BuddhaMama: Intro

[BuddhaMama]

Hello everyone,

 

I am a longtime lurker, only first posting now as I get ready to begin my taper from Remeron (Mirtazipine). I am seeking support here for my taper as I cannot count on support from my doctors. My husband is minimal support as he has his own mental health issues and we have a new baby. 

 

I'm ready to come off the Remeron mostly because I don't want to be on it forever and I feel like it got me through the hump of  the early postpartum period, which was what I needed. I have gained 15-20lb on this med which is annoying because I am not one to gain weight normally, so I know it's the drug. I lost all the baby weight within the first month after I delivered and didn't start Remeron until month 2. I feel tired all the time (though it does help me sleep as i take it at night), and it makes me crave sugar and carbs like crazy. I'm also now starting to experience bodyside joint pain, which I've never had before.  That seems to go away somewhat when i eliminate wheat from my diet.

 

I have gotten my doctor to order me a solution of mirtazipine from compounding pharmacy, but after paying $54 fir an Rx that  I usually get for free, I think I will try making my own solution using the tablets and the Oraplus I read about in the forums here.

 

I'm nervous to begin my taper because the first time I tried at the beginning of December I went down by a 1/4 tablet for a week  and every day I had excruciating headaches. BY the end of that week I was experiencing nausea and anxiety. AS SOON as I reinstated my full dose, all symptoms disappeared. I have a feeling I'll need to begin my taper at 5% rather than 10% given how sensitive I am. I would love to hear some encouraging success stories of coming of this drug slowly, as it seems it will take me long rot get off it that I was even on it to begin with.

 

Other relevant info: I am 5 months post partum, have been on Remeron for 4 of those 5 months. I am married and have another child who is nearly 11 years old. I work part time and used to have regular exercise and meditation practices that have both fallen by the wayside with the new baby. I also can no longer tolerate alcohol. I've been off alcohol for several years (not because of AA or addiction issue, but because it makes me feel awful), and recently I thought I would try a half glass of wine with the holidays. Big mistake. Major depression and anxiety the next day. Good riddance.I'd much rather feel well and not drink at all.

 

I think that's it for now!

Edited December 29, 2016 by scallywag
white space at paragraph breaks

[nz11]

bump

Welcome Buddhamama

Thanks to you i have learned something about liquid tapers and syringe measurements.

[Petunia]

Hi BuddhaMama,

 

Thank you for deciding to post and share your story, welcome to SA. You will get a lot of support here as you taper and safely come off your medication.

 

I don't think you need to worry about symptoms now that you know how to taper properly, a 25% reduction is likely to give most people some symptoms, but 10% or the 5% that you are considering will be very different.

 

Look through this thread for success stories, maybe there are some relating to remeron.

[BuddhaMama]

bump

Welcome Buddhamama

Thanks to you i have learned something about liquid tapers and syringe measurements.

 

I'm curious What I help you learn about liquid tapers ad syringe measurements? Maybe I need to go back and read that thread....

[nz11]

lol

well i didnt believe that you could dissolve 12 mg in 1 ml until i looked into and found such a mixture was available and then i discovered further that 1ml syringes have 2 decimal places so being ignorant of this but now enlightened i altered my taper schedule accordingly.

Thanks heaps.

[BuddhaMama]

Originally I posted this in the Tapering forum, but have had zero replies, so I'm trying here.

So when I went to pick up my first batch of liquid Mirtazipine, I asked the pharmacist who the manufacturer was because I am sensitive to the difference in manufacturers for the same drug. He proceeded to tell me that "industry standard" for all pharmaceuticals is somewhere between 10-20% ( I think thats what he said, I can't remember exactly) as far as actual drug concentration goes. So, the 45mg tablets he used to make my liquid suspension could have 10-20% more or less than 45mg each. I am so sensitive that now I wonder how I'll ever start my taper. 

