InNeedOfHope: Cymbalta hell - is it impossible for some people?

[InNeedOfHope]

Hello

 

I am desperate as many of you are or have been. I had a traumatic even in Sept 2010 and could not sleep and I was anxious and crying alot. I am 41 years old and have never taken anything before. Have had a lot of stress and loss in my life though from a young age. I was given Citalopram and Zopicone. I took the Citalopram for one night and stopped as I felt strange and not myself, but decided to try the Zopiclone. Within a few days I got more anxious and began to have a burning sensation. The doctors said it was anxiety. I continued taking the Zopiclone for 10 weeks (even though I was concerned about addiction) and weaned myself off it over the course of a week with the agreement of the doctor.Big Mistake I realise now far too quickly. My sleep went from originally waking at 5 to surviving on only 2 hours sleep a night and having severe paranoia, thinking my husband wanted to kill me. I became suicidal.

 

To combat the poor sleep, paranoia, anxiety etc of the sleeping tablet the doctor put me on Cymbalta 30mg at first. Then 60mg after a month. The start up was horrendous, but I was told to persevere and was frightened so I did. I experienced burning, jerking legs, anxiety, depression, poor appetite. By Christmas I also had severe head pain. In February the psychiatrist said I could come off it, from 60 to 30 for a week and then Zero. He wanted me to use Valium but I refused. I got to day 10 and thought I would die. I reinstated the 60mg and with the help of a charity agreed to do it more slowly. This was February.

 

As my system began to go get the 60mg back in my system again, I made a mistake. I took 2 60mg tablets in error. I was told by the doctor this was not a problem. I thought I would explode that night. The end result of that was facial paralsyis on the front of my face, back of head and left shoulder and a 30% loss of hearing (diagnosed by the hospital). I had severe stabbing in my right kidney. I knew at this point I was in serious trouble with this medicine and needed to get off it. I began the journey of reducing more slowly but have made a complete mess of it.

 

I reduced too fast at times (like now I think)I had a severe reaction to iron. Thought it was withdrawal and feel I did some serious damage until I realised. My fingernails have a clear strip at the end of them now and I have been told there is damage to my circulation.

 

Since August I have had three kidney infection (which I have had to diagnose with strips) and fear they may have been there longer, since Cymbalta is a painfiller. Foods now hurt my kidney and stomach. Foods like red meat, acidic foods like tomato, potatoes (high potassium?) in fact anything that anyone with kidney problems needs to avoid. But a scan says they are fine. I have had three courses of antibiotics (which made withdrawal hell) and my stomach is now not right (undigested food). I have gone from working part time and walking every day, to not being able to move off the couch as this causes constriction in my chest and throat and racing heart. My sleep has gone to around 4 hours. I react to every supplement. More recently probiotics (which I continued to take as it helped the kidney pain) but gave severe head pain and my heart rate plummeted.I am worried I have damaged my heart.

 

I am now anxious in the extreme (far far worse than before the medicine. I have reduced haphazardly. From around 27mg to 18,5 since the end of June. I have been on 18.5mg for two weeks. Sometimes I have reduced by a gram, last time only 3 beads. I was in hospital for the kidney thing at the start of September.

 

My question is this. I think I have reduced too fast and am now in a spiral. Can't sleep, can't move, can't eat properly, anxious all day. If I am stuck like this how is my brain going to repair to reduce again? With no excercise or sleep how do I repair my brain? Have I caused damage with the probiotics and the Cipro (antibiotic) I am getting worse day by day. I should mention that 2 weeks ago I forgot my tablet and the charity helped me to make it up over 7 days by taking it at shorter intervals.I lost 10 pounds in a week when I had the kidney infection. I am just under 8 stone and am 5 foot 7. My bones stick out. No matter how much I eat I either lose or maintain my weight.

 

I feel because of this push to reduce quickly I am damaged and can't get back on track (not that I ever was on track). I am due to see a psychologist and I think my family want me on some kind of medicine or to up this dose as I am suicidal and crying. I know the things that help. Baths, reading, being engrossed in something, but the pain at the moment is excruiciating, pain in joints, kidney, head (severe), burning sensation like on fire, high anxiety, pain on eating, chest pain and heavy beating heart, lack of sleep and I feel I can't do this anymore. Eat day is worse than the last. I used to drink a glass of wine most nights of the week prior to medication (not anymore) and wonder if that damaged my brain. Perhaps my adrenal system is damaged as I read they excavate what is there.

 

I read the story of Leon from Germany on here today, he was on Effexor which is the same class as Cymbalta. I feel for him and understand what he went through. I cried all afternoon and became hysterical on reading that.I feel I too have reduced too fast and can't now do the things to stabilise, due to lack of sleep and anxiety, can't get out of this at the moment. My doctors are largely dismissive of what is going on although the GP gets it a little, just does not know how to help or advise me apart from testing for infections.

