Kitson: tapering from Remeron

[Kitson]

Hi I'm new here although I have been lurking for a couple months.

 

Long story short, I ended up on Remeron this past February after my brain went 'tilt' and I went into a severe depression brought about by severe insomnia brought about by my body going into perimenopause.

 

I am one of the ones who truly needed medication and I am fortunate that the first med they put me on was successful in curbing the depression.

 

But I've put on over 30 lbs and I am tired of not feeling 'myself' and having no motivation.

 

I started tapering in October. I am now down to 24 mg of Remeron. The only W/D symptoms I've had so far was, twice I was woken up from a sound sleep from early morning cortisol surges.

 

I am doing the 10% of your last dose method that I found on this forum. Only problem is that my scale goes down only to .01 grams instead of .001 grams. I'm hoping my taper goes well enough that I won't need to purchase another scale but I will if it becomes necessary.

 

Today is the first time I feel more 'normal' than I ever have since this whole ordeal started. I actually baked some pumpkin bread. And I actually feel like doing some house cleaning - something that has gone by the wayside since this past February.

 

So I thought I'd post here that way I can kinda keep track and have an anonymous journal of sorts.

 

Thanks to those who have contributed all of the valuable information in this forum. I wouldn't have felt comfortable starting a taper without it. I probably would have asked my Dr. who most likely would have had me taper much too fast.

 

 

Edited May 27, 2017 by scallywag
tags

[Jemima]

Welcome to the forum, Kitson. I'm glad that it's been a help to you already and that you're taking the taper very slowly.

[tezza]

Hi Kitson,

 

Welcome! I'm glad you decided to join!

 

I'm tapering Remeron, too; I make mine into a liquid, it's much easier to measure an accurate dose. It also allows for the tiniest decrements.

[Kitson]

Hi Tezza,

 

I may end up making mine into a liquid when my decrements get a lot smaller - have to wait and see. How are you doing it - can you describe your process to me? Do you make some up every night and take it, or do you make enough to last a few days?

 

How long does it take you to mix it up?  Right now, I'm just cutting a pill and weighing it. Takes me 3-4 minutes tops. I'm afraid that if the process takes too much longer than that or is too fiddly I just won't want to do it on those nights when I get home real late or when we're traveling and our daily routine is thrown off. Not that we travel that much, but enough to have to put some thought into how this will all work when traveling, or those odd random nights when we get home real late from some event.

 

When did you start tapering off the Remeron? Are you having any withdrawal issues?

[tezza]

Hi, Kitson,

 

I started tapering Remeron in July 2012, from 30 mg. I've had a smooth taper so far, thankfully.

 

It takes me five minutes tops, to mix. I have some 30 mg and 15 mg pills. I crush the pill in the bottom of a shot glass with the butt of a butter knife. Then, I mix that with an equal amount of water, 30 mg pill with 30 mL of water....or 15 mg with 15 mL of water. I keep the solution in the fridge and draw out my dose each night. It will keep for two weeks in the fridge so at my current dose I only have to mix every 10 or 14 days, depending on which pill I crush.

 

When I travel, I just take my knife and shot glass along with the two medicine cups I store it in. I use those plastic cups that come on top of cough syrup. One cup is slightly smaller around than the other and it fits (upside down) just inside the top ring of the bottom cup. I measure my water with the cup I store my solution in. It has a 15mL mark and a 30mL mark.

 

When I take my dose I press the top cup snugly into the storage cup (top inside top or mouth to mouth) and shake the suspension around and draw out the dose before it settles again. It's very simple! I paid almost $100 for a scale when I was trying to measure Risperdal and I was worried about accuracy because when I weighed the same piece more than once, I'd get a different number. (I'm tapering multiple drugs).

 

I was nervous about mixing my own, at first, but it's very easy. I've micro tapered down to 1.5 mg of Remeron. I should add, just to clarify, I left off Remeron 30mg and tried to switch to a different med. I left it off for a week and although was taking a similar AD in its place, was feeling it. I reinstated 7.5mg of Remeron and stabilized on that, so I've been tapering 7.5mg since last year.

 

Wish you well!

 

Here is a link with more info on mixing:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

Edited November 12, 2013 by tezza
Added link

[Kitson]

Okay, that helps a lot! Thanks for the info. Good to know that you can mix up two weeks worth ahead of time.

 

For some reason I was thinking it would be much more involved than that.

 

I'll have to look into getting those little cough medicine cups and a 1ml syringe. I did look at my usual pharmacy for the syringe but the smallest they had was 3ml.

