Jason: Introduction

[Meimeiquest]

Hi Jason, Have you read the thread on methylation and b vitamins? That's actually a pretty hefty dose of niacin. I've found 3 actions of niacin (I'm sure there are many more): helps (more) GABA cross the blood-brain barrier, acts as a co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme which is part of the methylation cycle, does something between SAM and SAM-E which can lead to depression....this has to do with inflammation. good luck!

[Jason]

Hi Jason, Have you read the thread on methylation and b vitamins? That's actually a pretty hefty dose of niacin. I've found 3 actions of niacin (I'm sure there are many more): helps (more) GABA cross the blood-brain barrier, acts as a co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme which is part of the methylation cycle, does something between SAM and SAM-E which can lead to depression....this has to do with inflammation. good luck!

So do I take it or do I not take it? I'm sorry but this was pretty vague.

 

I bought a cheap Walgreens B Complex this morning after I felt sick at work and took it and I felt fine, a little better, got enough appetite to eat something. I just took a 250mg tablet of niacinamide a couple hours ago and fell fast asleep.

 

I'm guessing I should not take it if it's making me this psycho. Maybe just stick with the B complex since it's in there at a lower dose and then I get a little bit of all the Bs, plus I didn't react badly to that and I felt actually pretty fine (even told the doctor that today). I didn't feel GREAT or even GOOD, but FINE. Better than these up and down swings I've been having.

 

I still don't see how we don't have actual CNS brain damage. I for sure have some symptoms.

[Jason]

 

Hi Jason, Have you read the thread on methylation and b vitamins? That's actually a pretty hefty dose of niacin. I've found 3 actions of niacin (I'm sure there are many more): helps (more) GABA cross the blood-brain barrier, acts as a co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme which is part of the methylation cycle, does something between SAM and SAM-E which can lead to depression....this has to do with inflammation. good luck!

So do I take it or do I not take it? I'm sorry but this was pretty vague.

 

I bought a cheap Walgreens B Complex this morning after I felt sick at work and took it and I felt fine, a little better, got enough appetite to eat something. I just took a 250mg tablet of niacinamide a couple hours ago and fell fast asleep.

 

I'm guessing I should not take it if it's making me this psycho. Maybe just stick with the B complex since it's in there at a lower dose and then I get a little bit of all the Bs, plus I didn't react badly to that and I felt actually pretty fine (even told the doctor that today). I didn't feel GREAT or even GOOD, but FINE. Better than these up and down swings I've been having.

 

I still don't see how we don't have actual CNS brain damage. I for sure have some symptoms.

 

And again the only reason I really wanted to take this stuff is for the antifungal properties, since no doctor is going to prescribe me antifungals. Plus I had been having some very vague weakness and no appetite symptoms lately. Been real sick out of the blue, no reason at all.

[Meimeiquest]

I vote for what makes you feel good. And for a really, really clean diet. I'm so sorry you are so sick.

[Jason]

But what do I do? I don't feel good on this stuff right now, either.

 

Why do I have to have all these problems? I don't know anyone else on earth who has these problems in real life. I know NO ONE. Other people aren't worrying about B vitamins or the food they eat that I know. They aren't going through psychological problems and brain problems. Why do I have to do that? I don't know anything.

 

I don't even know how to cook my own food. So I don't eat clean when no one can make food for me cuz I don't know how I just go get fast food cuz that's what I know how to do.

 

And even when you go to someone who is supposed to tell you what to do because you can't possibly know everything there is about health, they just suggest Lexapro?! WTF????

[Jason]

Hi Jason, Have you read the thread on methylation and b vitamins? That's actually a pretty hefty dose of niacin. I've found 3 actions of niacin (I'm sure there are many more): helps (more) GABA cross the blood-brain barrier, acts as a co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme which is part of the methylation cycle, does something between SAM and SAM-E which can lead to depression....this has to do with inflammation. good luck!

So what is the co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme blah blah blah is that good or bad? I'm assuming that it messing with SAME is bad since it "leads to depression"??? So I don't take it? And my doctor said that 500 isn't a lot how can that be a lot when people with schizophrenia (which good golly it's like I practially have that how I've been the last few days) take like 3g??? I'm so confused. I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel so sick. I can't sleep I can't eat and NO ONE WILL TELL ME WHAT TO DO

[Jason]

 

Hi Jason, Have you read the thread on methylation and b vitamins? That's actually a pretty hefty dose of niacin. I've found 3 actions of niacin (I'm sure there are many more): helps (more) GABA cross the blood-brain barrier, acts as a co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme which is part of the methylation cycle, does something between SAM and SAM-E which can lead to depression....this has to do with inflammation. good luck!

So what is the co-enzyme with the COMT enzyme blah blah blah is that good or bad? I'm assuming that it messing with SAME is bad since it "leads to depression"??? So I don't take it? And my doctor said that 500 isn't a lot how can that be a lot when people with schizophrenia (which good golly it's like I practially have that how I've been the last few days) take like 3g??? I'm so confused. I just don't know what to do anymore. I feel so sick. I can't sleep I can't eat and NO ONE WILL TELL ME WHAT TO DO

 

I really really don't feel good right now.   I knew I wasn't going to make it to my 32nd birthday. I kept telling myself that and people I know that (March 25th)

[Jason]

OK I can't take this stuff anymore. It's really messing with my brain. If the rest of the nervous system or any other part of my body needed it, it's too bad it will just have to die off cuz I can't take these emotional roller coasters and how weird I feel. I will take that cheap B complex which has a little bit of it in there just in case I am not getting some stupid B vitamin right and I will still take the methylcobalamin cuz I need it I don't get it from diet from my stupid stomach which I destroyed years ago too.

 

I sure wish people would have told me never to take these things.

[Jason]

My body is ruined. It just doesn't work anymore. However much longer I have on this earth is going to be very, very miserable feeling.

[Altostrata]

If niacinamide helps, why not continue to take it?