I went from 15mg tablets of one manufacturer taken for the last 5 months to doubling up on 7.5mg tablets of a new manufacturer (Aurobindo) so that I could slowly adjust to that "brand" before moving to the liquid suspension because the liquid was made from Aurobindo tablets at a compounding pharmacy. I just so happened to have these 7.5mg Aurobindo tabs left over from before I upped my dose, otherwise I would have just gone straight to the liquid and dealt with the adjustment.

Anyway, I have been on the new manufacturer for over a week and have been getting on and off intense headaches (my main WD symptom from an earlier taper trial of 25% cuts) and I don't understand why. Could it be that the concentration of these tablets is so different from what I was using that maybe they are causing WD symptoms even though I have't begun to cut my dose? I have 15 days worth left on the Aurobindo (now in a new Rx of 15mg tabs) and then I move to the liquid. I just don't know what's causing these headaches but I am inclined to believe they are withdrawal because they do not respond to ANY of my usual remedies.

Any ideas?? Thanks in advance. Also, please let me know if I need to move this post to a different forum page.

[ChessieCat]

Just to clarify:

 

Previously taking 15mg                      (Brand "A")

 

Last 7+ days taking 2 x 7.5mg           (Brand "B")

 

You have 15 days left of 2 x 7.5mg    (Brand "B")

 

You have new tablets of 15mg           (Brand "B")

 

Do you have any Brand "A" 15mg left?  If yes, you could try halving 15mg tablet and taking 1/2 "A" + 1 x 7.5mg "B".

 

However it could be that the 7.5mg tablets are being absorbed faster than the 15mg tablest (mini version of dose dumping) and then leaving you with a reduction later during the 24 hours period (mini withdrawal period).

 

Might be better to stop taking the 2 x 7.5mg tablets and go straight on to the 15mg Brand "B".

[BuddhaMama]

Just to clarify:

 

Previously taking 15mg                      (Brand "A")

 

Last 7+ days taking 2 x 7.5mg           (Brand "B")

 

You have 15 days left of 2 x 7.5mg    (Brand "B")

 

You have new tablets of 15mg           (Brand "B")

 

Do you have any Brand "A" 15mg left?  If yes, you could try halving 15mg tablet and taking 1/2 "A" + 1 x 7.5mg "B".

 

However it could be that the 7.5mg tablets are being absorbed faster than the 15mg tablest (mini version of dose dumping) and then leaving you with a reduction later during the 24 hours period (mini withdrawal period).

 

Might be better to stop taking the 2 x 7.5mg tablets and go straight on to the 15mg Brand "B".

 

You are correct in your breakdown of my "Brand A" and "Brand B" except that I have 15 days of 15mg Brand B and am now out of Brand B 7.5mg tabs. I've been taking the 15mg tabs for the last 4 nights and I feel A LOT better than when I was on the 7.5's. Can you help me understand what dose dumping is and the "mini withdrawal period"? 

I'm going to start the liquid as soon as I feel stable after my coming menstrual cycle. How do you think I should proceed as far as number of days on the liquid at full dose before beginning my reduction? I read somewhere that it can take up to 4 days for the body to adjust to any changes, but the WD symptoms I was experiencing on the 7.5mg tabs has me concerned that any change I make, however small, will cause symptoms. I guess I didn't think that two 7.5mg tabs was any different than a 15mg tab ( I didn't realize they are absorbed differently-maybe you could help me understand that concept too?)

Thanks!

[ChessieCat]

Dose dumping is when you get more of the dose early in the 24 hour period and then have less in your system (than you had been when taking the 15mg) later in the 24 hour period.  So basically it is not having a consistent dose in the blood stream.

 

I didn't know for sure if the 2 x 7.5mg was being absorbed more quickly but was thinking about when you dissolve something (I'm taking gastrolyte electrolyte replacement at the moment because of our hot, humid weather).  A whole tablet takes longer to dissolve then if you break it into pieces.

 

When it comes to tapering, there are a few things that you need to do.  Firstly throw out the calendar.  Patience is necessary.  Listen to your body.  It is the best way to measure how things are proceeding.  It is a good idea to Keep Notes on Paper and to Rate Symptoms Daily to Check Patterns and Progress.  Doing this may help you to see improvements which you can't feel.