[tezza]

The cups I have came off two different meds, the one I use for a cover only goes up to 25mL. Others use a bottle, I'm sure, for storage. This was just what I had and it's worked fine.

 

Here's the link with more info:

 

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/2693-how-to-make-a-liquid-from-tablets-or-capsules/

[tezza]

Some people get theirs mixed by a compounding pharmacy. I can't afford it and don't want to have to go to the pharmacy every two weeks.

 

You would need a prescription for it to be compounded.

 

It's easier for me to mix my own but I wanted to share that, in case, you'd prefer it.

 

I was antsy about mixing my own, at first, too. Now, it's as easy as brushing my teeth and takes about the same amount of time (to mix).

[Kitson]

I will most likely mix up my own if I get to that point. Easier and cheaper that way.

 

I was just reading your sig, your tapers are coming along wonderfully. Last time I looked, you were at (I think) 1.7mg Remeron and it wasn't very long ago.

 

It's been twelve days that I've been on 24mg and I feel pretty good. I've had two episodes of what I think were neuro-anger. I got highly pissed at DH over stupid things - but I kept it internalized so I didn't lash out at him. And at the same time I was stuck in no-motivation mode. But it all passed. I find that a hot soak in the tub with Epsom salts and lavender oil very soothing when I'm feeling like that.

[Kitson]

I tapered down to 20 mgs of Remeron - and all of my symptoms started coming back. I was in hell with insomnia, chills, no appetite - missed a day of work and started making errors at work because of the insomnia.

 

I came to the realization that I still do need the meds. I was disappointed and scared at first but worked through it to a place of acceptance, knowing that at least there is a med that helps me live a normal life. So I'm back up to 30 mgs. Maybe I will attempt another taper in the future but for now I know that its too soon.

 

I'm grateful for this forum, there is so much knowledge on here for those who are suffering with symptoms from tapering/withdrawal/ct from AD's and my heart breaks when I read your stories.

 

Merry Christmas - I wish you all health, happiness, peace and joy.

[Altostrata]

Kitson, developing withdrawal symptoms does not mean you "need" the drug. It means you should taper more gradually. Rebound insomnia is very common with Remeron withdrawal.

 

Happy holidays to you!

[wulfgar]

Rebound insomnia is the most prominent wd for me when tapering mirtazapin/remeron. It kicks at 5-7 days and again at about 21 days for each reduction.

 

I suggest you stay at 24 mg and stabilize there.

[Kitson]

I'm back. Somehow I remembered my username so I didn't have to re-register.

 

I came off my HRT patch a year ago and I'm feeling much better. I am in a much better place to try and taper.

 

I am currently at 23mgs.

 

I'm going to cut down to 22 mgs later this month and I'm going to hold there for a while, I think. Or at least make smaller decrements. There are changes at my job and I'm going to be much busier through the end of the year at least.

[ChessieCat]

Hi Kitson and welcome back,

 

It sounds like things are going well for you.  Just be aware that any changes can cause us stress, even good changes!  Making small reductions is a good idea.  Remember to keep daily notes and listen to your body.

 

It's also good to learn non-drug techniques to cope:

 

Claire Weekes' Method of Recovering from a Sensitized Nervous System

Non-drug techniques

 

Dr Joseph Glenmullen's Withdrawal Symptoms

[Kitson]

Thanks ChessieCat and thanks for the links.

 

There really is a lot of good info on this board.

[Kitson]

Nothing much to report on my taper at the moment. I'm going to go from 23mg to 22mg in a week - on 5/20/17. May hold there for awhile.

 

My coworker found another job and I will be doing double duty for several months. The good news is that I have been told they will promote me to her position (she is one level above me) and then hire someone to take my position. Nothing is official yet but that's what my supervisor told me. I'm also going to work with my supervisor to show her what I do. For various reasons, I'm now the only person in my dept. who knows how to do my job so she needs to know. What if I end up sick or something? She needs to know at least some of what I do.

 

BUT - I applied for another position on a lark - and they want to interview me!  This job will be more money and more responsibility and some room to grow. The position in my current dept. that I am being promoted to is just a little more money and I will dead-end there.

 

So we'll see what happens. Just because I'm interviewed doesn't mean they will hire me. But either way, I win

 

So, big changes ahead for me. I'm going to hold my taper at 22mg until I have a better idea of what my future will be like. The last thing I need is to go into some withdrawal symptoms in the middle of employment changes. Last taper attempt, I tried to go from 22mg to 20mg and crashed and burned.

