mg (18%); 22.may'16 fluoxetine 7,4mg -> 6mg (19%); 19.sept'16 quetiapine 12,5 -> 11,25 (10%); 26. sept'16 quetiapine 11,25 -> 10,25 (9%), 3 oct'16 quetiapine 10,25 -> 9,25 (10%); 10 oc'16 quetiapine 9,25-> 8,25mg (11%), 14 nov'16 quetiapine 8,25 -> 7,25 (12%); 9 Jan'17 fluoxetine 6mg -> 5,8mg (3%): 18 jan fluoxetine 5,8mg -> 5,6mg (3%); 6 feb fluoxetine 5,6mg -> 5,4mg (4%); 19 feb fluoxetine 5,4mg -> 5,2mg (4%); 5 mar fluox 5,2 -> 5,0 (4%). 

 


#23 music321

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 04:53 PM

The last time I came off of prozac, I tapered down to 0.4 mg, then went cold turkey from there.  I had withdrawal reactions for a few months.  Since then, I came off of a far higher dose, far too fast, and crashed hard.  So, I'm wondering how far I should taper before stopping.  Going from 5 mg to 1/100 of a mg, at a dose-adjusted rate of 10% per month would take 249 weeks, or 4.8 years. At this rate, I could go down to a millionth of a dose in 587 weeks, or 11.3 years.  

 

At some point it gets ridiculous.  At what point should I simply go cold turkey?

Thanks


various SSRI for years

 

20 mg Lyrica 2010

30 mg to 0 mg Prozac 2012

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 2012

Drop to 19 mg Prozac 2013

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 1 month later (2013)

Gradual decrease of Prozac dosage starting in late summer of 2015, currently at 11.2 mg/day

 

use of vitamin D3, fish oil, and magnesium at various times


#24 music321

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Posted 11 December 2016 - 07:20 PM

My math was off.  The above is in months, not weeks.  I'm looking at half a decade to stop at 1/10 mg.


various SSRI for years

 

20 mg Lyrica 2010

30 mg to 0 mg Prozac 2012

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 2012

Drop to 19 mg Prozac 2013

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 1 month later (2013)

Gradual decrease of Prozac dosage starting in late summer of 2015, currently at 11.2 mg/day

 

use of vitamin D3, fish oil, and magnesium at various times


#25 AmyK

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Posted 12 December 2016 - 02:27 AM

I am down to 0.24 mg zoloft. It seems easier to taper now. 1 mg to 0,6 was soo hard!
Anyway I will go further down, I still feel side effects and some wd symptoms.
I guess it's very individual.

Tapering Zoloft since 2011. Current dose: 0,019 mg

 

0,039 mg 18 March? 0,052 mg 16 March 0,079 mg 4 March 0,086 1 March 0,099 mg 22 February 0,11 mg 15 February 0,13 mg 6 February 0,145 mg 24 January 0,15 mg 19 January 0,19 mg 10 January 0,20 mg 3 January

 

2016: 0,98 to 0,22 mg

2015: 2,35 to 1,01 mg

2014: 4,9 to 2,5 mg

2013: 9,1 to 5,1 mg

2012: 15,7 to 9,7 mg

2011: Started on 25 mg - then 50 mg- dropped to 25- to 12.5 mg - back to 25 mg - after 18.75 mg started tiny tapering to 16.6 mg

 

Started on 25 mg Zoloft in March 2011 due to stressrelated tinnitus that gave me panicattacks, then after two weeks up to 50 mg, which dose I was only on for five weeks. Had a terrible reaction to Zoloft from start, but was told to "hold on". After four months on 25 mg/12 mg/18,75 mg I was stuck. Therefore the long taper. Crazy, I know... Super sensitive to drops and have dropped by 4-6 % from the prevoius dose all the way from 17,5 mg.


#26 music321

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Posted 14 December 2016 - 04:01 PM

What occurs to me is that if these drugs are active at concentrations of 1% their prescribed dosage, perhaps they should be prescribed starting at these very low dosages.  Then, I'm not really for their use at all after all that I've been through.


various SSRI for years

 

20 mg Lyrica 2010

30 mg to 0 mg Prozac 2012

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 2012

Drop to 19 mg Prozac 2013

Reinstate 20 mg Prozac 1 month later (2013)

Gradual decrease of Prozac dosage starting in late summer of 2015, currently at 11.2 mg/day

 

use of vitamin D3, fish oil, and magnesium at various times


#27 AmyK

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Posted 15 December 2016 - 11:35 PM

I agree with you. 50 mg was too much for me. I woke up like a zombie each day.
They should never be prescripted...