 

There is stress at home, falling out with children, a partner who understands one day but the next gets angry with me for crying and the mess we are in, which sets me off again as I feel sorry for him and feel so useless I cannot help him. Please please help me. I am begging anyone who can offer any advice. I will post my signature when I figure out how to do it. So sorry for the long post. So sorry for anyone who reads this who probably thinks of course you can do it, stop getting upset....but I am despairing and have lost hope and belief...I am getting ready to let go..if it was another medicine perhaps...but an SRNI...I feel I have no chance.....I read so many severe reactions to these and perhaps for some people it can't be done......

[Shanti]

Hi InNeedofHope. Welcome to the group. I'm sorry you're having such a trial. It's tough. But hang in there. I know the brain does repair itself and I've read many success stories of people that recover from these harsh withdrawals. Are you able to take Fish Oil? That helps repair the brain. Also, I am doing breathing exercises and starting to take food grade peroxide in my water to help my brain have more oxygen through the blood stream.

 

I'm glad you joined us. People are very helpful here.

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

Hold tight until Alto or other administrators are able to read your history. You have alot of variables playing in that, once identified, will make sense of what is happening. The way you are feeling is not at all uncommon. PLEASE understsnd that! It may help to read the discussion of NEUROEMOTION (probably under SYMPTOMS). The meds have intensified and distorted your feelings and your perception of your feelings, making everything seem worse. Try to remind yourself of this. You will be ok. We have all been exactly where you are, unable to see any hope, any future. You are right--It is extremely unsettling and depressing.

 

It sounds like you are exquisitely sensitive to meds, possibly through a metabolism factor (not uncommon!). Ciro/ciprofloxacin is a quinolone antibiotic that does have CNS effects that are more pronounced in some people. Is that the drug that you doubled up on? I will reread your history. Many doctors are unaware of this w Cipro or other '-floxin' antibiotics. I was on Cipro recently and had some odd reactions.

 

Cymbalta/duloxetine is a serotonin norepinephrine reuptake inhibitor that is being used for different types of pain. It has a complicated profile of interactions which may be causing some problems.

 

It is all temporary, but please don't change anything until one of the moderators can help! You've found a group with a wealth of knowledge that would boggle most MDs! AltoStrata, the founder, checks in frequently and will have good advice for you. I am a relative newbie here, too.

 

I'm glad you found this site but sorry that you had reason to.

I'm having computer issues and can't see your profile. Where are you located geographically?

 

Barb

[InNeedOfHope]

Thank your for you welcome. People think suicide and talking this way is a cry for help. In a way I suppose it is, but really for people in this situation it seems like the only solution because a person could not endure this type of pain and emotional instability for a life time, they could not inflict that on themselves or their loved ones. It is of course final, but people left behind can heal, instead of watching you slowly deteriorate to a point of no return in front of them.

 

This is going to sound weird. When I take fish oil, my eye sight goes blurred and I get stomach problems. Tried it 3 times now, same thing happens. Had a reaction to codeine (severe joint pain), also had a bad reaction to Diclofanic? anti imflammatory about 2 months ago. I ended up with my veins enlarged standing out like acid going through them, burning, neck rigid, jerking movements of limbs. Ended up at hospital. Am very wary of any supplements. Took a herbal remedy of Licquorice and other things for the adrenals, went 48hours with no sleep, and burning, always the burning pain. Until I got the kidney infecion the symptoms were manageable. I would have burning and head pain from the damage done by the extra tablet that would stablise quite quickly. Knew what to expect and would cope. Same with painful feet, expect that and know it subsides. Could still exercise and sleep a bit in day.

 

Since September and taking Cipro everything has gone wrong and I fear it has damaged me permanently. I read afterwards it affects the CNS and I fear it has damaged me. Can't sleep, even in day now. Can't walk as I get chest pain and racing heart and trouble swallowing food. Am not moving much which is a stress to the body in a different way. This is why I fear I can't repair and have gone too fast.If I can't sleep or eat properly or walk and cry from the pain, how is my body going to go about repairing itself? I feel I have no options.

 

If people even raise their voice or express annoyance towards me (when I cry), my heart begins to thud and my breathing goes. Can't stop this either. I was taking PassionFlower capsules for sleep, have done since the beginning. They used to help and work, not so much anymore. I don't think they are negative for me, just no effect now. Please someone help me. Have I dropped too fast and too far to recover? I have felt under constant pressure to reduce thinking that I won't be able to get off it. I read another woman who got stuck on 5mg a year ago and is still like that but is getting increasing physical symptoms. That is why I have been rushing thinking the lonnger I put this in the more it is shuttng down receptors that deal with breathing, bodily functions etc. Sorry I have gone on again.