 

How much are taking, and when?

 

Same with the B vitamins.

 

B vitamins are in leafy green vegetables. An easy way to eat raw veggies is to make a smoothie from them. I suggest: Get a Cuisinart smoothie blender, or a Magic Bullet, or whatever blender. Put a quarter-head of fresh lettuce or other greens in it. Put a cut-up half apple in it. Put some water in it. Blend. Drink.

 

Please learn to cook. You'll need to cook for yourself for the rest of your life. If you ingest green leafies as above, all you need to do is broil some meat and bake a sweet potato (they're better for you than white potatoes) and you've got dinner.

[Jason]

If niacinamide helps, why not continue to take it?

 

How much are taking, and when?

 

Same with the B vitamins.

 

B vitamins are in leafy green vegetables. An easy way to eat raw veggies is to make a smoothie from them. I suggest: Get a Cuisinart smoothie blender, or a Magic Bullet, or whatever blender. Put a quarter-head of fresh lettuce or other greens in it. Put a cut-up half apple in it. Put some water in it. Blend. Drink.

 

Please learn to cook. You'll need to cook for yourself for the rest of your life. If you ingest green leafies as above, all you need to do is broil some meat and bake a sweet potato (they're better for you than white potatoes) and you've got dinner.

Hi Alto,

 

The Niacinamide helps, but only when it's "kicked in." My body really notices when it runs out, it goes through a withdrawal and I feel sicker than I have ever been. It's also been messing with my brain and I get all these roller coasters that you can read in my posts above.   This happened to me, too, when I started up vitamin B12 therapy - all these swings and roller coasters of symptoms that eventually leveled out when there was plenty of B12 in my system.

 

I was taking 500 mg capsule once a day, earlier in the day, and it would wear off in a few hours and I'd crash and feel crazy, hard to think, hard to walk, feel dizzy, feel like I was going to die. Not exaggerating. Hence why I went to a doctor about this today, but of course he was of no help.

 

The B vitamin complex is some simple one from Walgreens, I think a Nature Made or something like that, with a little more than 100% of most of the Bs in there except for things like folic acid which are lower. I think it has 25 mg niacin in the niacinamide form in it. I took one this morning just so that I could kinda feel well and it worked.

 

You don't understand about me. I really don't understand a lot of things about the world. Alto, I'm really messed up. It's like some kind of autism with me, and it's never going to change. I can't learn to cook things. I don't have my own house. I will never have my own house. I owe well over 50 thousdand dollars in school loans for a simple bachelor's degree cuz I didn't know what I was doing. I get scared of everything and I just don't understand how to do things. I don't even know what broil is. Before psych drugs I was much better, though. Much better. But I've always had and air of awkwardness and not understanding things. And it gets worse when I don't feel normal and I don't feel good. I have so many strange and debilitating emotions and physical problems day in and day out that I can't be one continuous human being from morning to night. I'm several different versions of me throughout the day and none of them are very stable. Learn to cook? I wish I could. I would want nothing more in this life than to feel good, whole and be just like every other Tom d*ck and Harry, but I just don't know how I don't know what to do! And you go to a doctor and he just wants to give you Lexapro instead of listen to you about your niacin swing symptoms, which he says do not happen??? Well, they just happened to me and I feel sicker than a dog and I have all these other strange symptoms. How do you tell someone that in the morning when you wake you feel sharp scrapings on your eyes? And you think it's from a mold infection? How do you tell them that you can't stand to be in certain buidlings for more than 15 minutes because you can feel the mold problem in there? How do you tell someone that you can't turn your head left sometimes becuase the back of your neck and everything in there on the left side feels "gunked up" but that niacinamide will make it go away? WTF? See what I live with day in and day out and that's only probably like 3% of what I'm feeling. It's hell on earth! and I never had any symptoms as bizarre as these in my entire life before any kind of drugs, be them psych drugs, benzos, proton pump inhibitors, whatever. Never. My body is physically and mentally collapsing (the CNS that is - not my thoughts as people would like to ascribe), and no one can do a damn thing for me except suggest more drugs that would make them worse.

 

So now I don't know what to do. I bought some other niacinamide that is 250 mg and was planning on spacing them throughout the day - I've read that that's actually a better way to take niacinamide if you are going to take it because it is so short acting. You can take safely up to a gram or so a day without worrying about the liver. I just don't know if this is good for me or not good for me because I feel what if I'm further damaging the nervous system. Or is it being damaged in the absence of this. And why do I all of a sudden need this if that is the case? Where did this come from now? Why do I keep having to deal with this? Am I not absorbing tryptophan? Niacin? Is my stomach that damaged? Heaven forget thinking about functioning as a rational human being when you have all of this to deal with on your own.

 

So I am relatively "fine" now I crashed into a slumber on that 250mg niacinamide I bought earlier today. But it will wear off in the middle of the night. And I'll awaken feeling very sick, crazy, feeling like I need to crawl out of my skin. And this whole thing will start over again tomorrow. But don't worry. I will just have to get up and go to work and pretend like I am a rational, normal, happy functioning human being. Which I'm totally not and is the hardest thing to do right now. I've dealt with this crap before it feels like with B12 deficiency and that was too damn hard I thought i was going to die. I really don't want to have to go through this all over again with another vitamin, but it looks like I have to. Which is why I feel soooo ready to give up, but I can't do that because I don't know how to do that, either.

[Altostrata]

Correct, take the niacinamide periodically throughout the day.

 

Same with the other B vitamins, though I would avoid taking any after maybe 2pm, they might keep you awake. You can cut up the tablets.

 

As long as you are feeling better while taking them and are moderate in your dosages, I would not worry about ill effects.

 

Conventional doctors know very little about these supplements.

 

Meimeiquest also gets a good result from niacinamide.

 

How about the green smoothie? Could you manage that?

[Jason]

Correct, take the niacinamide periodically throughout the day.