Tapering Zoloft since 2011. Current dose: 0,019 mg

 

0,039 mg 18 March? 0,052 mg 16 March 0,079 mg 4 March 0,086 1 March 0,099 mg 22 February 0,11 mg 15 February 0,13 mg 6 February 0,145 mg 24 January 0,15 mg 19 January 0,19 mg 10 January 0,20 mg 3 January

 

2016: 0,98 to 0,22 mg

2015: 2,35 to 1,01 mg

2014: 4,9 to 2,5 mg

2013: 9,1 to 5,1 mg

2012: 15,7 to 9,7 mg

2011: Started on 25 mg - then 50 mg- dropped to 25- to 12.5 mg - back to 25 mg - after 18.75 mg started tiny tapering to 16.6 mg

 

Started on 25 mg Zoloft in March 2011 due to stressrelated tinnitus that gave me panicattacks, then after two weeks up to 50 mg, which dose I was only on for five weeks. Had a terrible reaction to Zoloft from start, but was told to "hold on". After four months on 25 mg/12 mg/18,75 mg I was stuck. Therefore the long taper. Crazy, I know... Super sensitive to drops and have dropped by 4-6 % from the prevoius dose all the way from 17,5 mg.


#28 Panicpax

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Posted 02 January 2017 - 01:09 PM

Now I'm stabilizing at 3.6mg of paxil and it took me 20 month to get here from 20mg on for a few years .

I will for the first time do a 12% taper each month since that's what my brain can handle.

But it does seem ridiculous to go down as far as 0.2mg ... but after a got an accumulation hit last week because I was going 15 to 20% monthly
( 3.4 so I upped it and am stabilizing nicely on 3.6)

I don't see it that ridiculous anymore... will take about another 2 years but I really don't care as long as life can be lived normally and functionally.

october 31st 2007

panic attacks after the trying ambien and recovering from the flu 

paxil 20mg by a psychaitrist 

2 attempts to stop

1st down to 10 then over night switch to prozac ( 2 weeks later total WD relieved after 7 weeks 1 hour after taking 10 of paxil again)

2nd tapered with liquid over 2 year ( down to 1.6mg) then doctor mistaked WD with relapse)( didnt go slow enogh and on 20mg with klonopin 1mg

klonopin only 5 month( made liquid and got off)

 

3rd attemp now

liquid over 2 years reached 3.6mg

my way (0.2mg down a week ) now stuck nd need to go slower.


#29 KtKat

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Posted 08 January 2017 - 02:52 AM

What occurs to me is that if these drugs are active at concentrations of 1% their prescribed dosage, perhaps they should be prescribed starting at these very low dosages.  Then, I'm not really for their use at all after all that I've been through.

 

I agree with you music321, the starter dose of escitalopram is 10mg, at which level you have 80% binding of chemical to the relevant receptor. Why can't they start your dosage at 5mg (which still has about 70% occupancy) and see what happens from there? Sure, you might end up having to wait another 6-8weeks and then updose, but surely that would reduce some of the side effects. I had horrible nausea and diarrhea for the first few weeks when I started on it. 


Started 10mg Escitalopram March 2013
Stopped Escitalopram cold turkey December 2013 (Unsuccessfully)
Restarted 10mg Escitalopram February 2014
Started tapering May 2016 - 5mg
Estimated drops - 4mg, 3mg, 2.5mgOctober 2016 - 1.25mg
Stopped 19 Dec 2016
Withdrawals from 27 December - Anxiety, Insomnia, Nausea, Diarrhea, Headache (1 day), inc heart rate
7 Jan 2017 reinstated 1mg/day escitalopram

4 Feb 2017 - inc to 1.25mg Escitalopram after some feelings of depression returning

Currently experiencing generalised anxiety in waves


#30 Cipramillion

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Posted 25 January 2017 - 11:02 AM

Im at 0.08 mg lexapro and still tapering. I actually felt worse after last 10% cut. When you go below the 0.5 border, its not possible to get accurate doses, even with liquid. But still better than jumping off.

<p>Sept 2015: 5 mg Cipralex for 3 weeks. Lots of side effects. Reduced to 2.5 mg for 2 weeks. Experiencing withdrawal and side effects still after dose reduction. Quit after almost 4 weeks on 2.5 mg because of adverse effects. Experiencing withdrawal symptoms still. Reinstating 1mg after 3 weeks. Reduced to 0.50 after 2 days due to sensitive reaction (dysautonomia) and trip to ER. January 2016: After 14 months of tapering from 0.5 mg im now down to 0.08mg. Planing on one more drop before 4-8 weeks healing, then jump to zero. 14.03.17: Lexapro free!


#31 Cipramillion

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Posted 29 January 2017 - 08:04 AM

My plan is to do one more cut, then evaluate response and heal for 4-8 weeks. Hopefully i can go the full distanse to zero then. Lexapro is a strong SSRI, so i will take no chances at this point. Then my last dose will be 0.04 mg. Anyone lower?

<p>Sept 2015: 5 mg Cipralex for 3 weeks. Lots of side effects. Reduced to 2.5 mg for 2 weeks. Experiencing withdrawal and side effects still after dose reduction. Quit after almost 4 weeks on 2.5 mg because of adverse effects. Experiencing withdrawal symptoms still. Reinstating 1mg after 3 weeks. Reduced to 0.50 after 2 days due to sensitive reaction (dysautonomia) and trip to ER. January 2016: After 14 months of tapering from 0.5 mg im now down to 0.08mg. Planing on one more drop before 4-8 weeks healing, then jump to zero. 14.03.17: Lexapro free!






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