 

Also, there is the Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization to take into consideration.  If at any time you are unsure if you should do your next drop, then in most instances it is better to hold longer than to drop too soon and have to updose.  Here are a couple of discussions:  Stabilising After a Reduction - What Does That Mean? and Withdrawal Normal Description

[BuddhaMama]

 

 

Also, there is the Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilization to take into consideration.  If at any time you are unsure if you should do your next drop, then in most instances it is better to hold longer than to drop too soon and have to updose.  

 

I have four days left of "Brand B" 15mg tabs. I am incredibly anxious about starting the liquid (even at full dose, also Brand b ) based on what I experienced using the two 7.5mg tabs (withdrawal headaches almost every day). I feel like I should have some kind of plan in place for what to do if I am experiencing WD symptoms on the liquid, but I'm not sure what to do. Should I slowly do half tablet/half liquid for a while? I'm worried this too will cause WD symptoms. I'm also wondering if I should be using the nail file method instead of liquid since I seem to have an issue with absorption? Feeling really lost right now.

I'm freaking out thinking I'm going to be stuck in something that I can't correct due to insurance not paying for more than one Rx per month.

[BuddhaMama]

Today I am in day 5 on 15mg liquid mirtazipine. I have a pretty intense headache that started around breakfast time and has yet to respond to ibuprofen and one cup of green tea (about the most caffeine I can tolerate). I'm unsure if this is a WD symptom or a hormonal headache as I am mid-cycle and often experience this kind of headache due to rising estrogen. However, if I use an additional dose of progesterone, and the headache still does not resolve, I will know it is WD. Last night I had a mild blip of anxiety, my first in weeks. It passed and I was able to move on with my evening.

 

I'm confused and bummed out. Originally I thought it would only take a few months to come off this drug, but now It seems like it could take several YEARS. I have only been on it for 6 months! But if I'm experiencing WD simply from switching tablets to liquid and haven't even begun decreases, I can't imagine I will respond well to even 2.5% drops.

 

Because of the 1ml syringe I'm using, I decided that one tick mark on the syringe was easier to do as a first drop because trying to find a place between two tick marks was not going to be accurate. One tick mark = 2% rather than 2.5%. This is equivelant to 0.3mg.

 

I guess I just have to stay holding on the full dose until I feel like it's safe to take that first cut. I'm wondering if I should slightly increase my dose of  the liquid to see if it helps with WD symptoms? If so, how much should I increase? The pharmacist I spoke to suggested increasing by .1ml, which would = 1.5mg. Is it possible  that the difference in liquid vs. tablet is enough that it could cause WD? Intense headaches are so far my worst WD symptom and I was having headaches like this when I did my first taper of 25% decreases. 

 

Confused. Not sure how to proceed.

[ChessieCat]

From Post #4 in tablets-or-liquid-in-withdrawal:

 

"People have trouble switching from tablets to liquid, or brand-name to generics, because of very small differences in formulation and absorbability. A liquid may be absorbed faster. But many people do not have difficulty with these switches."

 

My suggestion would be to stay at the same dose and not increase.  Especially because it may be caused by being mid-cycle and not the change to liquid.

[BuddhaMama]

I officially started my taper last night with a 2% cut. I figured out that each tick mark on my syringe is 2% at least roughly that until I get to about half my dose, at which point I will probably ask for a new mg per ml Rx from my doctor. So far I feel fine, but I know it takes several days to adjust to any dose changes. Im nervous to do the BrassMonkey slide method until I am stable at this first cut so I might give it two full weeks to see how I feel before even thinking about dropping more. I really hope I can achieve a low symptom taper, even if it takes me a year and a half.

[brassmonkey]

Listening to your body is a major key to a successful taper.  Schedules and calendars are good tools, but how you react is the driving factor.  The first taper is always a step into the unknown as to how your body will take it.  Roll with what ever happens and learn what you can.  That will make the next taper more understandable.