 

Same with the other B vitamins, though I would avoid taking any after maybe 2pm, they might keep you awake. You can cut up the tablets.

 

As long as you are feeling better while taking them and are moderate in your dosages, I would not worry about ill effects.

 

Conventional doctors know very little about these supplements.

 

Meimeiquest also gets a good result from niacinamide.

 

How about the green smoothie? Could you manage that?

I appreciate your patience with me. I've always been a stubborn person, even when I was a kid. And you combine not feeling like yourself and knowing that something with you is drastically wrong with a stubborn person - and mix in doctors and others who have no idea what you're talking about because how can they? - and you get a very hostile, frustated, angry person who is mad at the world and feels like the world and everyone in it and everything are against him. How can I be expected to play along with everyone else when I don't even get the same set of tools and the same odds and people think you're just crazy? Hurts like hell.

 

OK I will try this with these b vitamins - stagger the niacinamide throughout the day - maybe as little as twice a day, maybe as much as three or four times. I will take one B complex early in the day along with my whole slue of other vitamins I am taking. Obviously something is not getting into my body B-vitamin wise that is more than just B12, which is largely corrected now. As far as the smoothie I would like to. I don't know if we have a blender here. I used to like raw spinach and apples together in salads. I used to make my own version of what Wendy's has with apples, spinach, blue cheese (although that's out now due to mold infection) and maybe a dressing but those are hard with mold infections, too.

 

I just can't do these things on my own and no one gets it. People think that just because I'm a 31 year old male I'm should be all capable, well I'm not, OK? No one knows what these drugs do to your brain and body unless you go through it first hand, and like I said even before the drugs I've always been quite... different from other people, men especially. I just can't do this all on my own and yet I have to cuz I have no family and no loved ones, save the friends I rent a room from and even they're tired of this, understandably. It is not fair being on the outside looking into the world you wish you could fully be a part of but you can't because you don't feel good. Simjple as that.

[Altostrata]

You can make a delicious dressing with fresh lemon juice or apple cider vinegar with olive oil.

 

I don't believe mold can live in vinegar.

[Jason]

Does anyone else get sharp, sticky, stinging-like nerve pains and feel all "dried out" after they eat ANYTHING? I have had this ever since I moved out of the mold place. I eat anything... ANYTHING and I get a strange "sticky" like feeling all over inside, muscle weakness, tightness feelings, nerve pains that are sharp and stinging. It used to only be to foods that one would not eat on an anti-candida diet (high sugar or starchy foods), but now it's to anything, with varying degrees of severity. If it's not withdrawal related, then it has to be from mold and the mycotoxins inside me that are slowly destroying my body and brain. I do know that pretty much any and all foods can affect one during withdrawal, though. Does anything "happen" to a healthy nervous system after one eats? I imagine a whole slew of neurotransmitters and neural activity commences once a human being eats. Maybe on a botched nervous system like ones in withdrawal that's why one gets "affected" by food/eating? Just curious if anyone else gets this. It's about 15-20 minutes after eating is when it peaks and is the worst.

[Jason]

Oh btw I have to take zinc supplements now, too. I'm wondering if that's why I haven't been getting better and had been getting sicker recently. I probably no longer absorb zinc thanks to the years of Prilosec I took. I really wish I hadn't taken all that Prilosec. I'm thinking being on that was worse than the actual antidepressants, cuz I now have all these absorption issues many years later.

[Petunia]

Hi Jason,

Its good to hear that you're doing ok, and still with us.  I sometimes get reactions to eating, not exactly like you, but sometimes, if I eat more than a small snack, it will set off a strong round of symptoms, like temperature fluctuations, pins and needles feelings, not all the time, but sometimes and it doesn't relate to what I eat, just seems to be the amount, so I try and stick to small meals.

 

How long have you been taking zinc?  What dose?  Have you noticed any difference?  I took some for a week, didn't notice any improvement and thought maybe they were making me feel worse, so I stopped, but they may have been helping, many of us are zinc deficient, or so I've read.  I was on a PPI for a couple of years, on and off, not that they helped with anything, my doctor said that my constant cough and infections might be caused by acid reflux.  Funny thing was, when I stopped taking Lexapro, my cough, asthma and infections went away.

 

Sorry, I didn't mean to hijack your thread with my story.

 

I think there are lots of us here who have damaged nervous systems from multiple causes, psyche drugs being just one of them.  Since being here and learning about mold issues, I'm wondering if I was effected by the several months I spent sleeping right next to a mold infested bathroom.

 

I wonder if anyone else has reactions from eating 'anything'.

 

Petu

[Altostrata]

Once you stop Prilosec, your ability to absorb vitamins should come back.

[Jason]

Hi Petu,

 

I have been taking zinc for a little over a week now and I noticed dramatic effects after just one dose (15mg Jarrow Zinc Balance formula). Of course, it wore off quickly. I now take one or two of those a day. I also have another formula that is 30mg and contains a little bit of Vitamin B6. I've recently been taking Vitamin B6 in the P-5-P form, and it's REALLY been helping. There is something out there called pyroluria, which is where some people who are chronically sick and anxious and over stressed produce far too much of a red-blood-cell-producing byproduct toxin that has strong affinities to zinc and B6 (and a few other things), and get readily excreted in the urine, so that the body literally creates its own zinc and B6 deficiency states. I've been doing better on this combination, in addition to the other things I've been taking. I also found a better multivitamin, multimineral which helped a lot, too. The problem with being low in nutrients and then coming back, is that you'll still, for a long, long time, feel the effects of the nutrient deprivation, exacerbated even, when the nutrient for that day wears off, and you have to suffer till the next dosing or next day to feel better. This levels out over time. And yes, I do know this from experience with B12 supplementation for my very bad deficiency, which is largely corrected now. I can miss several days of B12 and not feel a thing.

