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Petition calling for tapering kits in the UK


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#1 JamesMoore

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 02:06 AM

Hi all, I'm new to the forums here but, like many of you, I am struggling to withdraw from my medication (in my case Mirtazapine). I feel so strongly about this that I believe that the Pharmaceutical companies should assist users who want to stop or reduce their medications.

 

I have created a petition at Change.org and I would be really grateful if you would visit the petition, sign it and make your friends, families and/or co-workers aware of it too. The more we get this issue recognised and discussed, the greater the chance that we can get the help we need.

 

The petition has so far had the support of a few charities including Mind and also by Dr. Ben Goldacre.

 

Thanks and my best wishes to anyone struggling with anti-depressant withdrawal.

 

James

 

https://www.change.o...epression-drugs

 

 

 



#2 Junglechicken

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 02:11 AM

James,

 

I have signed this petition.

 

This is such a good idea, thank you.

 

JC


<p>Feb 2014 -Cipralex/Escitalopram 10mg daily June 2015 - Started taper, 5mg every other day July 2015 - 5mg every 2 days August 2015 - 5mg every 3 days September 2015 - 5mg every 4 days Sept 14th - Completed tapering, but at 7 weeks "drug free" I suffered serious WD symptoms as a consequence of "incorrect" tapering. Nov 25 2015 - Re-instated Cipralex @ 2.5mg daily. WD symptoms disappeared over a few days. Have been on this dose ever since and am experiencing "windows" and "waves". Nov 15th 2016 Re-started Therapy Jan 19th 2017 Started CBT. Jan 2017 Homeopathic Treatment starts 4th Jan 2017. Mar 2017 Naturopathic Treatment starts - anti-Candida diet starts as diagnosis of Candida Related Complex (CRC). 24 March 2017 DETOX (3 weeks) started for anti-Candida to help "re-set" my gut. April 2017 "Genova Testing 3 day stool sampling" Comprehensive Analysis.  Gut Cleanse - 6 weeks.  Plan to re-start taper (liquid Cipralex/Escitalopram) when feel ready.


#3 Terry4949

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 05:28 AM

James I have also signed this position , even if they don't do anything at least it opens the door to a few more people who aren't away of any problems , good idea
100mg Effexor 2000 untill jan 2015 severe withdrawals . Tapered 4weeks.
Jan to end of Feb 4 weeks on 15mg mirtazapine 20mg quetiapine , tapered of both 2 weeks , severe withdrawals , still some from Effexor possibly
End of Feb 2015 to end of July 30mg citolapram tapered 2weeks severe withdrawal , anxiety high , bouts of sever depression , severe emotional moods
Currently on 30mg mirtazapine appx 5 months , high anxiety, March cut dose 22.5 mg going on to liquid still no improvements with the depression , also started sept 2015 200mg pregabalin , currently on 22.5mg mirtazapine tablet form doing really badly. Cut beginning of May remeron 20mg still bad anxiety,August 15mg remeron ,100mg pregablin , severe depression headaches anxiety , oct 2016 doctor stoped pregablin c/t , 15mg mirtazapine still no let up in physical symptoms ,high anxiety ,Nov 2016 remeron 13.5 mg , Jan 2017 mirtazapine stopped flouxetine20mg added by hospital admission, no choice , doing really badly , akathesia suicidel ,, Flouxetine c/t by hospital after 7 weeks 20mg daily , currently on nothing , God help me

#4 Terry4949

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 05:36 AM

plus I would like to add , Dr . Ben goldacre is one of the good guys , and acknowledges the problems with these medications
100mg Effexor 2000 untill jan 2015 severe withdrawals . Tapered 4weeks.
Jan to end of Feb 4 weeks on 15mg mirtazapine 20mg quetiapine , tapered of both 2 weeks , severe withdrawals , still some from Effexor possibly
End of Feb 2015 to end of July 30mg citolapram tapered 2weeks severe withdrawal , anxiety high , bouts of sever depression , severe emotional moods
Currently on 30mg mirtazapine appx 5 months , high anxiety, March cut dose 22.5 mg going on to liquid still no improvements with the depression , also started sept 2015 200mg pregabalin , currently on 22.5mg mirtazapine tablet form doing really badly. Cut beginning of May remeron 20mg still bad anxiety,August 15mg remeron ,100mg pregablin , severe depression headaches anxiety , oct 2016 doctor stoped pregablin c/t , 15mg mirtazapine still no let up in physical symptoms ,high anxiety ,Nov 2016 remeron 13.5 mg , Jan 2017 mirtazapine stopped flouxetine20mg added by hospital admission, no choice , doing really badly , akathesia suicidel ,, Flouxetine c/t by hospital after 7 weeks 20mg daily , currently on nothing , God help me

#5 scallywag

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 08:43 AM

This is brilliant James. Thanks for starting the petition and for posting it here.

 

If you haven't already, you might want to post it in the UK threads in the Relationships forum.

 

Colchester & Essex

Southwest UK


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results
Cymbalta (brand name), 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 20 mg to 7 mg in 2016, exact doses and dates in this post;
2017: 6.3 (58 beads) Feb. 1; 5.6 mg (52) Feb. 22; 5.4 mg (50) Mar. 15; 5.1 mg (47) Mar. 25; 4.9 mg (45) Apr. 5; 4.5 mg (42) Apr. 14;
Current dose: 3.5 mg (32) 2017-Apr-26
+ Supplements: fish oil (1500 mg EPA/500 mg DHA), Vitamins: D3, K2, C; Minerals: Mg, Se, Cr, I, V
scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet


#6 Altostrata

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 08:45 AM

For your information, Tapering packets to be produced for paroxetine and venlafaxine...