 

(((((((((((((HUGS)))))))))))

 

Brass

[BuddhaMama]

Just an update.

I'm on Day 5 of my 6th dose decrease. My symptom pattern is not totally predictable, but I do notice that I have a "window" of feeling GREAT about two days after I do a dose decrease. Almost high feeling. I still get lots of headaches, but they don't seem to have any rhyme or reason to them- I have no idea when to expect them. Sometimes they last 4 hours, sometimes they last all day. They almost always don't respond to large doses of ibuprofen or tylenol. 

I started taking a supplement called quercetin which *may* help with the histamine intolerance that comes when withdrawing from mirtazipine. I was hoping it would help with the headaches, but so far it has not.

I'm still pretty bummed every day about having to go through this, but I know that if I went faster/steeper than I'm going, I would regret it big time.

I'm not holding any of my decreases any longer than a week. So, I'm decreasing 2% every week. When I started, I held my first decrease for two weeks and my symptoms never got that bad, nor did they really improve, so I figured I would just continue with 2% every week.

[BuddhaMama]

Update:

I'm down to 10.8mg, which is 2.7% from my last dose of 11.1mg. I'm noticing that my withdrawal symptoms are changing as the percentage of my decreases increase slightly as I am simply cutting by tick marks on my 1ml syringe (because it's easier).

Initially when I started this drug back in Aug 2016, I gained about 20lb. I was breastfeeding at the time. As soon as I stopped breastfeeding (when my baby was 8 months old), I gained ANOTHER 20lbs, in what felt like just a few days. I've since resumed exercising and watching my food intake, and it's not budging AT ALL. If anything, I feel like I'm getting fatter. 

I'm starting to think that my withdrawal symptoms are mirroring the drugs regular side effects (some of which I didn't have until I started to withdraw.

 

My list of symptoms:

 

• Headaches (although these have been reduced thanks to the introduction on a supplement called Quercetin, which a fellow withdrawee told me about)
• Stinging/burning sensations on my skin (usually in one small spot, like on my elbow)
• Body-wide joint pain and swelling (this is new and originally I attributed it to the weight gain, but in re-reading the list of side effects, it's on there)
• Back pain
• Rage (usually the day after a dose cut-this is relatively new. I SCREAMED at my 11 year old daughter over something trivial and I found it very hard to stop myself)
• Stomach aches
• Digestive changes (I used to be almost chronically constipated, now I'm almost the opposite)
• Tiredness (this has been with me from the beginning, only now I find it very hard to wake up-I know that mirtazipine is more sedating at lower doses, I just didn't think I'd notice until I was at a much lower dose)
• Vision disturbances (a cloudy/gluey feeling that I'm certain is not seasonal allergies. This was one of my first side effects when I started the drug-it had gone away and is back now)

 

I just met with my doctor to discuss changing the concentration of my prescription so that the percentage of my decreases doesn't get super high as I go lower. 

It looks like my cuts will reach about 5% around 6mg. As of right now, the way my symptoms are changing is kind of scary. I can't imagine what my "rage" will look like when I do a dose decrease that's almost twice what it is now. I haven't been holding at all, I've simply been cutting one tick mark every week. This has been pretty manageable. I suppose I'll hold when I it becomes more intense. Naturally, I hate this weight and joint pain so much that I'm desperate for this to not take more than a year to complete. I know that's not the way to go about this, but honestly I'm so uncomfortable. I can't even do yoga without my huge stomach getting in the way. It's worse than being 9 months pregnant. I actually weigh 15lb more than I did at full term with my son 11 months ago. This drug is so awful.

I guess I'd rather weight gain than psychological symptoms like anxiety and depression. Although, the irritability is pretty significant. At least for a day or so. Yesterday was the day I screamed at my daughter. That afternoon I had an acupuncture treatment and I told my practitioner that I needed help with mood. Today, I honestly feel 100% better in the rage department. So, maybe I need to keep up the acupuncture while I'm in withdrawal.