 

I've purchased a graduated cylinder and a 1ml eyedropper - I don't need them now, but planning ahead. All I need is a pill crusher and a syringe. For when my taper gets low enough to have to make my own liquid remeron.

 

I have a great nurse practitioner who is all for me tapering at my own pace.

 

I need to get off this isht.  I've gained sixty pounds. I need my life and health back.

 

All in good time though. 3KIS, right?

[Kitson]

It's been four days since I tapered down another milligram. So far, so good. I had one night of some insomnia which led to feeling crappy the next day, and a day where I felt out of sorts but overall I feel pretty good. So lately I'm tapering roughly 5%  which seems to working for me so I'm going to stick to that percentage for now.

 

I'm doing my best to keep my magnesium intake up, sometimes its a struggle because I am getting more forgetful as I get older. I'm waiting until I run out of my current supply of magnesium because I want to try another form because the citrate has too much of a laxative effect. I'm also adding a second fish oil capsule a day.

 

Seems like right now the lower I get on the mirtazapine the better I feel. I hope this continues and I can eventually be free of it. Members like Hibari and Brassmonkey are inspiring and show that this can be done.

 

 

[Kitson]

I have had a low-grade headache for the last two days. Feels different from my usual headaches.

 

Are headaches a withdrawal symptom?

[KarenB]

A very common w/d symptom - you're in good company! 

[Kitson]

Thanks KarenB. Good to know!

 

Ibuprofen made it go away, eventually. But it came back.

 

Right after I posted, I went back to work and felt very out of sorts for a few hours, along with the headache. But it passed. I can tell hubby is secretly disappointed because he thought I was going to cook dinner but I didn't feel like it. He's got his eye on these pork chops in the refrigerator LOL Maybe tomorrow I'll cook them for him.

[Kitson]

I'm having headaches on and off. Migraine in the middle of the night last night.

 

Taking ibuprofen for the headaches/migraine but I had to stop taking the fish oil, as they both thin the blood out and I get nosebleeds.

 

My head feels 'fuzzy' or 'stuffy" for lack of a better term.

 

And my mood - really irritable in the mornings but it feels different from a normal bad mood or perimenopause hormonal bad mood. I can't really describe it. I notice it gets better if I get up and move around and do things. It also helps to stay cool and hydrated in this summer heat. Doing my very best not to bite hubby's head off.

 

None of this is intolerable but I definitely feel different. Glad I'm taking my taper slow, I hate to think of how I would feel if I were trying to taper faster.

 

 

[Kitson]

Oh and I forgot about the sore on my lip that happened about a week ago. A side effect of Remeron, mouth/lip sores. This is the third time. I can't wait to be completely off of this drug.

[Kitson]

Okay my w/d symptoms have stopped and last night was my first night at 20mg. Keeping my fingers crossed!

 

I have to say, I've been getting the full RDA of magnesium from my cal/mag supplement for the last couple of months and I have been feeling so much better. I've been taking magnesium for a few years now but not the full dose. I ordered some magnesium malate as I want to start taking the magnesium by itself since calcium can be activating, and I want a form of magnesium that won't give me the laxative effect. Supposed to be delivered on Wed.

 

 

[Kitson]

Woke up with a wicked headache in my forehead this morning.  I took an ibuprofen and prayed for it to hurry up and work. Was nauseated too. Debated whether to call in to work or not. The ibuprofen kicked in and I went to work. I feel fine now but wow. I can't wait to be off of this drug.

[Kitson]

Have not had a headache again. But something interesting happened today. I found myself thinking an old thought pattern that brought on some subtle feelings. Which was awesome even though it only lasted seconds. That hasn't happened since I started taking remeron/mirtazapine. On the drug, I do get feelings, but not like I used to. I think you guys know what I mean. I was thinking (about the subtle feelings), "Hi, old friend! Nice to see you for a minute!"

 

A question: Any of you ever get where you feel like your facial muscles have a hard time relaxing? Sometimes I have to consciously tell my facial muscles, mostly my cheekbone/upper jaw muscles, to relax.

 

Oh and another thing, I have learned that I need to double check my dose after weighing. I re-weighed my pills that I cut (my current dose) and one was slightly over, and a second one was solidly 1 mg overweight.  I need to weigh them twice from now on as my dosage gets lower.

[Kitson]

Okay so I just figured out why my cheeks/face feels so tight.

 

I was pushing around on my face and found some very painful spots. Did some google searching. I have trigger points in my left masseter (jaw) muscle. I had a lengthy and somewhat traumatic root canal a couple of months ago on the left side. Stress and dental work can cause trigger points. Which can also lead to TMJ syndrome. And cause headaches. I watched a couple of videos on trigger point release in the masseter muscles. Tried it and it really hurt like heck but it sure made it feel better. Now its feeling very stingy - Iactic acid buildup was released.