 

This small Netherlands company is still working on producing more tapering kits for other drugs.


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

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#7 Terry4949

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 09:56 AM

I wish these were available when I was withdrawing from Effexor , the only thing is I wonder if the kits will do 10% drops as advices here or will they just drop in larger amounts , anyway it's a start and at least they acknowledge the fact that they need to withdraw slower and by smaller amounts
100mg Effexor 2000 untill jan 2015 severe withdrawals . Tapered 4weeks.
Jan to end of Feb 4 weeks on 15mg mirtazapine 20mg quetiapine , tapered of both 2 weeks , severe withdrawals , still some from Effexor possibly
End of Feb 2015 to end of July 30mg citolapram tapered 2weeks severe withdrawal , anxiety high , bouts of sever depression , severe emotional moods
Currently on 30mg mirtazapine appx 5 months , high anxiety, March cut dose 22.5 mg going on to liquid still no improvements with the depression , also started sept 2015 200mg pregabalin , currently on 22.5mg mirtazapine tablet form doing really badly. Cut beginning of May remeron 20mg still bad anxiety,August 15mg remeron ,100mg pregablin , severe depression headaches anxiety , oct 2016 doctor stoped pregablin c/t , 15mg mirtazapine still no let up in physical symptoms ,high anxiety ,Nov 2016 remeron 13.5 mg , Jan 2017 mirtazapine stopped flouxetine20mg added by hospital admission, no choice , doing really badly , akathesia suicidel ,, Flouxetine c/t by hospital after 7 weeks 20mg daily , currently on nothing , God help me

#8 JamesMoore

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Posted 01 September 2016 - 11:38 PM

Hi All, thank you so much for your suggestions and help so far, I am really grateful.

@scallywag - thanks for the links to the local groups that's really useful
@altostrata - really interesting to hear that something similar happens in the Netherlands already, I am hopeful that we can make some progress elsewhere by raising awareness of the issue but this certainly shows that the approach works.
@junglechicken, @terry4949 thanks for the signatures.

Please raise awareness of the petition if you can or feel free to suggest other groups/users that I could promote the petition with.

Best wishes

James

#9 Altostrata

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 12:26 PM

It's an excellent idea, JamesMoore. I hope you go far with it. There's an MP who's very interested in psychiatric drug issues, I don't remember his name, but you might contact him. I believe his daughter died in some drug-related incident.


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.

"It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein

All postings © copyrighted.

#10 nz11

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Posted 02 September 2016 - 10:34 PM

signed

 

nz11


2000 amitryptaline, nortriptaline venlafaxine clonazepam for  arm pain from keyboard use, told I had a chemical imbalance it would fix my arm was just a matter of finding the right med for me not informed of the nature of these drugs assured safe and not addictive, CT off Effexor after being told to double the dose on reporting adverse effects...later ..uncharacteristic psych panic tearful presented to doctor to get answers. Given paroxetine no questions asked 'safe and not addictive' next please.2001-2010 paroxetine (paxil) 2 failed attempts to quit, a learned helplessness set in. Feb 10 - Sept 10,  8 month clueless taper, hell. Doc said I had underlying depression .. I said that's not right' then found online support group and the truth!...overcome with inconceivable humiliation and outrage. 28 Sept 10 drug free ...  daily psych and emotional torture beginning in the waking hours of the morning receding somewhat in the evening only to start up again the next day. 28 Sept 12 (24 months) Stabilizing  (What an indescribable unimaginable non-functional nightmare). sleep issues start up at 3 yrs  waking daily at 2am -4.30am), April 2016 return to sport for the first time since drug free, Sept 16 return to work on casual basis.  28 Sept 16 (6yrs drug free), still cant sleep with any regularity, pssd continues no sign of improvement, still feel Rip van Winkle-ish, brain fog still improving, psoriasis concerns.

 

"It is unsafe for people who suffer from something that could be treated with an ssri to consult a psychiatrist." Gotzshe 2015. [ I think Gotzsche could have easily meant to say 'to consult anyone with prescribing privileges']. "Going to a psychiatrist is one of the most dangerous actions a person can take." Breggin

 

“Paroxetine is not safe, it is not effective and it meets every known definition of addictive.” McLaren, N, (2016) 'Psychiatry as bullsh*t’ p55..."Psychiatry is stuffed full of 'deep nonsense' better known as bullsh*t." McLaren 2016

 

"Within the first week of when you go on an antidepressant you may have a sexual dysfunction, it can go on forever, often only appearing when you go off the drug ...its extraordinarily common" Healy 2015

 

See  my intro post #451 for the xanax back story and for a CV -GSKs.  Come on guys get taperwise see a TaperMe Schedule

 For a staggeringly shocking 'prozac back story' see the truth post #523

 

"If I were an enemy combatant and the NZ army did this to me someone would be dragged to the Hague and jailed!"  nz11


#11 JamesMoore

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Posted 04 September 2016 - 01:15 AM

Hey all, thank you so much for the positive feedback and for the support, I am very grateful.