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

I know ypu feel awful physically and emotionally right now. It sounds like you are experiencing classic discontinuation syndrome from antidepressants and probably from the zopiclone. I just looked that up because I was not familiar with it. It is a Z-drug for sleep, but very similar to benzodiazepines and their own withdrawal syndrome. When did you discontinue zopiclone? How long were you on it and did you taper it?

 

I am not a doctor or pharmacist, but I agree that the Cipro may have interacted in some way. Do you know if the infection has cleared up completely? A urinary tract infection can also cause a temporary delirium. If the infection is not completely cleared, you may be feeling confusion from this. It is treatable and will help immensely with confusion/delirium caused by the toxicity of the infection.

I will look into this further right now and post what I find.

You WILL improve! The sensitivity you are experiencing to Fish Oil and others is very common. Don't try anything new right now or change any doses. Help will be online soon.

Barb

[InNeedOfHope]

I was on the Zopiclone for 10 weeks in September and October last year. I took it some nights but not others. I now realise this can cause the burning and paranoia I had as it was like going in and out of withdrawal. I tapered over one week! The doctor knew this but did not offer any alternative advice. I now know from the charity that they would have tapered over weeks and used Diazapam to help and then wean off that. The paranoia disappeared around 3 months later. So I assume any withdrawal now is just Cymbalta, not from that.

 

I have had three proper tests since the infection which now show it has cleared. However, I had to diagnose the infection myself buying strips off the internet as my doctor knew I had pain but referred me for an ultrasound for gallstones/kidney stones. The pain would not go so i bought the strips, saw infection went back to doctor and she said yes you have an infection there is blood and protein and white cells, so start antibiotics.

 

I have continued to test and when the pain comes intense I see white cells. It comes and goes and I quickly realised that it is when I eat fruit (maybe natural sugar? I don't know) or when I am very anxious. I told the doctor and she said to stop testing as it is making me anxious (so I have) she says proper cultured tests are the only way to diagnose an infection and they have been coming back clear. My own personal opinion is that I do have a tiny remnant of the infection that comes and goes and so may not be picked up by testing.

 

I have to admit that since being admitted to hospital for the infection in September and since I have been very very anxious, talking to doctors who didn't understand or want to about withdrawal and how it affects the body. (They just wanted to refer me to a psychiatrist and said I probably needed the medicine!)They did not understand my allergiies to foods/ medicines and said there was no way that foods can cause pain.As I would not take the pain meds, they put on my notes that I refused and was uncooperative. They told me if I did not eat properly I would be dead within a few weeks. I eat every 2 hours or so, small meals, but my weight will not increase.

 

In all of this I have managed to take gentle exercise and do normal things if I take it slowly. Now I cannot do any activity without chest pain and constriction. I was admitted to hospital on Monday for a suspected heart attack. (Sent by Gp).They took 3 sets of blood, which I think has weakened me (I know a normal person would not feel the effect of this) It came back negative, but again the experience was stressful and I was told by doctors it was all anxiety and withdrawal does not cause these kind of pains. It is the lack of understanding and frustration that makes me so anxious and frightened. Three times doctors have tried to prescribe Tramadol, which is a major contraindication with Cymbalta, so to say i have a lack of trust is an understatement.

 

I feel in a spiral, moving brings chest pain in the form of pressing and a constriction of my food and wind pipe. Doing nothing I presume is a type of stress of its own on the body. Even talking for a little while makes my heat beat faster and gives chest pain. I am not generating new cells. Since the anti biotics food is not digested properly and so I must not be getting nutrients. I live in England and it is getting cold so that is a stress on the body. I can't do simple things for myself or my children and this distresses me and causes me anguish and upset. All of this stress means I am not recovering and can see no way to change things.I don't know how to stop this. I read here that tapering too fast means prolonged withdrawal and I fear I have done this.If I am a litte late in taking the medicine (was late on Monday as at hospital) I get stabbing and withdrawal pain. How can this be? How can I be so sensitive to the medicine?

 

Can other people not move about? How do they improve? I read the story of Leon yesterday and I have lost hope. My symptoms are just like his and getting worse. Maybe some people are physically too weak to resist the strength of this medicine. The internet, is a it a friend of foe? Yes, I have found information that has assisted me, but also I read things that scare me silly. I have had little sleep again and seem unable to sleep in the day now too. I don't know how much longer I can take this, may God forgive me. I have written a lot again but I need to tell someone. Thank you who ever reads this.

[ladybug]

First of all, you WILL get through this. Please do not give up. There are a couple of things that seem to be going on and that is Cymbalta WD and horrible effects from Cipro. They are both nasty drugs. Many people have problems with antibiotics during WD and Cipro is one of the worst out there. This is a great site where you can enter any drug name and see people's personal reviews: http://www.askapatient.com/viewrating.asp?drug=19537&name=CIPRO

Cipro has a rating of 1.7 on a scale from 1 to 5, 1 being the lowest. Many, many people have had problems with this drug and have described many of the same symptoms you are having now. Things will get better, but no more of this drug! If you continue to have kidney infections there are safer antibiotics out there to help.