 

I still feel the "sticky, dried-out, dehydrated" sensations after eating. It could be "mold flare-ups". I have no idea. It's good to hear that I'm not the only one who has strange symptoms after eating. I can get heart palpitations, too! Temperature fluctuations. It's incredible. It's worse when I'm in a time frame where zinc has "worn off" though, too. Makes me think it could also just be nervous system deregulation related. After a meal, a healthy individual is supposed to feel satisfied, full, full of a warm calm feeling. That's serotonin saying "thank you for the nutrients." If serotonin is going haywire, I'm sure that message could be ... misread?

 

On a side note, I went to Flagstaff last night as a passenger in the car so that my friend could pick up his friend at a train station. It was wonderful and this was a huge step for me (considering when I was on psych drugs I used to love to drive this just for the hell of it). On the ride up I had marginal anxiety (I had just taken some niacinamide and zinc before the ride up). On the way home I had anxiety, so severe enough that I had to take a benzo pill (I brought some with me and rarely use them), but I could feel the good effects of the vitamins wearing off. Let me tell you this, though. I enjoyed myself while there as best as I could. It was nice to feel cold, clean air for a change. And it felt like how it felt when I was there about 10 years ago and had not really been on that much psych drugs yet.

 

Some other words I had to get in - if you take zinc, don't ever take too much. You can never go over 100mg a day, and safer yet is 50 mg. If you take that much you need to also supplement a little bit of copper (the zinc balance blend by Jarrow contains a little bit of copper, as does my multivitamin/multimineral). Although, for me I am also exhibiting signs of copper toxicity. I reek of metal in my body odor. Mold has an affinity for causing high copper and low zinc in many individuals. Also, a symptom of zinc deficiency is unexplained susceptibility to infections - fungal and otherwise! You really do become "immunocompromised" when low in zinc for long enough. zinc also helps in formulation of stomach acid, so hopefully over time I will be able to create better stomach acid for better absorption of nutrients. I took Prilosec for several years and don't even really remember the specifics because my focus the last 5 years or so have been on psych drugs (which can also cause malabsorption I have to assume... at least to some degree... those things are nasty).

 

I feel I had other things to say and I can't think of them now. But that's about it for now. Yes, mold can cause a host of health problems. We likely have a leak in our house (my friend's house that I'm renting room from), and I can't use my shower as it causes the master bath wall to leak behind the mirror! The house "feels" moldy I could feel the difference coming home last night. It is going to get looked at and they're gonna have to rip down the wall they told me. Hopefully once that gets remediated and fixed real nice, any possible mold problems here will get better/go down.

 

Here is a list of everything I'm taking now. again, it seems like a lot and it is, but the doses aren't above "tolerable upper limits" for these things and I am an advocate for high dose supplementing when and where needed. I just need more right now given everything I've been through:

 

Jarrow Multivitamin/multimineral two times a day (you can take up to three according to the directions) helps A LOT

Fish oil - cheap quality brand three caps a day

zinc - 15mg - twice a day, sometimes as high as 60 mg a day helps A LOT

B12 methylcobalamin - 5000mcg a day sometimes I skip or forget - also take the adenosylcobalamin form every few days has folic acid

niacinamide - up to 750 mg a day in divided doses every several hours to avoid a niacinamide crash - helps A LOT

vitamin c - 1000 to 2000 mg a day

vitamin d - 5000 IU a day (this I can cut back on, my deficiency is resolved and my levels are very good!)

vitamin b6 - as the p-5-p form - helps A LOT about 50 mg a day

biotin - 1000 a day (not sure it does anything but this can get affected by fungus and pyroluria imbalances)

probiotic - am out right now but a new one is being shipped a very good one - these help a lot, too

 

So that's ten things. lol. I know. I used to take NOTHING but I am of the belief that even with the BEST diets one can't possibly get everything they need and some people just need more whether it’s from some traumatic health ordeal, an environmental exposure, stress, genetic dispositions to assimilation of vitamins/minerals, absorption issues, all things combined over time, etc.

 

Also I noticed that if you are low, you'll feel it when you take a supplement. For instance, I didn't feel much different on the B6. I am likely not low in it, but I felt better after a couple days and it helped with dream recall - an indication that you may need more. but the biotin? I don’t feel it. I felt better on the new multi vitamin/mineral - so there was something in it I wasn't getting but now am.

 

And of course the one thing I know I'm missing the most is a proper balance in serotonin and all the neurotransmitters - but that I refuse to touch with for example amino acids or anything and it just needs to correct on its own. Many of these vitamins and minerals are in fact cofactors or precursors to these, so taking these will help move this along anyway. For example, you cannot make serotonin without B6. It's just impossible.

 

Ok this was long but a much deserved update. I still hate that I feel all sticky and dried out and weird after I eat things and hyper react to mold. It sucks. Sucks badly.

[Jason]

Once you stop Prilosec, your ability to absorb vitamins should come back.

Thank God this isn't a life-long sentence. In 2012 I had an upper GI scope (had my stomach scoped) and they took a tissue biopsy of the stomach. They said that the stomach tissue showed evidence of drugs. Everything else during my scope looked normal except this. All those drugs I took for about ten years.  

[Jason]

So, out of curiosity I purchased some methylfolate supplements the other night, to see how I'd feel on it. Well, it makes me very calm and very sleepy.

 

Everyone, what is going on with me and needing so many supplements just to try to stay well? It really makes you wonder. I used to take nothing at all when I was in my 20s, and I was on antidepressants and benzos and drank a lot and could eat anything. I just don't understand this. Maybe antidepressants mask underlying conditions. I don't know.

 

Is anyone else seeing great improvements in their symptoms and life with supplements? I also have to remember that whatever it was I was living in in that moldy environment was really really bad. It made my friend sick for over a month and he only helped me move one day! I read that a lot of other mold survivors mainly treat their condition with mega-dose vitamins, too.

 

I just take so much now, just to feel somewhat normal, and I don't really even feel that, lol. It's just to hang on for dear life. I miss the old me, the me who could eat a cheeseburger and drink tons of beers and go out all night with friends. lol or am I just being silly since no one can be who they exactly were when they were young?