That's all for now.  

 

[brassmonkey]

Hi BuddhaMama--  It's nice to see that your taper is going smoothly.  You'll be breaking below 10mg soon, well done.  As you've noticed, doing a liner taper causes the percentage of decrease to rise with each drop.  This can start to cause trouble as you get into the smaller doses.  Easiest thin I can see would be to go the your pharmacist and get a different syringe.  They make a variety of different sizes.  Then you would have finer control over your dose.

 

If you haven't read the thread on Dealing with Emotional Spirals Dealing With Emotional Spirals then I think it would be a good idea.  Spontaneous rages frequently have a very strong Spiral component when you look for it.  Learning to spot the triggers and progressions can be really helpful in controlling the outbreaks.

 

Brassmonkey

[BuddhaMama]

Just an update.

Last week I did a 4% cut, which took me down to 9mg. Up until then I had been doing 2% cuts that were progressively getting closer to 3% as my concentration increased. I thought 1% more wouldn't be a big deal, but it really did up my symptoms. I decided to hold at this dose until I felt more stable. 

I'm wondering if it's normal (or rather if anyone else has experienced this) that my withdrawal symptoms seem to all be on the list of side effects of mirtazipine. It's as if I'm experiencing the drugs side effects more and more as I withdraw. For example, nightmares. I have had way more recently than ever before. My daytime tired ness is also getting worse, as is my nausea and joint pain/stiffness. 

Lat night I also had my first sleepless night on this drug. I know that normally its sedating quality increases as the dose decreases, and I have been feeling more tired lately, but I couldn't sleep at all last night. It sucked.

Still, this is a pretty low symptom taper, so I should be thankful. And I am.

[scallywag]

BuddhaMama - At lower doses, mirtazapine no longer affects serotonin receptors and acts primarily as a histamine inhibitor, a function it has performed all the way along. Typically that is thought to occur at 7.5 mg but individual situations vary.  The symptoms of nightmares and nausea leads me to think that your CNS (central nervous system) is doing some significant recovery work on its serotonin receptors. 

 

Holding at current dose until these symptoms settle down is almost always a good choice.

[BuddhaMama]

acknowledgingAnother update:

I've been getting increasingly more resentful and angry at this drug ad it's side effects. So much so that I decided to re-name my video blog. I'm not angry in a constant sort of way, just pissed off in general, knowing it will eventually be behind me. Two things that have sort of "thrown me over the edge" in terms of being pissed are the fact that I had to have my wedding rings cut off my finger (the sudden and severe weight gain was causing the rings to dig into my skin and I couldn't get them off), and the fact that I just realized I now have obstructive sleep apnea. At first I thought it was just snoring that was startling me awake, but then last night I woke up unable to draw a full breath and my throat remained tight for several minutes despite moving from my back to my side. I have an appointment to see my doctor about it tomorrow.

I'm down to 8.2mg now, still doing a modified Brassmonkey Slide, dropping by about 2% every week and only holding if I'm having a rough week. 

I'm getting better control of my rages-noticing when I'm triggered and breathing through them, acknowledging what I'm feeling and practicing keeping myself from spiraling into rage.

For the last four months or so, I've been doing Mat Pilates with www.matandkitchen.com and it has been soo good for me. I feel so much stronger, despite still carrying an extra 40lbs. The joint pain and stiffness are still present, making daily life very uncomfortable. Getting up off the floor (which I have to do several times a day because I have a toddler) is pretty difficult and painful. I'm also still experiencing "hot spots" in my elbow and wrist. Those I can totally handle. I can also handle the hot flashes, which are pretty common for me in the d ay or two after a dose decrease. I can tell my metabolism is changing too because I am back to experiencing genuine hunger (and low blood sugar) at regular intervals throughout the day, as opposed to just being a bottomless pit for food and never feeling hungry nor full but always up for carbs and sweets.  This gives me hope that soon the weight may start to come off. 

Off to bed.

Edited September 16, 2017 by ChessieCat
removed obscenity

[BuddhaMama]

Update.