 

I have put together a web site to accompany the petition, if any of you were interested in having a look it is here...

 

http://www.jfmoore.co.uk

 

Thanks again.

 

James



#12 nz11

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Posted 04 September 2016 - 07:54 PM

Thankyou for all that you are doing James.

nz11


2000 amitryptaline, nortriptaline venlafaxine clonazepam for  arm pain from keyboard use, told I had a chemical imbalance it would fix my arm was just a matter of finding the right med for me not informed of the nature of these drugs assured safe and not addictive, CT off Effexor after being told to double the dose on reporting adverse effects...later ..uncharacteristic psych panic tearful presented to doctor to get answers. Given paroxetine no questions asked 'safe and not addictive' next please.2001-2010 paroxetine (paxil) 2 failed attempts to quit, a learned helplessness set in. Feb 10 - Sept 10,  8 month clueless taper, hell. Doc said I had underlying depression .. I said that's not right' then found online support group and the truth!...overcome with inconceivable humiliation and outrage. 28 Sept 10 drug free ...  daily psych and emotional torture beginning in the waking hours of the morning receding somewhat in the evening only to start up again the next day. 28 Sept 12 (24 months) Stabilizing  (What an indescribable unimaginable non-functional nightmare). sleep issues start up at 3 yrs  waking daily at 2am -4.30am), April 2016 return to sport for the first time since drug free, Sept 16 return to work on casual basis.  28 Sept 16 (6yrs drug free), still cant sleep with any regularity, pssd continues no sign of improvement, still feel Rip van Winkle-ish, brain fog still improving, psoriasis concerns.

 

"It is unsafe for people who suffer from something that could be treated with an ssri to consult a psychiatrist." Gotzshe 2015. [ I think Gotzsche could have easily meant to say 'to consult anyone with prescribing privileges']. "Going to a psychiatrist is one of the most dangerous actions a person can take." Breggin

 

“Paroxetine is not safe, it is not effective and it meets every known definition of addictive.” McLaren, N, (2016) 'Psychiatry as bullsh*t’ p55..."Psychiatry is stuffed full of 'deep nonsense' better known as bullsh*t." McLaren 2016

 

"Within the first week of when you go on an antidepressant you may have a sexual dysfunction, it can go on forever, often only appearing when you go off the drug ...its extraordinarily common" Healy 2015

 

See  my intro post #451 for the xanax back story and for a CV -GSKs.  Come on guys get taperwise see a TaperMe Schedule

 For a staggeringly shocking 'prozac back story' see the truth post #523

 

"If I were an enemy combatant and the NZ army did this to me someone would be dragged to the Hague and jailed!"  nz11


#13 CJAJ16

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Posted 19 September 2016 - 02:31 PM

Hello Everyone,

I'm not sure if this has been posted before but whilst doing further research this evening I came across this petition.

James Moore has a wonderful vision and is trying to achieve the following...

We want the Pharmaceutical manufacturers to produce “drug tapering kits” which provide the most commonly prescribed medications in decreasing doses over a period of time.
We need tapering kits to help the millions of users of psychoactive pharmaceutical drugs because:
Many tablets are only available in increments that are so large that they are useless for gradual lowering (tapering) of the dose.
Liquid forms for some medications are available but tend to be hugely expensive and therefore the NHS will not provide them.
Pill cutting is, at best, a hit and miss affair.
Many doctors and psychiatrists confuse the symptoms of withdrawal with a return of the symptoms that the tablet was originally prescribed for.
These kits would save a significant amount of time for General Practitioners, Psychiatrists and Community Mental Health teams.
These kits would help users of psychiatric medications stop taking them safely and in a controlled fashion, giving them control over their drug intake.
The pharmaceutical companies are already set up to manufacture massive quantities of these drugs, therefore it cannot be a huge additional cost to manufacture tablets of decreasing dosages. At most this is likely to be a tiny fraction of a percentage of profit but would win a huge amount of public confidence that the Pharmaceutical firms have their customers safety at heart.

He has initiated a petition for the Secretary of State for Health, Jeremy Hunt, which I feel we all should sign. It's too late for many of us but I know you'll all agree with me that such support and guidance would have made tapering and withdrawal a easier journey. If it helps one person to not experience the hell I've been through it's worth it!

Please sign and read more here...

https://www.change.o...rugs?lang=en-GB
You can hear my story on the Let's Talk Withdrawal podcast. Its a global weekly podcast created by James Moore that interviews experts and others suffering from the awful effects of psychiatric medication. Here's how to listen...

If you have an iPhone, iPad or PC/Mac with iTunes, this link will take you to the iTunes Store where you can subscribe so each new episode will download automatically...
https://goo.gl/Yz7Zmp
Or you can also listen and download each episode here on any device...
http://jfmoore.libsyn.com/

Started AD aged 14 (1997)
Stopped AD Escitralopram aged 33 (May 14th 2016) weaned down from 20mg to 1mg
10 months SSRI free since May 2016

#14 CJAJ16

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Posted 20 September 2016 - 09:55 AM

Hi James
Admin moved my above post into this thread. I came across your website last and excitedly posted the above in a new thread, not realising you were here and had started one already.