 

Also, I don't remember the specifics, but my mother took a lot, and I mean  A LOT of supplements too if memory serves me right. She always had a little pill case with her. Some of the items in it were prescription, but most were natural things like fish oil and other vitamins. I asked her why she took so much, and she'd respond "to keep me alive!" Hmm... genetic factor?

 

I just hate the not knowing the "whys" about these things, but I guess that's just life. And if I have to take these things now to feel better, I have to take them.

[Petunia]

Its good that you can take something which actually helps you to feel better, I think that as you continue to recover, you may not need to take as many supplements.  But its true that as we age, we have to take better care of ourselves.

 

How much methylfolate are you taking?  I got some a while back, not knowing if I really needed them or not and was too scared to ever take more than a quarter of a tablet.

 

I'm seeing some improvement in certain symptoms with some supplements, but nothing I would call 'great'.

[Jason]

Petu,

 

I am taking 400mcg of methyl folate. That's it! lol there is a genetic mutation that's pretty common where people cannot convert enough folic acid to folate to be used by the body. To see the rest of my supplements, scroll up a few posts. It's a lot and if my body needs it now so be it.

[Jason]

I saw a naturopath today. My first visit to one. Very interesting. He says that my gut isn't working, which I already knew, which is probably why I feel like I'm completely deteriorating. As a matter of fact, I didn't even know that I wasn't feeling my gut in a long time until I tried some zinc or B6 (not sure which of these two did it for me), and I could actually feel my intestines moving after eating a meal. The next day I had one of the most perfect looking bowel movements I had had in ... as long as I could remember. That feeling went away, though, despite the continued use of zinc and B6 and my other supplements, so I don't know what gives. The nervous system in my GI is severely not working. Because when I felt the intestines, it kind of hurt... like the nerve endings were all burned out or something. I can't really explain it.

 

I've told people time and time again that I have some sort of issue with absorping nutrients, NOT because I don't eat, but people don't believe me (because they never took 300 mg of Effexor which messed up their guts or had severe adverse reactions to Prozac which inflamed the entire nervous system). So how could they get it? I eat plenty! People have remarked on this and ... this doctor seems to get it. The unfortunate reality is that to be able to do his treatments I would have to completely use up what little money I have saved (which I actually am going to need for other things like car repairs and other medical bills, etc), and I'd have to go into credit card debt which I wouldn't be able to afford the payments because all my money used for any kind of monthly payments goes to my car and my student loans that aren't going anywhere for several years.

 

WTF? Where did I go so wrong in life? I was so smart and always got very good grades. Yet I can't earn more than I do - not with a brain and body like this. And to fix it? How do I afford to do that?

 

I really wish I had some 24/7 guardian to watch over me and my every move and tell me exactly what I'm supposed to be doing. I don't have a clue. I seriously am one step below being autistic. Seriously. I have "tested myself" online... I know not to put much stock into those tests because they are just online tests, but they really do say something about why I have such a hard time in life. I do the things doctors told me to do which was take SSRIs and SNRIs. When I wised up and realized these were making me ill, I did the sensible thing and got off of them, having a hell of time of course, and now my body is all messed up from all these experiences combined, and I still don't know what to do? Now what now what now what???

 

Oh I just bought some iron supplements, the naturopath said that he'd put me on iron. I asked him how in the heck a man needs iron and he said well you're body just isn't absorbing it. I'm not going to take very much, maybe as insurance just take some every 1-2 weeks or so. Man that stuff tastes nasty, tastes like I just ate blood.

 

So I really am no better off than I was. I smell like rotting flesh maybe my body really is rotting away. How on earth can this be happening? I'm well over two years off all serotonergics. Anyone else have such massive issues with gut absorption thanks to these drugs, too? have to take bogus amounts of supplements just to live??? Does this EVER freaking GET BETTER?! Holy cow I must have screwed up my systems so royally that I can't even absorp nutrients so my body fills with fungus and all sorts of other things. Seriously do people die from SSRI withdrawal? It must be possible, at least from these complications??? So now what am I supposed to do? Keep going to work all light-headed, with sinus problems, thinking problems, anemia like symptoms, balance issues, weak practically non-existent muscles? To make my little bitty salary cuz I can't seem to earn more given how poor my health is? And just kinda survive ? anyone else with me on this? This is ridiculous!

 

I know I am complaining and being negative but gosh darn it all. If this were any other person and I could take them from a healthy normal person where they are now and in an instant give them how I feel with the wave of a magic wand, I can guarantee you they'd all rush to the freaking emergency room hospital thinking they are going to die. I've told friends this and they say I'm probably right. But WHAT DO I DO THEN TO FIX IT?!?!?!?! GGGGGGRRRRRRRRR

 

Ok enough ranting for now. Have to figure out what to eat tonight even though 1. I'm not hungry YET AGAIN (surprise surprise) 2. After I eat I won't feel full or any different anyway 3. I probably won't absorpb half the good stuff in there 4. All fungus and yeast in me will have a ball eating off that stuff that I won't get to have and 5. I can't really afford to eat anyway CUZ I JUST DON'T HAVE NO MONEY!!!

 

God bless America

[Petunia]

Thanks for the update Jason and for writing about your naturopath experience.  I'm so sorry you are still struggling with all this, I can tell how frustrated you are.  Its seems like the more we learn and reach out for help from different kind of 'experts', the more confusing it can become, well, this is what I've found.

 

You mentioned something about sinus problems.  I was having the same thing, on and off, its been worse with withdrawal, but have had nose problems my whole life.  I've recently switched to A2 milk and have had no sinus congestion since.

 

Here is a link to a beyondmeds page with heaps of information about gut health:

 

maybe you can find some affordable alternatives there.