 

It seems you are also going way too fast with your Cymbalta taper. Don't even think about tapering anymore until you feel better. You might even have to go back up a bit to get relief. I do believe that taking a double dose could have caused some kidney problems. This drug is contraindicated for people with kidney problems, so it obviously puts some stress on them. The good news is that you haven't been on the drug long and the brain has an amazing capacity to heal!

 

Please try to find a food that you can eat without feeling sick, because malnutrition is only going to make you feel worse. Have you tried meal supplement drinks like Ensure or Boost? When I couldn't eat much I drank a lot of those and it helped me to get some vitamins and nutrients without having to digest a big meal. Hang in there, you can get through this. We are all here for you and I know there will be some more people with advice here soon.

[InNeedOfHope]

Thanks so much for anyone who cares enough to reply. I think only someone who is going/gone through this understands the level of pain and worry involved. In a way it was like taking a triple dose as as I was still getting the 60mg back in my system from having dropped to 30mg. Prior to taking Cipro, in hospital they did a CT scan of the kidneys and blood tests and they said they were functioning ok. They could not explain my pain and laughed at pain from foods. This hospital stay caused me terrible distress, a woman was in there who had been off Prozac for two years and had the same unexplained pain as me and had tried to kill herself...I saw my future mapped out like this...

 

Since the Cipro my stomach has not been right, I don't digest food it comes out as it went in and smells foul. My urine smells foul too though that has gone down since I stopped the probiotics. I can't take pro biotics as these caused my heart to slow right down and I could not breath. I kept taking them for four weeks as doctors said this was impossible. They seemed to keep my infection at bay that is why I kept taking them. Now I worry I have damaged my heart in some way but the ECG is ok.

 

Anything heavy on the kidney gives me pain so I wonder if I feel everything going through in a way a normal person wouldn't because of withdrawal. The severe head pain is all on the left side mostly, it feels as if a strip of my skull has been removed and stitched back together with staples. My right foot is very bad, so I thought this damage might explain the right kidney issue and when the brain heals the feeling in the kidney will too. Don't know what anyone thinks of that.

 

The lady from the charity is against me increasing as she says this can make it impossible to drop down, she wants me to wait it out. She says I have not gone fast, but I think I am a severe case and have done now, the more I read. I would not be alive without her support so far though. It is a British charity called CITA.

 

Just before the infection in August my son was admitted to hospital after an accident and had life threatening surgery to his brain. He is recovering well. My family were amazed with how I reacted and dealt with it, they say they could not have done it. I was strong and helped my partner through it. This is why I know alot of the anxiety is the medicine. I began to believe that if I could cope with that then the anxiety must be withdrawal related and one day I could do this.

 

Since the infection I have not been right. If I can't move without chest pain and breathing, can't sleep, can't digest food and to top it off cry alot and am anxious with the pain, I don't see how I can move forward and heal.I am losing the support and patience of my family. I don't want to leave my children but I can't live like this incapacitated and in pain. Have I just gone too fast? Is that what it is? If I am patient will my body catch up? It is like if I do anything I am using up reserves of adrenaline that are needed for breathing/bodily function. I can't correct this adrenaline fatigue with vitamins as I can't take supplements. I am sorry but the supplements you mention are in America I presume, but I am in England. Please God help me. I have been able to take the pain so far, but it is the fact I can't really move and the worry this won't change...Have other people experienced it like this?

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

oh yes. Recently, I've been able to be up and doing something for an hour or so, then back to recliner or bed. Or, I'll have a busy day (nothing extreme) followed by 4-5 days recuperating. I've been getting a 'vasovagal' reaction fairly regularly w the least exertion. I thought it was just overheating, but getting nauseous, dizzy, and tossing cookies (TMI sorry!), too. The 1st I recall this happening was about a year ago, but I didn't connect it to wd.

I used to push myself to get out every day, but am trying to not feel guilty if I don't. im not a TV person, so get very bored indoors.

[Shanti]

Hi InNeed. I know how you feel. I was on Cymbalta and ended up in the hospital for surgery. I couldn't take my Cymbalta cause I was on IV for a week. I was also on high doses of several anti-biotiotics. It's hell, I know. I couldn't sleep. They tried giving me atavan but it didn't help me. The nurses were great and did talk-meditation for me and it was the only thing that helped at all.

 

I wrote a post about Homeopathy. It doesn't have any toxins or chemicals aside from water and lactose. And if you can't handle the lactose, you can get it in liquid that is lactose-free. It helped me tremendously. I don't know if it works for everyone, but it's in-exensive and worth the try imo.