I just want to thank you for all you're doing, I think you're ideas are wonderful and I pray you get all the signatures you need to take this all the way. It is too late for me but this could be life changing for so many!
I've sent the link to everyone I can. Thank you again! 😊
You can hear my story on the Let's Talk Withdrawal podcast. Its a global weekly podcast created by James Moore that interviews experts and others suffering from the awful effects of psychiatric medication. Here's how to listen...

If you have an iPhone, iPad or PC/Mac with iTunes, this link will take you to the iTunes Store where you can subscribe so each new episode will download automatically...
https://goo.gl/Yz7Zmp
Or you can also listen and download each episode here on any device...
http://jfmoore.libsyn.com/

Started AD aged 14 (1997)
Stopped AD Escitralopram aged 33 (May 14th 2016) weaned down from 20mg to 1mg
10 months SSRI free since May 2016

#15 Vigor

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Posted 20 September 2016 - 11:35 AM

Hey James,

 

I am sorry for the situation you are in, just understand you are in good company here. I signed your petition. I hope this goes through - not only could it help you - but countless others. This is something that should have been in development decades ago. 


Paxil 20-30mgs since 2004.

Three previous withdrawal attempts 2008,2012 and 2015 all cold turkey.

Reinstated 10mg February 20th 2016

3/20/16-9mg 4/5/16-8mg 5/5/16-7mg 5/25/16-6mg 6/25/16-5mg 8/7/16-updose to 6mg 9/7/16 5.5mg 10/10/16-5mg 11/10/16-4.5mg

One thing that helps me is to see your withdrawal process as your own personal journey. Do not internalize someone else's withdrawal as your own. 

  

"I did then what I knew how to do. Now that I know better, I do better."  - Maya Angelou


#16 JamesMoore

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 11:06 AM

Hi all, I just wanted to say thank you for your support and feedback so far and also for signing the petition. Also I wanted to update you progress so far. The petition is doing well and I've had support from Dr. Chris van Tulleken (the doctor who gave up drugs) as well as Dr. Ben Goldacre and Beverley Callard. Interestingly a number of psychiatrists and doctors have also signed and I have had really good feedback from a number of mental health professionals.

My next step is to start to raise awareness of this issue with Government and I already have a few contacts that I am making use of.

There are a couple of excellent facebook groups that I wanted to recommend that you look at, there are lots of like minded people on these groups who are keen to share their stories. Both these groups are closed so you would have to ask the admin to join but it's well worth it. I am sure that some of you are already members but if not, please consider joining.

https://www.facebook.../?ref=bookmarks

https://www.facebook.../?ref=bookmarks

Lastly, I have been updating my own website to include more information, if you get the chance, I'd love to get some feedback as the most important comments come from those who,have experienced these issues first hand.

Www.jfmoore.co.uk

So, sorry for the rambling, but thanks to all of you for taking the time to contribute to the petition.

All the best

James

#17 JamesMoore

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 11:08 AM

@CJAJ16 I don't feel worthy of such high praise but thank you so much, your feedback adds to my resolve to get something done for all those suffering in silence.

#18 nz11

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 11:24 AM

 This is something that should have been in development decades ago. 

Exactly.

Thanks again James you are an inspiration and definitely praise worthy.


2000 amitryptaline, nortriptaline venlafaxine clonazepam for  arm pain from keyboard use, told I had a chemical imbalance it would fix my arm was just a matter of finding the right med for me not informed of the nature of these drugs assured safe and not addictive, CT off Effexor after being told to double the dose on reporting adverse effects...later ..uncharacteristic psych panic tearful presented to doctor to get answers. Given paroxetine no questions asked 'safe and not addictive' next please.2001-2010 paroxetine (paxil) 2 failed attempts to quit, a learned helplessness set in. Feb 10 - Sept 10,  8 month clueless taper, hell. Doc said I had underlying depression .. I said that's not right' then found online support group and the truth!...overcome with inconceivable humiliation and outrage. 28 Sept 10 drug free ...  daily psych and emotional torture beginning in the waking hours of the morning receding somewhat in the evening only to start up again the next day. 28 Sept 12 (24 months) Stabilizing  (What an indescribable unimaginable non-functional nightmare). sleep issues start up at 3 yrs  waking daily at 2am -4.30am), April 2016 return to sport for the first time since drug free, Sept 16 return to work on casual basis.  28 Sept 16 (6yrs drug free), still cant sleep with any regularity, pssd continues no sign of improvement, still feel Rip van Winkle-ish, brain fog still improving, psoriasis concerns.

 

"It is unsafe for people who suffer from something that could be treated with an ssri to consult a psychiatrist." Gotzshe 2015. [ I think Gotzsche could have easily meant to say 'to consult anyone with prescribing privileges']. "Going to a psychiatrist is one of the most dangerous actions a person can take." Breggin

 

“Paroxetine is not safe, it is not effective and it meets every known definition of addictive.” McLaren, N, (2016) 'Psychiatry as bullsh*t’ p55..."Psychiatry is stuffed full of 'deep nonsense' better known as bullsh*t." McLaren 2016

 

"Within the first week of when you go on an antidepressant you may have a sexual dysfunction, it can go on forever, often only appearing when you go off the drug ...its extraordinarily common" Healy 2015

 

See  my intro post #451 for the xanax back story and for a CV -GSKs.  Come on guys get taperwise see a TaperMe Schedule

 For a staggeringly shocking 'prozac back story' see the truth post #523

 