[Jason]

Thanks, Petu. Yes I have sinus problems that I have never had before in my entire life. They all started after I lived in that room that had mold in it. They come and go. It's an infection (not a traditional sinus infection), that just will never go away. I thought it was gone after I moved the second time. It went away for a while, at least the symptoms did. But whatever it is, I still have it. I believe I cross contaminated this house mildly having brought my computer that I had had and left it here for a couple weeks to try and sell it. The room I had left it in still smells like whatever that was that I had lived in.

 

So this is my life. Weak, full of an infection no doctor will recognize. Even the naturopath I got the impression he just wants to do all his routine stuff to me but nothing tailored specifically to what I'm going through. I have to take tons of niacinamide and zinc and a whole host of B vitamins just to somewhat function, but I really don't fully. I have graying hairs, bulging veins, little muscles for a 32 year old male, pale skin, bloody snot especially in the mornings, crawling sensations in my head and sinuses, foggy brain feels like actual brain damage. I jsut don't know what to do. I honest to god believe that if my serotonin system was working, I would have none of these problems! Serotonin is involved in healthy immune function, I think. I'm 26 months off now? Something like that. Should this still be going on??? It is funny that the "mold symptoms" I do have only affect my nervous system and ENT areas (well, immune system too but that's also could be serotonin). Nerves and ears nose throat are two areas that are sensitive to me (well, nerves only because of ssris).

[Jason]

Petu - also wanted to mention I read your sig. and you are on a lot of supplements, too, like me. I find I absolutely NEED them. Yesterday I forgot to take my morning zinc and niacinamide and felt just plain awful. Tried to eat lunch and had zero appetite. I was so confused, felt "crawling" sensations in my head, had disorganized thinking (feels like I'm going to go schizophrenic - a worry I always, always have and have had...   ), and then it dawned on me to take them! I took both of them, and felt relief in a couple hours, no joke. That scares the living daylights out of me. I don't know why all of a sudden in the last few months I've developed these vitamin dependencies.

 

Anyway, wanted to ask how you feel on them. I must say I don't feel so bad about how much of everything I take since others, especially those in this SSRI withdrawal myriad of hell, seem to need to take an awful lot, too. That naturopath doctor I visited, when I told him my concern over taking 11 different supplements throughout the day, said, 'don't worry I open 26 bottles for things each day' and I'm sure he means supplements - and he's never been through this! And he's pretty healthy looking to me.

 

I see you're also on a lot of B vitamins. Did you get tested for the MTHFR gene polymorphism? or did you just decide to take activated folate and b12? I myself have never been tested, but I figure since I'm already taking a million things it feels like, and I already take the activated form of b12, may as well take the activated form of folate as insurance. It can't hurt you. And I did notice ... "thanks" from my body for a couple weeks after I started it, so maybe I needed just a little bit more for now.

 

I miss the old me, so, so much.   I really do feel like I'm slipping into some kind of psychosis world and I will never be healthy ever again.  

[Petunia]

Anyway, wanted to ask how you feel on them.........

 

I see you're also on a lot of B vitamins. Did you get tested for the MTHFR gene polymorphism? or did you just decide to take activated folate and b12? I myself have never been tested, but I figure since I'm already taking a million things it feels like, and I already take the activated form of b12, may as well take the activated form of folate as insurance.....

 

I wish I could say that they are helping, but since I've started experimenting with these 'active' forms of B vitamins and others recommended for various mutations, I've been getting more and more confused.  I seem to get a positive reaction at first, but then crash again and end up feeling worse.  I can't figure out if I'm reacting badly because of being sensitized through withdrawal or if I really do need the supplement and I'm having a detoxification effect. Two days after I started on the P5P form of B6, I got headaches, increased sweating and a rash.   It seems like the more I learn, the more complicated it all becomes for me, and my thinking ability comes and goes along with other symptoms.

 

I start with very low doses and get a good response.  So far, the only supplements I'm sure are doing me good are magnesium, taurine, black cohosh and small amounts of niacin (the flush kind)

 

I haven't been tested, but because of my health history, I'm certain I would have some of those mutations.  I had decided that if I responded positively to some of the recommended supplement, I would go ahead and get tested through 23andme and find out for certain.  But being in withdrawal and being sensitized to a lot of things makes it more complicated.

 

I felt worse than ever this morning, full of anxiety and akathisia and was too scared to take any more B6 or anything really, so I just took a quarter of a niacin and my magnesium.  By 10:30 I had calmed down a little, so decided to try the new mthfr safe b complex formula which I had ordered.  I took half a capsule.  Within 2 hours, I was feeling relaxed and had fallen back to sleep, until my phone woke me.... so now I don't know what to do again.     I went to the bathroom and my urine was bright yellow!  That's new, I'm wondering if that could have happened in just 2 hours.

 

Its good that you get definite positive reactions to what you take, I see that as a sign that your body needs it.  I sometimes worry about psychosis too, but I think its because  our lives are  different  from that of most people, it can make us feel isolated and out of touch with reality, but this isn't real psychosis.  Its good we are able to relate to people in similar situations online.

 

I have appetite problems the same as you, I find it difficult to eat at all before mid afternoon, and then, its like I rarely feel like anything or enjoy anything, so it makes it hard to get enough nutrition naturally.

 

 

Even the naturopath I got the impression he just wants to do all his routine stuff to me but nothing tailored specifically to what I'm going through.

 

I think its difficult to find an experienced naturopath who is familiar with the latest research.  Although I have stumbled onto a few sites which offer specific testing and then will work with you on an individual basis, it looks expensive though.   Dr Amy Yasko, does testing and will tailor specific programs based on tests.  But I don't recommend it or even know how successful it is, just mentioning it, and I doubt she would know anything about the drug withdrawal factor.

 

Hang in there Jason, we all heal eventually, if we give it enough time.  Take care of yourself the best you can.

[Jason]

Hmmm... I want to learn how to quote like Petu replied to me, quoting bits and pieces of my post and responding to those pieces. I used to know how to do this on PaxilProgress with HTML coding. hmmm... This - this is how far reduced my brain power is.