I'm down to 5mg as of last night! Except I messed up my dilution and accidentally updosed to 7.5mg tonight and last night. Oy. So tomorrow after I talk to the pharmacist, I'll add more water to my solution and then take the dose I should be at, which is 5mg. I really hope that two nights of a higher dose doesn't send me into strong withdrawal when I finally get it right. Lately my decreases have been closer to 3.6 or 3.8% than the usual 2% I had been doing. In addition to my usual hot flashes and irritability, some things I've noticed the last two weeks:

~my knees are hurting again when I go down stairs

~lots more vivid dreaming

~more hot tingly sensations in my wrist

~auditory hallucinations when trying to fall asleep (loud bang)-could this be "brain zaps"? They do have a clapping quality to them.....

~much more daytime fatigue

~much more sedated at bedtime (and more quickly)

 

I'm really curious about how things change at low doses and why we have to go even slower then, I tried reading the tapering to zero thread but I couldn't open the academia article and wasn't able to understand the following discussion in the thread. I *think* what I understood is that the receptor sites in my brain have a relatively high occupancy rate at higher doses and therefor, the decreases are easier to handle, but at lower doses, the brain really starts to "notice" the decreases.

I'm so bummed that the last leg of my taper might last as long as the first two thirds. If the weight would just come off, I would be more than happy to go as slow as I'm supposed to. It's being fat that makes it unbearable. Although, as usual, I must remind myself that being fat is *BETTER* than being in withdrawal hell. Sigh.

[Santino]

BudhaMama...

You can check up my topic. i tapered fully remeron and since 6th of December i am free... anyway the fatigue and lack of motivation were really a problem at the lowest doses. Now i am doing a lot better. There is much hope at tapering. Just stick to the way you re doing it. You seem professional already.

All the best

Santino

 

[BuddhaMama]

Update:

I am on day 7 of severe headaches. It feels a lot like the week I tried to taper with 25% decreases over a year ago. I can’t help wondering if I really screwed up my solution and an actually taking less than 5mg.......which would explain the symptoms. I’m considering updosing tonight to see if it helps. Any advice?

[TikkiTikki]

Hi BuddhaMama,

 

Could be a solution muck-up, could be reaching the lower doses. I know many people have had to go VERY slowly as they get closer to 0.

Could also be the two nights of 7.5mg. You seem pretty sensitive.

 

I'm reading your thread because I'm having a lousy week myself after switching from homemade Celexa solution to a pharmacist suspension (at same dose). Suspect I have accidentally updosed, because I've been very sleepy this week, and also nauseous in the morning. I think I'm just going to stick to the dose and ride it out.

 

I'm not sure what to advise you! Hopefully someone more knowledgeable will happen along...

[BuddhaMama]

Thanks Tikki,

Since  I posted, I consulted with a friend who suggested I to 5.2mg and held at that dose until I ran out of the solution that was messed up, which was about three weeks. Then, when I got my new solution, I diluted it properly and went down to 5.0mg that night. I am now down to 4.7, taking a chance on decreasing by .1mg every four days, since my symptoms seem to be really minimal at this decrease and I feel fine after about 4/5 days. Part of me refuses to believe that I will have to go super slow at the end. Simply because I wasn’t on the drug that long to begin with. The other part is just because I’m stubborn and don’t want to believe that it must get harder. I am fed up with being held hostage in an alien body. I will do what I have to do to keep from feeling awful, but I’m also open to experimenting with doing things differently, just to see.

[Gridley]

How you taper is of course your decision, but I wanted to pass along these two links.

 

This topic explains why we advise going more slowly at the lower doses.  It's a bit technical, but basically the serotonin occupancy is very dose sensitive at lower levels.

 Why taper paper: dose-occupancy curves

 

Please be aware that sometime withdrawal symptoms don't appear immediately after a too-fast taper.

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

 

[ChessieCat]

3 hours ago, Gridley said:

Please be aware that sometime withdrawal symptoms don't appear immediately after a too-fast taper.