 

I got through the Cymbalta hell and didn't have permanent damage. Now I'm in Paxil hell. I too have wondered how I will heal if I can't even walk around the block without flaring up my symptoms. But I know I am healing. I do the breathing exercise and I'm getting food grade peroxide to improve my circulation and add more oxygen to my bloodstream. Rest is very healing for this condition. We just need a lot of rest.

 

Suicide would do incredible damage to your loved ones for life. It would be better imo, to go back on the meds than to resort to that. You will heal.

[Shanti]

Oh, and I had the same problem with Fish Oil. I had to lower my dose and did okay. But if you can, try Flaxseed Oil. It's milder and still has the Omegas. When I stand, I do just a few seconds of stretching. That's about all the exercise I can do.

[Altostrata]

Hello, InNeed.

 

It sounds to me that, originally, you had rebound insomnia from discontinuing the zopiclone.

 

It also sounds like antidepressants and your nervous system don't get along at all, as you had problems with citalopram and Cymbalta from the very first.

 

The various exposures to psych drugs have made your system hyper-sensitive. This has happened to many people on the site. This has probably been contributing to your reactions to Cipro and other drugs.

 

Are you taking Cipro now? As others have noted, Cipro is a drug that causes a lot of strange reactions, which could be aggravated by your withdrawal hyper-sensitivity. Can your doctor substitute another antibiotic for your kidney infection?

 

If I were you, I'd insist on this.

 

You've been tapering from Cymbalta by taking out the particles? How often are you doing this? What is your dosage now?

 

Make sure to take your medication at the same time every day, to avoid that additional stress you get when you're a bit late.

 

Don't worry about running out of adrenaline. You're not going to run out of it. What you need to do right now is reduce stress, stay as calm as possible, and try to manage your symptoms using very, very gentle treatments. Doing a bit of breathing meditation can help.

 

It sounds like the probiotics helped, but caused some other symptoms. Can you take a very small amount of probiotics? Or in a different form, such as kefir (a drink)?

 

Some people on this site have had digestive difficulties in withdrawal and have found a very non-irritating diet to help, see SCD/GAPS/Paleo Diets

[InNeedOfHope]

My thoughts are confused so sorry if this does not make sense.

 

Barbarannamated, Shanti, Ladybug thank you for you advice, at the moment thought it all seems hopeless as it is so severe and I can't correct the spiral.

 

Altostrata - I am off the Cipro now and have been for 6 weeks or so. The pain is still there but each cultured urine test recently shows it has gone. My doctor says that it can take months for inflammation and pain in that area to heal, but for me it is exacerbated by withdrawal.

 

I have been reducing haphazardly, at first in grams, then in single beads every few days until it got too much. After the Cipro I have not been right. I am currently on 18.5mg down from 60mg from February. I count and take beads out and it is second counted by my family. I might buy some scales to make it more accurate as even the bead sizes are different. I last reduced I think almost three weeks ago, taking out 3 beads which is a third of a mg.

 

I have noticed that if I take it with little food or even just an hour late, withdrawal is severe with stabbing pains, burning and severe head pain, as well as breathing problems, chest pain and difficulty swallowing food.

 

Thanks for the diet advice, I have looked at some of them, but unfortunately I can't eat meat, potatoes, acidic things, even fruit with natural sugars as they bring kidney pain.

 

I reduced the probiotic down to the tiniest amount and it still affected me, as did yoghurt.

 

I was late again taking the Cymbalta by one hour. No excuse but sometimes it happens. Even if I take it differently, say not with a full meal, it enters my system in a different way and I get severe withdrawal. I have sat and thought about it and this is my current thinking which scares me silly. If it affects me in this way as I am so sensitive to it, how am I going to improve. I have been in alot of pain since the Cipro, but the last three weeks and in particular this week have been a new low. If I am that senstive how will I improve? I can't move forward. As a result of last night I am sat here with stabbing pain all over my body and head (especially the right kidney). Perhaps I am like the others who gave up. I am so close to doing so. There is no progress at all. I have struggled for so long and am losing my fight. My family are losing patience with me (I don't blame them) and this adds to the stress. Normal stresses like my children falling out, cause severe symptoms and panic inside.

 

I try to breathe deeply, eat regularly, take baths for pain, rest, get my husband to rub my back (which helps) but it is not making any difference. I have followed a pattern in the past but it is not happening any more.I know my lack of movement does not help, but if I do I can't breathe. Have I reduced too fast?

 

I am trying so hard to not panic, to not cry (as this makes it worse), but really, I am just not improving.