"If I were an enemy combatant and the NZ army did this to me someone would be dragged to the Hague and jailed!"  nz11


#19 CJAJ16

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Posted 23 September 2016 - 12:37 PM

@JamesMoore
Thank you for the wonderful update! You're doing a fabulous job and getting the support from such recognised and respected professionals!
At the start of my journey into the hell that is withdrawal I asked "isn't there anything we can do!? Shouldn't more be done to make ppl aware and help sufferers?" And you're pushing forward and answering those questions which is why I feel so inspired and excited by all you're doing!! I check the petition page daily and feel so happy to see that number rising everyday!
I will eagerly follow you every step of this journey and will gladly do anything I can to help.
Thank you again! 😊
You can hear my story on the Let's Talk Withdrawal podcast. Its a global weekly podcast created by James Moore that interviews experts and others suffering from the awful effects of psychiatric medication. Here's how to listen...

If you have an iPhone, iPad or PC/Mac with iTunes, this link will take you to the iTunes Store where you can subscribe so each new episode will download automatically...
https://goo.gl/Yz7Zmp
Or you can also listen and download each episode here on any device...
http://jfmoore.libsyn.com/

Started AD aged 14 (1997)
Stopped AD Escitralopram aged 33 (May 14th 2016) weaned down from 20mg to 1mg
10 months SSRI free since May 2016

#20 JamesMoore

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Posted 26 September 2016 - 12:13 AM

Hello all, thank you again so much for the feedback and for promoting the petition, its making a real difference and we are nearly at 950 signatures as I write.

 

I wanted to let you know that I now have some overall aims for the campaign to try and better explain to others what we are trying to do, briefly there are:

1. Raise awareness of the difficulties users face when they want to stop taking psychoactive drugs.

2. Encourage and support conversations between users, mental health professionals and policy-makers around this issue.
3. Promote the idea of drug tapering kits and to encourage Pharmaceutical manufacturers to better support the users of their products.

 

Please continue to share the petition or my website among your family, friends and co-workers, even if others are not directly affected they probably know someone who is. If you have any ideas for further promotion then please do let me know.

 

Also, there is another initiative which is well worth supporting, the Council for Evidence based Psychiatry (CEP) are asking people to write to their local MPs to raise the issue of dependence on prescription drugs. If this is something that you would like to do the following link will give you all the details...

 

http://cepuk.org/201...rug-dependence/

 

Thanks for your time.

 

James



#21 JamesMoore

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Posted 15 October 2016 - 10:44 AM

Hi all, I have some exciting (and slightly terrifying!) news. The Victoria Derbyshire programme are shortly going to run an item looking at the experiences that people have taking antidepressants, including the difficulties some users have when attempting to stop. As part of this, all being well, I will have a short live interview about my petition.

This is such a great opportunity to gain some much needed awareness of the struggles that so many have using these drugs. If you can find the time please watch and, even better, contact the show to share your experiences. We need to demonstrate how many are suffering in silence, unable to get the help they need, this will make a huge difference and a real impact. Let’s light up their Twitter feed like a Christmas tree!

The broadcast details are:
- The Victoria Derbyshire show
- BBC 2 and BBC news channel
- Wednesday 19 October
- 0900 to 1100

Contact details:
- Twitter @VictoriaLIVE
- Facebook: http://www.facebook....toriaDerbyshire
- Email: victoria@bbc.co.uk
- SMS: 61124
- WhatsApp: 07753 428 430

Thanks so much for all the support.

James

#22 Terry4949

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Posted 18 October 2016 - 10:39 AM

Well done James , I am going to try and contact the show to share my hell with a/d withdrawel , as untill the people responsible are educated in this matter the more people are going to suffer , I have just spent 4 weeks in a mental health hospital and I saw 3 doctors while I was in there and they all said that it was nonsense and that I was depressed and need medication and long term withdrawel is not possible , and that it is the depression returning , something has to change , I like you am struggling to withdraw from mirtazapine and for me I have been worse while on it , let's hope somebody actually takes notice
100mg Effexor 2000 untill jan 2015 severe withdrawals . Tapered 4weeks.
Jan to end of Feb 4 weeks on 15mg mirtazapine 20mg quetiapine , tapered of both 2 weeks , severe withdrawals , still some from Effexor possibly
End of Feb 2015 to end of July 30mg citolapram tapered 2weeks severe withdrawal , anxiety high , bouts of sever depression , severe emotional moods
Currently on 30mg mirtazapine appx 5 months , high anxiety, March cut dose 22.5 mg going on to liquid still no improvements with the depression , also started sept 2015 200mg pregabalin , currently on 22.5mg mirtazapine tablet form doing really badly. Cut beginning of May remeron 20mg still bad anxiety,August 15mg remeron ,100mg pregablin , severe depression headaches anxiety , oct 2016 doctor stoped pregablin c/t , 15mg mirtazapine still no let up in physical symptoms ,high anxiety ,Nov 2016 remeron 13.5 mg , Jan 2017 mirtazapine stopped flouxetine20mg added by hospital admission, no choice , doing really badly , akathesia suicidel ,, Flouxetine c/t by hospital after 7 weeks 20mg daily , currently on nothing , God help me

#23 JamesMoore

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Posted 18 October 2016 - 10:51 AM

Hi Terry, thanks so much for your reply and I'm so sorry that things recently have been so difficult for you. If you did feel up to sharing your experiences it would really help others. It is brave to be so open about it. Tomorrow is a real chance to make a difference and get the matter some much needed airtime. I'd be lying if I said I wasn't bricking it about being on live TV though! I honestly can't help feeling that chemistry and statistics have taken much of the compassion out of mental health. Hopefully we can start to change things for the future, first steps and all that. My very best wishes to you and I'm sure that things will start to improve. Cheers.