 

Thought I'd mention it in case anyone on here is having jaw pain/headaches/tmj.

 

[Starboy17]

this mirtazapine med has been a pure nightmare for me to.  I had a brief honeymoon for probably no more than 3months until I noticed memory issues, which was a major concern for me as I've always had a very decent memory, every time I taper and lately its only been 5%. I went from 3mg to 2.8mg last month and the 3rd week the symptoms were in full swing, been feeling a little discouraged of late as the waves are at their worst in months, muscle aches & pains, fatigue.  I so so so want off this and to start doing things I want to do in my life

 

 

[Kitson]

Starboy, I've been having some memory issues too but I've chalked it up to being middle-aged, I never thought it might be related to the drug. Wake up call for me. Thank you for that. I'm sorry you're having a tough time right now. I'll pray for you that you get a window soon. Hang in there.

 

HOPE = Hold On, Pain Ends

[Starboy17]

Kitson I myself have experienced similar feelings, like a part of my old self was subtly re-emerging.  I love the HOPE message, I really absolutely needed it today, my body has been aching severe

[Kitson]

I'm sending positive vibes your way Starboy

[Starboy17]

Kitson, Thanks heaps for the positive vibes, I'm finally stabilizing on 2.8mg, its was painful, but bit by bit the windows are getting bigger & better, I love the feeling of my old self re-emerging, my mischievous upbeat personality is rising to the surface.  I missed the clarity in my thinking whilst on the higher doses of mirt. I know i have still some time to go but least i'm not aching all over now, and my energy is also improving. 

[Kitson]

Starboy that is wonderful to hear!

[Kitson]

Loads of anxiety the last week. But this is NOT due to tapering. I requested a refill on my Temazepam last Tuesday (Aug 1st) and the Dr's office did not approve the refill. I called them on Friday and they have changed their office hours, they now close at noon on Fridays. I called after 1pm.

 

I'm sure it will be fine. I will call them tomorrow morning to ask them the status of my refill and tell them I am out of Temazepam.  I do have an appointment next month to see my Dr. 

 

I have such PTSD around insomnia. I have tried everything anyone has ever come up with for insomnia. You name it, I've tried it. Except hypnotherapy. I am trying to find a hypnotherapist that is not too ridiculously far away that is also a real, board-certified hypnotherapist. A real hypnotherapy practitioner, not one that's like "here, hold these crystals while I chant over you". There seems to be a lot of those around here. Nothing against anyone who believes in crystals and chanting. It just wouldn't work for me, is all.

[Kitson]

Problem solved. I called the Dr's office, they never received the faxed request from the pharmacy. I called the pharmacy and asked them to fax it again. Got the recorded message my prescription is ready so I can pick it up tomorrow morning. Whew.

 

In other news, I'm down to 19 mgs of remeron for two days now. I felt pretty out of sorts today but nothing I couldn't handle. Just weird-weepy and kind of out of it. And I got another headache tonight. I'm trying a 5% decrease every three weeks and see how that works. 

 

I like that tapering spreadsheet that somebody posted that you can download. Really handy. Just plug in the numbers to figure out how much your next decrease is and what date to start your new dose. Thank you very much to whoever created it.

[Kitson]

I took the day off work today because somehow in the middle of the night I managed to scratch my cornea. Woke up with it at 3:30am and it was hard to get back to sleep with it and my eye was sore and kept watering. I made a gauze patch and wore that for a few hours and it helped.

 

I cut another batch of remeron pills today down to19mg since I had the time. I noticed that it's getting a little harder to cut the pills and weigh them as my dosage decreases. Three that I cut were too small so I had to weigh them with added fragments. So I decided just as an experiment to crush a pill and add it to water to see how it would do in a suspension. Because eventually I will go to a liquid taper anyways. I crushed it with the bottom of a butter knife inside a one-cup wide mouth mason jar and added 30 ml of water that i measured with my new graduated cylinder. It looks like it dissolved/suspended pretty well. The experiment was a success so when I get to that point I know how to make a liquid suspension now.

 

And this time I'm holding for four weeks instead of three because hubby and I decided to take a trip out of town right when I would have to decrease again and I don't want to throw a monkey wrench in the works and possibly feel bad from w/d while out of town so I will hold for a bit longer..

[Kitson]

Down to 18 mg as of the 22nd, so far so good.