Delayed onset of withdrawal symptoms

 

Some members have gone to quickly and had to updose.  Sometimes the updose doesn't work and the member has ended up in an even worse state.

 

Some members here have tried to go too quickly and even though the updose/s has/have worked, if they had followed the 10% every 4 weeks tapering protocol they would have been at a lower dose or off their drug.

 

Patience is necessary when tapering.  It's not a race.  It's better to go slowly and not risk issues than to go too fast and risk making things worse.

 

Post #1 of this topic has some good tips:  Rhi's "Start Small, Listen to Your Body" Taper Plan

[Shebon]

Hi Buddhamama:

 

How is your taper going?  I think you are well down below 3 mg. now?

 

How are you tapering?  I switching over from 15 mg. tablets to 15 mg. Soltab two nites ago.  So far, so good...knocking in wood!!

 

I had been on 3.75 mg. remeron for 5.5 years so I want to get off sooooo bad now.

 

Best regards,

Shebon

[BuddhaMama]

Hi Shebon,

I’m currently at 2.8mg. I had a pretty intense withdrawal day today. High stress response, manic/aimless, feeling overwhelmed and easily triggered into losing my temper. Thankfully I’ve figured out how to really reduce the qty of histamine intolerance headaches I was getting. I can pretty much handle all the symptoms I’ve had so far *except* the headaches (because I’m already a chronic migraine sufferer). 

Mom tapering with a liquid that i have prepared for me at a local compounding pharmacy. 

I’m sorry you’ve been on this devil drug for so long. It is truly one of the worst life decisions I’ve ever made. But, we can only go forward!

you mentioned 15mg soltabs. Are you making a liquid with them and then taking 3.75mg to begin your taper?

I wish you good luck!

[Carmie]

Hi BMama,

 

Im so sorry you’re withdrawals are so bad. I’ve had all those feelings, though I don’t tend to lose my temper. I’m a weird combination of a chilled extrovert. I do get excitable as I like adventures n new experiences but I don’t really feel much anger. When I’m down it’s more sadness than anything. We are all so different. I hope your symptoms subside a bit soon.

 

Feeling overwhelmed is definitely no fun. I hope you are able to find some things to helped you with this feeling. Do u journal or do EFT? I find going in nature helps a bit too. 

 

I was glad to hear that you’re not getting as many headaches. How did u manage to not get so many? Was it an antihistamine diet? 

 

All the best with your continued tapering💚

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Shebon]

Hi Buddamama:

 

I know histamine plays a critical role in withdrawal symptoms.  When I tapered off the benzo 7 years ago, I really had to watch out for high histamine and foods with MSG.  Either would cause a nite/day of symptoms.  So happy you have pinpointed that!!

 

A big congrats on getting to 2.8 mg.  It is a slow process but you are getting there!  

 

I switched over to Soltab remeron after I tried to crush and mix tablet in suspension liquid and then maple syrup.  I would "bomb" on nite 3 after I mixed a batch.  I cut a 15 mg. of Soltab into 1/4 pieces and then add 3.75 ml. water, pop the pill in and let it dissolve.  It dissolves very quickly; then drink it all.  I figure I will stabilize on this first for a full 6 weeks and then drop down to 3.5 mg. , adding 3.5 ml water and drrawiing out with a 3 ml syringe the 3.5 mg. dose.  I plan to reduce by .25 mg. until I get to 2 mg. or so.  

 

How is your taper plan going?  You're lucky you can have it mixed into liquid....much easier to taper from.  I have heard it's more expensive too, but the Soltab is twice what the generic 15 mg. tablet is.  It's worth it though!

 

Take care and hope you do well down to the end of the taper!

Best regards,

Shebon 

[BuddhaMama]

Hi Carmie, 

Today I was able to manage my feelings by asking for help(my 12yo and her two friends), and by drinking some tulsi tea. It calms me down, but I always have to chase it with a ton of water to kick the headache it sometimes gives me. I also did my exercise after the baby went to bed, which always helps disperse icky energy in my body. I have never explored EFT and I haven't journaled in a long time, unless logging symptoms counts as journaling. 