#24 anongrl5590

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Posted 04 January 2017 - 10:45 AM

I have signed the petition. I pray that this gets out and that big pharma will take action to create these kits. It's so sad to not have any real professional info on what to do when tapering off and having to rely on ourselves.

My medication -- Prozac
August 2015: Started on 10mg/day
September 2015 to May 2016: Increased to 20mg/day
May 2016: Abruptly stopped 20mg for 2 weeks (withdrawal symtoms arose but assumed it was worsened depression)
June 2016 to August 2016: increased to 40mg (my body reacted very badly to this dose)
August 2016: decreased back to 20mg
September 2016: tapered off 10mg this month alone
September 30, 2016: last day of Prozac
October 2016: month long window
November 2016-Present: WD symptoms (too many physical sxs and some mental sxs)
February 5-20, 2017: Reinstated at 1-2mg // February 21, 2017: Back to no meds

 


#25 JamesMoore

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Posted 11 February 2017 - 02:08 AM

HI everyone, I wanted to let you know that BBC Radio 5 live are broadcasting a programme on antidepressants on Sunday 12 February from 1100 to 1200. I am interviewed as part of the program. If you could listen in that would be great, if you felt like making contact with the show to share your experiences that would be even better.

Here's a link to the programmes web page:
http://www.bbc.co.uk...rammes/b08dnpkn

Contact details are:
Phone 0500 909 693
SMS 85058
Email: 5liveinvestigates@bbc.co.uk
Facebook: www.facebook.com/5live
Twiter: @BBC5live

Thank you and my best wishes to anyone struggling with antidepressants.

James



#26 scallywag

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 11:57 AM

This is a cross-post about taper kits in the Netherlands. In Feb. 2017, Airwave, a new member from The Netherlands, posted a photo of the taper options available for venlafaxine (Effexor):

... I've recently moved houses so most information is scattered around the place, but i'll try my best to find some of the documents.

At the very least, here is a screenshot of the options i had available for tapering(The one checked here is the one i actually used):

w6lha02d6rlu4ui6g.jpg

some quick translation:
dag = day,
dagen = days,
duur afbouw traject = duration of total tapering program in days.

Link to Airwave's Intro topic


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results
Cymbalta (brand name), 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 20 mg to 7 mg in 2016, exact doses and dates in this post;
2017: 6.3 (58 beads) Feb. 1; 5.6 mg (52) Feb. 22; 5.4 mg (50) Mar. 15; 5.1 mg (47) Mar. 25; 4.9 mg (45) Apr. 5; 4.5 mg (42) Apr. 14;
Current dose: 3.5 mg (32) 2017-Apr-26
+ Supplements: fish oil (1500 mg EPA/500 mg DHA), Vitamins: D3, K2, C; Minerals: Mg, Se, Cr, I, V
scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet


#27 JamesMoore

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Posted 04 April 2017 - 12:22 AM

Hi all

 

Thanks so much for the responses here. I just wanted to add what I know, I have been contacted by Dr. Peter Groot who works at the Maastricht University Medical Centre, Department of Psychiatry and Psychology. Dr. Groot and his colleagues have put a lot of effort into a product called Tapering strips which are, essentially, a graduated reduction method of stopping antidepressants. They are in trial stage and, at this point, I believe only available in the Netherlands, however, this is a significant development and shows that a graduated dosage reduction method is possible and can be produced. This solution probably won't work for everything, for one thing the reactions are generally over 28 days which may well be too fast for some. However, progress is being made.

 

​Most of the information on tapering strips is in Dutch at present although Dr. Groot tell me that they are working on English translations. This paper is in English and explains the concept.

 

http://www.cinderell...2013_Engels.pdf

 

Thanks

 

James



#28 JamesMoore

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Posted 04 April 2017 - 02:39 AM

Can anyone advise how I edit a post, made a couple of typos above but don't know how to change them?

 

Thanks



#29 scallywag

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Posted 04 April 2017 - 02:51 AM

James - members can only edit within 60 minutes of first submitting a post.


This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results
Cymbalta (brand name), 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 20 mg to 7 mg in 2016, exact doses and dates in this post;
2017: 6.3 (58 beads) Feb. 1; 5.6 mg (52) Feb. 22; 5.4 mg (50) Mar. 15; 5.1 mg (47) Mar. 25; 4.9 mg (45) Apr. 5; 4.5 mg (42) Apr. 14;
Current dose: 3.5 mg (32) 2017-Apr-26
+ Supplements: fish oil (1500 mg EPA/500 mg DHA), Vitamins: D3, K2, C; Minerals: Mg, Se, Cr, I, V
scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet


#30 JamesMoore

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Posted 04 April 2017 - 02:55 AM

Ok thanks Scallywag, in which case, what I needed to say in the above post was....