 

Please God someone help me. I can't stay on this medicine as it has hurt me, if I can't get off it what I am going to do? Please help me, please I am begging someone, anyone, who has had it this severe, to tell me what to do? What if my sensitivity means I can't move forward and will just need more and more of this stuff. Please please help me. I keep thinking of the thread by Leon, his medicine was the same class as mine. What if that is my only answer?

[Tom]

I'm so sorry you are going through this.

 

There is a lot of info in this thread, so I apologize if this is redundant. Is it possible to go up to the dose you were last stable at and maybe stabilize and then start tapering slower again?

[compsports]

""Please God someone help me. I can't stay on this medicine as it has hurt me, if I can't get off it what I am going to do? Please help me, please I am begging someone, anyone, who has had it this severe, to tell me what to do? What if my sensitivity means I can't move forward and will just need more and more of this stuff. Please please help me. I keep thinking of the thread by Leon, his medicine was the same class as mine. What if that is my only answer""

 

InNeedofHope,

 

I like Tom's suggestion.

 

You also might want to visit this cymbalta withdrawal board.

 

http://www.cymbaltawithdrawal.com/

 

Please forgive me as I dealing with severe insomnia. I am trying to figure out something to say to you to encourage you to hang on but the words aren't coming out.

 

We all care about you as a human being and would be devastated if you did what Leon did. And so would your loved ones.

 

Please hang on.

 

CS

[InNeedOfHope]

I think perhaps I have reduced too fast. I coped with the pain, but now, not breathing, chest pain, not being able to move is something else. As is the stabbing and head pain I get if my dose is slightly late or I do a little too much. If I make a mistake like this my pain is far far worse than it has ever been almost unbearable. I have had a lot to deal with the last couple of months, my sons accident, having to leave work, knowing I am unlikely to return, being in hospital with the kidney infection, taking Cipro.

 

I have not needed to wait 4 weeks with drops prior to now, but now realise that I have gone far too quickly (see my signature). I am scared that I can't get out of this cycle, pain, anxiety, stress, lack of sleep, no exercise, pain and fear this is the prolonged withdrawal syndrome talked about. What is wrong with me that I get these symptoms from being just a little late? For me symptoms have usually disappated reasonable quickly, I thought that was because of the short half life, but now see that I might be paying for the last few weeks now as they have caught up with me.

 

I have considered going back up, but it took so long to get here. I read about a woman who did that on the Cymbalta forum, took a year to get to 5mg, and kept going up and down a bit. She is now stuck on 5mg and has chest pain and difficulty swallowing food. I always thought it was better to wait it out instead of going up and down. But I seem to be going up and down every day, just based on how my body is absorbing it.

 

If I sit and wait and try hard to keep my dose at same time, with same food, will it settle down in a few weeks? All the extra worry about what is happening to my body and fear I will not get off this is not helping me I know, I just don't know how to stop it. Has anyone else just waited it out?

 

I get confused. I assume I developed head pain and burning on it very quickly because I reached tolerance fast. If someone can't cope on it, I don't understand how the drops make things better in the end? That is what I have never been able to understand. Everyone tells me your brain will adjust, but I had these symptoms on it. Does that make sense?

 

I don't want to hurt my family, but I feel I am hurting them now, every day, by being this useless mess who needs taking care of and constant reassureance. I can't contribute.I am draining them and cast a dark shadow over their lives. It is not fair to my children. If I wasn't here they could move forward. I hope they would understand, it is the medicine that has done this to me, it is not the real me. Does waiting it out get you there? Please someone give me hope,the pain is getting worse and worse day by day.

[compsports]

Hi,

 

Have you looked into these natural remedies for pain?

 

Bromelain and Boswellia

 

http://www.health.com/health/article/0,,20410968_2,00.html

 

As an FYI, I am taking bromelain for other reasons and in spite of being very sensitive to many supplements, I haven't had any problems.

 

You're wrong about your family. If you committed suicide, they would be devastated.

 

Worrying about your body is understandable as I will admit, I greatly worry about what my severe insomnia is doing. But I quickly put it to the back of my mind and focus on trying to get better. I just can't allow myself to go there.

 

It might be helpful to follow the same philosophy.

 

Please hang on.

 

CS

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

 

I left a message on the other thread, just FYI.

 

Could you put the Cipro and whiplash info into your signature/med history?

 

Hang in there. I know it is hard to see any future when the pain is screaming so loudly. I've had times of bad pain and my perception of everything becomes very distorted. It makes it impossible to see hope, to see tomorrow or even a hour into the future.

There are many different treatments for pain aside from meds. I've had several outpatient procedures for neck pain that helped alot and were not painful or complicated. I have an interventional pain specialist who is an anesthesiologist by training.

 

Sending you HOPE! And HUGS!

 

Barb

[Shanti]

InNeed, when I started coming off my meds, I did it all haphazardly too, and I suffered greatly. I had to go back up in dose, get stabilized, then start a slow taper.