[Jason]

I seem to get a positive reaction at first, but then crash again and end up feeling worse.

This is actually very normal once starting vitamin supplementation, especially if you have been low for a long period of time. I've had this with nearly everything that I've taken. Read some of those posts where I was panicking during those crashes from the niacinamide. You'll read it in my text. It takes a long time of routine dosings for these to build back up in your system so there is less "up-and-down." I had this so, so severely on B12. It was hellish, almost worse than withdrawal.

 

I can't figure out if I'm reacting badly because of being sensitized through withdrawal or if I really do need the supplement and I'm having a detoxification effect. Two days after I started on the P5P form of B6, I got headaches, increased sweating and a rash.

You probably aren't going through any detoxification effect, although I am not sure. With the B6, those reactions sound very similar to those who have had bad reactions to SSRIs! B6 is the last step in serotonin synthesis. Maybe your body made a whole lot of serotonin with the influx of P-5-P, which caused your sensitive nervous system to react badly. After I started B6, the second or third day, I "felt" my lower gut (intestines), and it was somewhat good to finally feel that and realize this is probably why I'm having all these absorption issues for the last couple years, but the sensation also felt like the nerve endings were all "burnt out" as there was a lot of stinging pain. My body probably finally made some excess serotonin which I could feel as a "bad" reaction. Didn't stop me from taking the B6, though, as I feel better on it than without it (I can recall dreams now, finally).

 

 

I haven't been tested, but because of my health history, I'm certain I would have some of those mutations.  I had decided that if I responded positively to some of the recommended supplement, I would go ahead and get tested through 23andme and find out for certain.  But being in withdrawal and being sensitized to a lot of things makes it more complicated.

I hope I haven't been feeding you information, lol. I checked out your thread and see you've been exploring MTHFR and pyroluria. I'm sorry if I'm planting bad habits into others' thinking. But these things are worth thinking about. With MTHFR, you may as well just take the activated folate and B12 and skip wasting money on the test. Does it really matter if you have it or not? Two simple, inexpensive vitamins takes care of this anyway. Pyroluria is a little more complex, but again, it's just addition of some vitamins and minerals that we all need anyway. I'm not going to test for either one. Plus, if you do test you have to stop the supplementation for some time, which does not sound like a good option for me.

 

I felt worse than ever this morning, full of anxiety and akathisia and was too scared to take any more B6 or anything really, so I just took a quarter of a niacin and my magnesium.  By 10:30 I had calmed down a little, so decided to try the new mthfr safe b complex formula which I had ordered.  I took half a capsule.  Within 2 hours, I was feeling relaxed and had fallen back to sleep, until my phone woke me.... so now I don't know what to do again.     I went to the bathroom and my urine was bright yellow!  That's new, I'm wondering if that could have happened in just 2 hours.

What is the MTHFR safe B Complex formula? Do you have a link to it? Bright yellow pee comes from riboflavin excess (vitamin B2). Does this complex contain any riboflavin? Not harmful at all, btw.

 

 

I sometimes worry about psychosis too, but I think its because  our lives are  different  from that of most people, it can make us feel isolated and out of touch with reality, but this isn't real psychosis.  Its good we are able to relate to people in similar situations online.

My mom told me that my father was diagnosed with schizophrenia. I never knew about this till she said something. He was a chronic alcoholic (probably still is - I haven't talked to him in about 10 years). It (the alcoholism) would explain this. Or that he may have had pyroluria too? Lots of people with these issues drink. That's why I worry I'll get schizophrenia. I mean, read my above posts for goodness sakes! Mold? Being infected with something that's taking over my nervous system. You don't think I sit down and cry that I really may be going mad beyond control with this? And that someday I may get locked up and forced anti-psychotics for life, and may have to kiss everything I know goodbye? Scares the living daylights out of me. I'm already having a hard enough time functioning. I really, really do worry about this. I don't know what I'd do if I found myself in that kind of a situation. My life, and any health I have left, would be over.

 

 

I have appetite problems the same as you, I find it difficult to eat at all before mid afternoon, and then, its like I rarely feel like anything or enjoy anything, so it makes it hard to get enough nutrition naturally.

I really think serotonin is to blame for this. It's a major player in appetite and enjoying food. If that's broken, you have little appetite and things don't feel good. I honestly don't get very "hungry/full" anymore. The B6 and zinc have helped that a little bit, but not much. I also want to say that this takes it a step further and if you don't have these normal cycles, you don't absorb nutrients as efficiently. Because it is almost as if the body really doesn't "know" that it's time to digest and digest properly. I mean, read Alexejice's thread for goodness sakes! You can't tell me all of his lower gut problems are not from this. Our bodies have two brains, you know. One in our head and also our gut nervous system. Science has proven that the two can work and function and "think" independent of each other. There is a nerve line that connects them both, and researchers have discovered if this nerve is severed, that they both continue to work independent of each other. Absolutely amazing.

 

 

Hang in there Jason, we all heal eventually, if we give it enough time.  Take care of yourself the best you can.

Thanks. I sure hope we do. Oh- I learned how to do the post quoting the way I wanted to! And found the HMTL way to do it! So, go me for today I learned something new. Now if I could just get my left arm/hand/fingers to work and not feel like I have ALS coming on, that'd be great...

[Petunia]

You did great with the multi-quoting, I don't know how to do it the HTML way, not sure how I do it actually.  I would love to write more, but I'm tired from my afternoon organic food shopping, it doesn't take much to tire me.

 

Here is the link to the Thorn Research page on iHerb, re: MTHFR safe b nutrients, they have a lot of supplements made for people with unique requirements

 

http://www.iherb.com/Thorne-Research 

 

the one I got is called 'basic B complex'

 

Please don't worry about planting bad thinking seeds and leading me anywhere, I rarely believe what I read these days, it takes a lot to make me think something has some credibility, but I do think there is some value in individualized nutrition therapy, it just makes sense to me, more than many other theories.  Problem is, its so complicated and every person is unique, so its always going to be time consuming and expensive.