 

This solution probably won't work for everyone, for one thing the reductions are generally over 28 days which may well be too fast for some. However, progress is being made.

 

​Most of the information on tapering strips is in Dutch at present although Dr. Groot tells me that they are working on English translations. This paper is in English and explains the concept.

 

http://www.cinderell...2013_Engels.pdf



#31 JamesMoore

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Posted 08 April 2017 - 01:40 AM

For anyone interested, I was recently interviewed for The Anxiety Podcast by Tim JP Collins, I talked to Tim about Anxiety and the impact it had on my life, the overuse of medications for depression and anxiety, my problems with withdrawal and also my petition and the new podcast too.

 

If you felt like listening in, the interview is here...

 

http://www.timjpcoll...cast/jamesmoore

 

Thanks so much.



#32 nz11

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Posted 08 April 2017 - 05:42 PM

James i just received the latest change.org email update.

I have to say i am blown away with what you are accomplishing what a tremendous voice you are and what brilliant ideas you have.

Ive already said it but i thankyou again so much for what you have done in this very short time already its putting a massive smile on my face.

I really liked this:

 

ivtycEraAORdqZq-800x450-noPad.jpg?149164


2000 amitryptaline, nortriptaline venlafaxine clonazepam for  arm pain from keyboard use, told I had a chemical imbalance it would fix my arm was just a matter of finding the right med for me not informed of the nature of these drugs assured safe and not addictive, CT off Effexor after being told to double the dose on reporting adverse effects...later ..uncharacteristic psych panic tearful presented to doctor to get answers. Given paroxetine no questions asked 'safe and not addictive' next please.2001-2010 paroxetine (paxil) 2 failed attempts to quit, a learned helplessness set in. Feb 10 - Sept 10,  8 month clueless taper, hell. Doc said I had underlying depression .. I said that's not right' then found online support group and the truth!...overcome with inconceivable humiliation and outrage. 28 Sept 10 drug free ...  daily psych and emotional torture beginning in the waking hours of the morning receding somewhat in the evening only to start up again the next day. 28 Sept 12 (24 months) Stabilizing  (What an indescribable unimaginable non-functional nightmare). sleep issues start up at 3 yrs  waking daily at 2am -4.30am), April 2016 return to sport for the first time since drug free, Sept 16 return to work on casual basis.  28 Sept 16 (6yrs drug free), still cant sleep with any regularity, pssd continues no sign of improvement, still feel Rip van Winkle-ish, brain fog still improving, psoriasis concerns.

 

"It is unsafe for people who suffer from something that could be treated with an ssri to consult a psychiatrist." Gotzshe 2015. [ I think Gotzsche could have easily meant to say 'to consult anyone with prescribing privileges']. "Going to a psychiatrist is one of the most dangerous actions a person can take." Breggin

 

“Paroxetine is not safe, it is not effective and it meets every known definition of addictive.” McLaren, N, (2016) 'Psychiatry as bullsh*t’ p55..."Psychiatry is stuffed full of 'deep nonsense' better known as bullsh*t." McLaren 2016

 

"Within the first week of when you go on an antidepressant you may have a sexual dysfunction, it can go on forever, often only appearing when you go off the drug ...its extraordinarily common" Healy 2015

 

See  my intro post #451 for the xanax back story and for a CV -GSKs.  Come on guys get taperwise see a TaperMe Schedule

 For a staggeringly shocking 'prozac back story' see the truth post #523

 

"If I were an enemy combatant and the NZ army did this to me someone would be dragged to the Hague and jailed!"  nz11


#33 JamesMoore

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 07:59 AM

Hi there NZ11, thank you so much for your feedback, I'm so pleased that people are getting into the podcast, it really is a subject that needs much more attention. I have already interviewed some great guests, both experts and users too and I'm looking forward to sharing their stories and experience with you. Hearing from you and others really makes doing the podcast worthwhile, thank you so much.

 

For anyone that wants a taster of the podcast, there are some clips here:

 

https://soundcloud.c...-from-lets-talk



#34 keepinghope

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Posted 12 April 2017 - 12:08 AM

Hi James, I signed your petition, and have listened to some of the podcasts you've put together. I really admire the campaign and your drive with it. 

But I can't ever see the drug companies doing this. Maybe the NHS, but with the current state of that, it's probably not likely, more likely is them starting a helpline for people addicted to prescription drugs. Hopefully manned by more helpful staff than the bloke who answered the phone at Samaritans and told me I should go for a jog. 

 

I'm fast losing the hope that it's even possible to come off these drugs and recover anywhere near your 'normal' level of being, pre-drug. I was hopeful when I started out (hence the username) but after seeing people suffering even after long tapers, people years and years out from their last dose and still struggling, what good, ultimately, will taper kits do? It needs to be known how harmful they are, that the drug companies are literally poisoning us with chemical lobotomies. That you're more likely to kill someone (yourself or others) when either starting or going off these drugs. That they damage lives in an indescribable way. 

I want to burn whatever monstrous lab these drugs come from to the ground. I'm so angry at what an SSRI has done to me, at the people I've hurt and am still hurting and the time I've wasted not caring about anything at all. Maybe we all get to this point somewhere in our withdrawal. I feel deceived and like I should have 'mug' stamped on my forehead, that I didn't in my wildest dreams think that people who take an oath to help other people could dole out such harm instead. 