 

Please try Homeopathy, it saved my life. Please don't let Picklet scare you. I've written to her and asked her to come set this straight as she did a huge injustice from her ego need to sound superior. It is totally safe and it helped me so much. It's very inexpensive.

[Altostrata]

InNeed, your system is sensitized by withdrawal. Probably your initial decreases were too much, too fast. (At least the kidney infection seems to be resolved.)

 

I agree, try updosing a bit to 20mg and see if that helps.

 

Stay calm. Concentrate on taking care of yourself. Let your family know you need their help. Do what you can.

 

Most doctors or hospitals will not understand that you are suffering an adverse effect from Cymbalta withdrawal. You are right, they are likely to make mistakes in treating you.

 

Contact David Healy http://medicine.cf.ac.uk/person/prof-david-thomas-healy/ He is at the Cardiff University School of Medicine in Wales. If you can't see him personally, ask him if he can recommend a doctor in your area to help you get off Cymbalta.

 

Switching to Prozac may be what you have to do. Then you can taper off Prozac.

 

UK members, would you share your phone numbers with InNeedOfHope and give her phone support during this crisis time?

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

I hope you are getting a good night of sleep. I'm goin to be signing off and wanted to let you know I was thinking about you.

I hope you contact Dr.Healy and are able to see him. He was the 1st MD (or one of the first?)to realize the problem w/ADs and speak out in a big way. He will understand.

Sending healing thoughts your way!

Barb

 

[InNeedOfHope]

Thank you so much. I took my tablet at the correct time with food and this morning I feel 10% better. Am hoping this will continue, but will take it easy and not be tempted to do too much, so I don't fall back. I slept around four and a half hours, not great for me, hope I will be able to fall asleep in the day for a bit. I will be contacting him, not sure if he is in the country, as I know he travels alot, but could e mail or speak by phone. Thanks again for your thoughts.

[Gem]

Dear InNeed,

I am so sorry you have been suffering like this.

Believe me I can understand where you are coming from in relation to lack of understanding from some people in the medical profession, and the resulting frustration. I have found this very distressing in the past. It is totally understandable to feel the way you do.

 

I can relate strongly to what you said about emotional sensitivity in withdrawal. My heart used to thud if someone was showing annoyance to someone else, let alone me! I also needed loads of reassurance.

 

I often used to get into a bad, bad state: exhausted from lack of sleep and having about a million intrusive withdrawal thoughts. At some points, my brain literally would not turn off whatever I did. I often thought there was no hope for me. But (although I am not fully recovered) I am so much better. I hope this gives you some hope as I was often in a pretty bad mess in early withdrawal.

 

Please remember, you are not useless at all. It is the drugs at fault, not you.

 

I wish you more & more healing and improvement

[Altostrata]

I've written to Ben Green at Priory also, to see if he knows any other UK doctors who can sort out these adverse drug effects.

[InNeedOfHope]

Thank you for everyone trying to help me. I took my tablet at the usual time, which was an hour earlier than the night before, this was on Saturday. In theory I have gone high in the medicine by taking it at 23 hours hours gap, now I am coming down from that and have severe stabbing pains all over my body this morning. This is just from taking my tablet at a different time. I have lost count now but I think it is three weeks since I reduced and each day I seem to be getting worse/more sensitive to the medicine.

 

Prior to taking the Ciprofloxacin I had a pattern of pain and stablising out, now it is just pain that seems to be getting more intense when I experience it. I am afraid, I don't feel I can take much more. I slept poorly last night. I am trying so hard not to cry or panic as I know I don't even have the reserves to deal with that. I still don't understand why my brain is not recovering this time. Is it because I have gone too fast earlier on and there is just too much for it to do? It can't even cope with the normal bodily functions of moving, eating and breathing, let alone anything else. I am praying the Cipro hss wiped out my immune system completely and that is why I am not improving.

 

If I stay at weeks on this dose, will I not just get worse as my body cries out for more having reached tolerance? I just don't understand anymore.

[InNeedOfHope]

Sorry to add more. I look back at how fast I reduced. I never felt good at any of those doses, as soon as I could bear more pain I moved on. What have I done? Now my brain is in such shock it can't get out of the spin it is in.

[Shanti]

You'll level out at the dose, just takes some time. I'm waiting 5 or 6 weeks before I lower dose. You'll recover, there's no reason your body shouldn't repair itself. It will. Hang in there.

[InNeedOfHope]

Today so far has been unbearable. I feel as if I am being stabbed all over my body.I have tried hard not to cry but could not hold it back any longer. I have read and read and read and am pretty sure I have tapered too fast earlier on, especially with taking an extra tablet, forgetting tablets etc. I am getting closer and closer to the edge. I think I reached tolerace on this in only a couple of months, so if I updose will I not just be shocking my brain again and causing more problems down the line? Or if I stay like this will I just deteriorate as I am so sensitive to changes in the timing of the med and the pain I get upset alot, which is draining and self perpetuating.