 

 

[Jason]

Thanks for the info and the link, Petu. I think I have seen that B complex before. It is one of the few B complexes out there that contains the B's in activated form.

 

Don't worry about not writing much. I don't feel like writing much myself today. It does not take a lot to run me down, either. I can't stand having no energy. It's a b****. Not going to be a good day I can already tell.

[Jason]

Update - I knew today wouldnt' be a good day.

 

I have been having thoughts again of not being around anymore. Don't worry or panic - I don't have a plan and wouldn't even know how to go about it. And I do not have the guts. I am a big time wussy in life, so why would ending it be any different? Let alone, all that doesn't matter, because one can still have the thoughts.

 

I just don't feel good. Ever. I took some of that iron supplement today and I thought I felt better but it made me feel kind of crazy and it made whatever I have living in me flare up.

 

My body is deteriorating. I haven't eaten all day because I have no appetite. I mean, if this is all because of eating then maybe I don't eat good enough. I am sorry but I can't figure this out then and doctors can't help me. I don't know how much to eat and from where to get all nutrients. Doctors won't help me with vitamins or supplements, except for a naturopath whom I can't afford. I can't really afford all the food it would take for my body to stay alive and healthy. And I have some kind of infection after having lived in a place with strange mold spores.

 

I can't take this. I don't feel good ever, and this is not a fair burden to place on someone. Doctors don't help me. I don't know how to solve this on my own. Therefore, I don't want to be alive anymore.

[Jason]

Update

 

I am really not doing well healthwise. I just don't know what's wrong. I have been still having strange scary symptoms that I can't even explain in words, on a daily basis. Some are quite scary. I'll get sensations that I'm walking on a wobbly board of some kind, my balance and neurological integrity is so challenged. Iron as a supplement is also a no-go. It made whatever is living in me srpout like crazy and I became very ill. Apparently critters that live in us love free iron in the blood, which is probably why I started to get "kinda anemic feeling" a few weeks ago. My iron isn't low! It was just being robbed from me. I'm going to try some lactoferritin to see if this helps correct this. It captures free iron in the bloodstream and provides it to your tissues so other critters like candida and other bacteria and things can't steal it from you first. It is also supposed to help fight fungus from getting into your body through secretion areas like the eyes (tears), nose (mucous), mouth (saliva) etc. I could be low in lactoferritin. I never drink milk. Ever. I hate it always have - as a kid I poured it down the drain and told my mother I drank it. (not that that worked lol)

 

Today I felt like I was going to die. I couldn't breathe properly and felt a racing pulse and felt like my cognition and awareness of the world was going away. I did deep breathing and that helped - my skin was going white as a ghost and then the color kinda came back. Not that I have much color in my skin anymore these days anyway.

 

It seems I am doing worse today than I did a couple years ago in "acute withdrawal." Whatever that hell that is anyway even. I'm just so tired of this. Been so ill in varying levels of difficulty and varying symptoms since about 2007. If you count antidepressant "good years for me" (whatever the f- that is too), then this **** has been going on since 2002. And to be honest, all my life I've never really "felt good" completely all the time. It was much better in teen years, though. 18-20 wereactually some of my happiest and healthiest years.

 

It is not fair. Some people just generally don't get to feel good. Ever. Yet we as a socity expect so much from them that others with healthy nervous and immune systems take for granted. They have to work and pay debts and everything else. I feel I can barely function. I will never have my own place. I'm too sick. I can't "advance in a career." I'm tooooo sick. Relationships again? Too sick. I feel like I have AIDS or something, yet no one will help me and I have to just keep living? Wow. I really did almost think I was going to die today. I was at a stoplight cars ahead and behind me - nowhere for me to go. I really am terrified of death and dying and what it will feel and be like and what situation I will be in. I don't socialize with anyone ever so if it does happen I feel I would be so embarrassed. Like I would die waiting in line somewhere waiting for something, and stranges would see me collapse. Scares me to death. I guess you have no control over it though. If it is going to happen it is just going to happen.

 

I really can't believe I'm typing these words at my age. Hell, even while on antidepressants I had my **** together better than this. Even if I was really really messed up on them. And I mean REALLY messed up.

 

So, normalcy, I guess we shall never meet. Or maybe we were together from approximately my birth to again, about age 19-20 or 21 or so. I really miss you. I wish we could get back together. But I don't know if fate holds that for me anymore.

 

Sigh, I really am negative, aren't I?

[Jason]

PS to my update - I guess it don't help (grammar error my emphaisis) that I have been infatuated with 90s grunge Seattle-type music the last few days. My brain just mysteriously went there for some reason. Was never a fan of this type of music much when it really was the 90s. So I don't know where this is coming from.

 

On a side note, though, Kurt Cobain was SO ABSOLUTELY CUTE OMG. Wow what a cute guy he was. It really is too bad what happened to him...

[Jason]

Sorry had to post more. I find comfort in this.

 

My immune system is so severely compromised.   I take zinc, vitamin C.  But I have read that serotonin has a major role in immune function (quel f-fing surprise). Seriously I feel constantly "infected." I have malaise symptoms come and go, and sometimes they really take everything out of me. I have these nodules that come and go in the back of my neck. Asked my allopathic doctor what they are, and he said they're just oils that build up back there deep beneath the skin and that if they are a nuissance enough they can be surgically removed. Ugh. He really doesn't get it. If I were to do that I'd have to have surgery like every week as new ones are constantly appearing. They're a sign of infection! They come on strong usually from breif mold exposures. Air conditioning has been affecting me now. It's ridiculous. Why o why did I live in that horrible place in 2012? Oh, right, I was only three months off meds and could BARELY FUNCTION let alone care enough about where I lived. I am so, so sick from that exposre and reduced serotonin. I am in states of near-constant inflammation. No wonder I'm so so sick. And serotonin is the body's natural anti-inflammatory.