 

I'm so sorry to be so negative on a really great thing that you are doing, but when doctors won't even admit that withdrawal exists past a couple of weeks, and even the dutch trial tapering advice is only a max of 5 months (admittedly a lot better than the 5 weeks my GP gave me to come off a drug I'd been on for 13 years) people will still be crashing a few weeks or months after the last dose, and doctors will still be saying it's their symptoms coming back, because they know nothing about withdrawal, because the drug companies lie and cover up, and the drug companies know full well what these drugs do. I don't want to believe that GPs are 'in on it' but how can they not be after seeing patient after patient coming in and saying they need to go back on their tablets again? Anecdotal evidence is sometimes the strongest of all, but it's not seen as evidence at all by 'science'. Even 'scientific' evidence like that put forward by Robert Whittaker and the few psychiatrists or CEP UK speaking out against this nightmare is whitewashed, stonewalled, like they're all talking in a void. Don't doctors read?! Or are they brainwashed/paid into acquiescence by the drug companies, or is the government in on it too? There must be a lot of very powerful, influential people with money invested in drug companies. 

 

I'm just so angry at it all. I truly hope (I must still have some left!) that your petition gets the attention it deserves and things start to change, I really do. 


2002 - Prescribed fluoxetine 20mg for mild situational depression and anxiety. Over the years also briefly swapped about on citalopram, sertraline and venlafaxine during poop out. 2012 - Cold turkeyed fluoxetine. Within 3 months was suffering from aggression, anxiety, panic attacks and paranoia. GP put me back on tablets as I was 'relapsing'. I didn't know anything about WD then. Jul 15 - Wanted to quit fluoxetine again so tapered off (skipping doses) over 6 weeks under advice of GP. Aug 15 - Last fluoxetine dose end of August 2015. Dec 15 - Had my first real crash after discontinuing. Found this site. Aug-Dec 16 - Signed off work because of a herniated disc & severe sciatica. Prescribed diazepam (took for 6 days and got WD symptoms on stopping; nausea, morning cortisol spikes, anxiety, anger) and codeine which I was on for 4 mths. Can confirm - opiate WD is nasty but nowhere near as bad or prolonged as SSRI WD!
Withdrawal symptoms have included: extreme anger and irritability, lethargy, depression and weepiness, anxiety, stomach upsets, loss of appetite, excessive sweating, muscle and back pain, insomnia, cortisol surges, akathisia, inability to cope with stress.
Things that help: herbal tinctures (rose, lemon balm, chamomile and skullcap), seaweed baths & epsom salt baths, fish oil and magnesium.


#35 JamesMoore

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Posted 12 April 2017 - 01:49 AM

Hi there keepinghope, I do appreciate you taking the time to feed back and I completely understand your frustrations and the anger you feel at the harm caused. You are right, there are many that are permanently damaged by ssris/benzos/opoids and other drugs but equally, there are many that, with the proper tapering support, could come out unscathed from this. We need to represent the whole community as best we can. The podcast and the petition have their place in raising awareness but I've never pretended that they were a solution or that they would change anything on their own. I am all too aware of my limited abilities in this regard but they do have a place in raising awareness of damage and harm. You have every right to feel as you do and every right to take action that you feel is appropriate.

 

We also have to realise that many of these campaigns won't benefit us but will benefit people in the future. There is change in this but the wheels turn very slowly. There is room in this campaign for those that want the damage recognised and for those who want help for the future, we all come at this from slightly different angles and different places. As for the doctors, most are so frightened of being sued that they won't engage with anything that admits harm, not just for antidepressants but other drugs too. It's a difficult situation to challenge, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

 

It's not a direct comparison of course, but there are many that are permanently damaged from drinking and from smoking, and many fatalities too. For years the alcohol and tobacco manufacturers fought any kind of limitation to their actives and refused to help pay for treatment/rehabilitation and support. They now fund rehabilitation schemes like AA, their advertising is restricted and their products are seen much more now as harmful, none of that would have happened without people speaking out, sharing their experiences and demanding something was done. I don't expect Pharma to do this voluntarily, but I expect that, one day, legislation will compel them to act. Unfortunately I cannot say when this will be. I feel a need to try and do something, if I really thought about the futility of it then I wouldn't bother, at the very least, the people I have interviewed have told me that just sharing their stories has helped them. At this stage, that's good enough for me.

 

I am so sorry to hear of you experiences. I do hope that you continue to listen to the podcast but I understand if it just makes you more angry and frustrated, that certainly was not the intention when putting it together. My very best wishes to you and thank you so much for sharing your views with me, it means a great deal.



#36 Cherry47

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Posted 12 April 2017 - 08:13 PM

Keepinghope, I couldn't agree with you more! There must be a way to get the medical profession to sit up and take notice!
Chronic Fatigue Syndrome for 32 years, given AD for this condition alone in 2000
Zoloft 100mg for 15 years, last five of these complained about adverse effects,
unable to tolerate other meds even supplements
Slowly felt sicker, advised by different Dr maybe on ads for too long
Cut back 100 - 50 over 6 months, still getting worse, so stopped over about 6 weeks starting Dec 2014
First month, slow, emotional, useless then POW! Horrendous withdrawal symptoms, completely non-functional
for about five months, slowly started to come back to life and continue with waves and windows, still more bad than good, but bads are less bad, and goods slightly better each time