 

I am sorry to keep asking questions, I just feel it is vital to make the right decision now. I feel as if I am living on the edge and cannot take much more.

[Shanti]

Can you get some pain killers from your doctor? I take vicodin just fine without it upsetting my withdrawal syndrome.

 

I don't think updosing is going to hurt you.

 

One thing about this condition is that we start rationalizing suicide until it seems logical. But please, do not resort to that. You have stated that your family will be hurt for a while but will move on, but that's not true. A suicide is worse than dying any other way to the family and they'll never fully recover from it. You have to hang in there. You seem to have convinced yourself that you're unhealable, but it's not true. Most of us here have been where you are, on the brink of throwing in the towel from these symptoms. But it does get better. You have to hang on.

[Shanti]

InNeed, don't hesitate to post how you feel. It's very important to get it all out so keep posting. We all understand this.

[Altostrata]

InNeed, don't vary the time when you take the Cymbalta.

 

You are having pain because your nervous system has had a shock. It will take time for this to go away. Please stay calm. Read some of these topics Psychotherapeutic techniques to cope with withdrawal and try some of the techniques to calm your mind.

 

Does anything help? Warm baths? You might try Epsom salts in a warm bath. They contain magnesium, which helps relax muscles.

 

I found sipping a little magnesium citrate in ice water throughout the day was calming.

 

Acupuncture can help with pain, also.

[InNeedOfHope]

I am going to do everything I can to keep the time the same. I have been reading on here so much and have scared myself that I have gone far far too quickly. Even when the stabbing pains go, I am in constant severe pain in the back of my head. My brain has had a lot of trauma, taking an extra tablet that caused paralysis, (that has been with me all the way down) I could take the pain before recent events (Ciprofloxacin) but cannot any longer. I also attempted a ct from 60 to 30 which failed so I reinstated. I more or less CT Zopiclone. I have gone very fast at times, because I could take the pain. I can see how flawed this was now and fear I have really damaged and shocked my brain. Of course the cruel thing is this does not show up until the lower doses, when the pain killing effect of the medicine is all but gone.

 

I am not sure if I should updose, because I could find myself in the same position but worse in a few months as I try to get lower. I am thinking I could not have this time sensitivity thing if my brain had healed at a slower pace. So the question is do I risk it and go back up to function, because I am not funtioning now, (can't walk, sleep, eating difficult) and if I do, how far do I go? And how long do I stay there? Is longer better? What about tolerance again, I get confused about that.

 

I have felt ok -ish before and by that I mean I was in great pain but could at least walk and breath properly etc so I would reduce. I can see years of chronic pain and am worried I will not be able to take it. My aim is to get to Friday and see if there is any way I stablise, or improve just a little bit. Are other people this incapacitated? I feel my next move is crucial. I see some people recommend updosing (it works for them) and others not so much. It is so hard to know the right thing to do.

 

I will look at the meditation etc thank you for that.

 

 

I cannot tolerate any pain meds at all.

[Barbarannamated]

InNeed,

 

I just came across info on a forum that addresses the severe adverse reactions of quinolone antibiotics (including Cipro) "during benzodiazepine withdrawal/recovery" due to a very strong antagonist effect on GABA receptors. Benzos are (theoretically) GABA-agonists (increase GABA). Zopiclone, as I understand it, is a "Z-drug", and very similar to benzos.

 

So, it sounds like you are experiencing benzo withdrawal from zopiclone and the Cipro-- even though it was awhile ago -- may be exacerbating that by antagonism at GABA receptors (reducing available GABA even more). No wonder you feel so horrible!

 

This info is at www.bcnc.org.uk/drugs.html

I will look for scientific/scholarly articles about this. I'm not surprised that it isn't widely known. Many docs are not aware of quinolone CNS effects. Antibiotics are not thought to effect the CNS.

 

Sorry if I'm harping on the Cipro/quinolone involvement.

I also understand how if feels when an MD denies that a drug can have a certain adverse reaction.

 

Hang in there!

 

[InNeedOfHope]

Thank you for caring enough to look that information up. I was just in the middle of writing another post. If that is the case what do you think it means for me? Is there any hope I can recover at all if damage has been done there too? I have to say I wasn't going great, but it went terribly wrong after the Cipro. The ends of my fingernails are damaged too after that and also taking iron (thought it was normal withdrawal)got to 6 days on it before I realised I was poisoning myself.

[InNeedOfHope]

Oh no just read it a bit..I was given Diclofenac too which I reacted very badly too at the same time. What hope is there for me?

[Barbarannamated]

ALOT!!