The histamine headaches have subsided significantly. I think its because I eliminated more high-histamine foods from my diet (bananas,spinach) that I used to eat a lot of. Thankfully I can still eat chocolate every day in moderation!

I REALLY hope the rest of this taper does't take more than 6 months. Our family is making a major move to another state next summer and I cannot imagine doing that during withdrawal.

[Carmie]

On 9/3/2018 at 2:03 PM, BuddhaMama said:

Hi Carmie, 

Today I was able to manage my feelings by asking for help(my 12yo and her two friends), and by drinking some tulsi tea. It calms me down, but I always have to chase it with a ton of water to kick the headache it sometimes gives me. I also did my exercise after the baby went to bed, which always helps disperse icky energy in my body. I have never explored EFT and I haven't journaled in a long time, unless logging symptoms counts as journaling. 

The histamine headaches have subsided significantly. I think its because I eliminated more high-histamine foods from my diet (bananas,spinach) that I used to eat a lot of. Thankfully I can still eat chocolate every day in moderation!

I REALLY hope the rest of this taper does't take more than 6 months. Our family is making a major move to another state next summer and I cannot imagine doing that during withdrawal.

 

 Hi Bmama, 

 

im glad to hear that you have been able to manage your emotions a bit. It’s quite a ride, isn’t it? Up, down, up down. It’s great that your histamine headaches have subsided a bit too. 

 

Ive heard of Tulsi tea, I’ve never tried it. I wonder why it gives u a headache, maybe it’s a detox tea? I went tea tasting with a friend on Monday, there’s something soothing about enjoying a nice cup of tea. I found out they make a decaffeinated black tea at one of the tea stores so I’m hoping to get that. I also like different herb teas. 

 

I’ve been journaling again the last few days, it really does help to get all those ruminating thoughts out of my brain. Am enjoying doing it. 

 

I wishing you all all the best with your continued taper💚

 

 

[BuddhaMama]

Update and request for input:

Did my biggest % decrease 15 days ago. It was 3.7%. I noticed that it took longer this time to feel symptoms-about 5 days. The hot flashes that I get have been lasting longer too. I was prepared to do another decrease soon, but I was waiting for my hormones for the month to even out. Im wondering what the hot flashes are in terms of what part of my system is healing? If that’s my main symptom and the others are mild or gone (vivid dreams, aching teeth, anger), is it still too soon to do another decrease? I just want to be DONE. I’ve been tapering for 19 months and I cannot imagine having to drag out 2.5mg for a year or more. I don’t want to damage my nervous system, and I’ve been pretty slow and steady this whole time, with minimal setbacks. Just hoping someone else is beyond this point and can give some insight. I know Santino is done and when I read his taper schedule I knew it was way too steep for me.

[PH1]

BuddhaMama,

 

I've been following your progress tapering off Remeron.   You are doing a great job and you are an encouragement to me and so many others.    I've been tapering 15 mg Remeron since January 1st and am now down to 3.3 mg.   For the past 3 months (after tapering too fast the first 6 months)  I've been tapering similarly to you, going down 0.1 mg every 10-14 days.  It seems when I cut too quickly the symptoms ramp up.  It is during those tough times (like now for me) to remind myself that the symptoms WILL settle down soon and that I need to go slower from here on out.   I'm not excited either about taking a year to come off of 3.3 mg but the consequences of going too fast are not worth it.    I too have put on a fair amount of weight, about 25 pounds, and can't wait to shed those once I'm off this drug!     There WILL be a day that we both are off Remeron and feeling good.

 

You are in my thoughts and prayers.   One day at a time!

[Shebon]

Buddha:

 

How are you doing?  Were you able to even out with the symptoms? 

 

I know you want to be off sooner rather than later...I am ready for the long haul -- 15 mths. maybe longer. 

 

Wishing you the best,

Shebon