NoMeaning25 Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 This has probably been asked, but i have just wondered. Most people who are still bad at 10 years out was on paxil (Buxy, Paul, Squirrel) Is it true that paxil is the worst in regards to withdrawal severity and length of withdrawal? Any studies on this? Sorry, im 22 months off with no improvements and really feeling sorry for myself :'( Maybe its because i was on paxil, although my time exposure on paxil was only 2 years... before that i was on celexa for 2 years. Im just looking for answers really. I just dont understand, how is it possible that i am so severe at 22 months off? The indescribable fear that i am stuck like this forever is unrelenting and i need relief Was on Citalopram 20mg since Feb 2008 - switched to Paxil 20mg in August 2010 Tapered way too fast in April 2012 by skipping days. Taper completed in 6 weeks Tried prozac 20mg for 3 days - felt spaced out, not better. Tried 30mg Cymbalta for 2 days. SEVERE ADVERSE REACTION Antidepressant free since 14 August 2012 Birth control on and off during this time - Last taken 18 June 2017 - Morning after pill Started mainly using 0.5mg Xanax beginning 2016 for severe panic attacks and anxiety due to trauma Xanax on and off never more than 0.5mg at a time, never taking it 3 days in a row - used sparingly 6 Years antidepressant free - Still in severe withdrawal with over 60 symptoms Severe setback started May 2018 with no let up to date. Developed many new symptoms like tremors, inner vibrations, insomnia, visual distortions and dr/dp are 100x worse, i have severe sensitivity to movement, My dizziness and vertigo got worse and it now feels like im constantly rocking on a boat, my anxiety is sky high, suicidal idiation is back, i feel extremely brain damaged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudius Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 I only used Paxil so cannot compare them, but I think is is the worst indeed. I cannot imagine how something could be worst than Paxil WD. Also for me it took almost 2 years to experience a first window. And many many years afterwards to feel close to recovery. Did you stop cold turkey or taper off? 10 mg Paxil/Seroxat since 2002 several attempts to quit since 2004 Quit c/t again Oktober 2007, in protracted w/d since then after 3.5 years slight improvement but still on the road after 6 years pretty much recovered but still some nasty residual sypmtons after 8.5 years working again on a 90% base and basically functioning normally again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoMeaning25 Posted June 11, 2014 Author Share Posted June 11, 2014 I tapered off during a 6 week period by skipping dosages... I dont know whats worse, skipping or cold turkey!!! Was on Citalopram 20mg since Feb 2008 - switched to Paxil 20mg in August 2010 Tapered way too fast in April 2012 by skipping days. Taper completed in 6 weeks Tried prozac 20mg for 3 days - felt spaced out, not better. Tried 30mg Cymbalta for 2 days. SEVERE ADVERSE REACTION Antidepressant free since 14 August 2012 Birth control on and off during this time - Last taken 18 June 2017 - Morning after pill Started mainly using 0.5mg Xanax beginning 2016 for severe panic attacks and anxiety due to trauma Xanax on and off never more than 0.5mg at a time, never taking it 3 days in a row - used sparingly 6 Years antidepressant free - Still in severe withdrawal with over 60 symptoms Severe setback started May 2018 with no let up to date. Developed many new symptoms like tremors, inner vibrations, insomnia, visual distortions and dr/dp are 100x worse, i have severe sensitivity to movement, My dizziness and vertigo got worse and it now feels like im constantly rocking on a boat, my anxiety is sky high, suicidal idiation is back, i feel extremely brain damaged Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Addax Posted June 11, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted June 11, 2014 Your question caught my eye and I did a quick search and came upon this article: "SSRIs and SNRIs: A review of the Discontinuation Syndrome in Children and Adolescents" by Sheik Hosenbocus, MD,and Raj Chahal, MSW2 (J Can Acad Child Adolesc Psychiatry. Feb 2011; 20(1): 60–67.) Although the article is discussing children and adolescents the literature cited is from adult populations. There is almost no data on kids regarding discontinuation. The article doesn't talk about longterm or protracted withdrawal but it does suggest that Paxil withdrawal, at least in the short term, is "the worst." This doesn't mean that Paxil is necessarily associated more with protracted withdrawal than other SSRIs, but if it's the worst in terms of early withdrawal it suggests to me there may be more going on than with other SSRIs and that being the "worst" MAY apply to the longterm as well. I'm including some quotes from the literature review portion of article, but I want to include a caveat. This is just one article on the topic. If you read the entire article keep in mind that some of the information on the length of withdrawal and tapering is scantly informed and the literature review is not exhaustive' AND it doesn't take into account the multitude of anecdotal evidence supplied by the hundreds and even thousands of cases of people like the ones on this site. So please, if you read the full article, do so critically! The last quote I included is just a general statement, but I liked what it said.. The quotes from the article: "All SSRIs have been implicated including fluoxetine, sertraline, paroxetine, fluvoxamine, citalopram and lately escitalopram, although the respective reactions may not be of equal severity." "The severity of the discontinuation syndrome is not the same for each SSRI. It seems to be related to the drug’s half- life. The shorter the half-life the quicker the drug will be eliminated and the more common is the discontinuation reaction (Coupland et al., 1996, Judge, Quail & Jacobson, 2002)." "many reports indicate that the most common or severe reactions occur with paroxetine, intermediate ones with fluvoxamine and sertraline and the least common or severe ones with fluoxetine. " "Paroxetine was associated with 13 symptoms out of a 17 item scale, 3 out of 17 for sertraline and up to the fifth day no symptoms for fluoxetine (Haddad, 2001). " "Paroxetine has been associated with more frequent discontinuation symptoms than the other SSRIs. The rate of discontinuation with paroxetine has been reported at 34.5% compared to placebo at 13.5% in a 12 week double-blind placebo-controlled study (Haddad, 2001). An analysis of the rate of discontinuation syndrome in the United Kingdom, expressed per 1000 prescriptions written, revealed that the rate for paroxetine was over 100 times higher than fluoxetine and 10 times higher than sertraline or fluvoxamine (Haddad, 2001). Symptoms even occur during tapering of paroxetine (Black et al., 2000)." "The rates also seem to differ in different studies. A comparison study reported the incidence of the discontinuation syndrome as 20% for paroxetine, 14% for fluvoxamine, 2.4% for sertraline and 0% for fluoxetine (Coupland et al., 1996). Yet another study reported a frequency of 42% in the paroxetine group and 9% in the fluoxetine group (Bogetto, Bellino, Revello & Patria, 2002). A randomized controlled trial comparing 3 SSRIs found the highest incidence with paroxetine (66%) followed by sertraline (60%) and the lowest incidence (14%) was with fluoxetine (Warner et al, 2006)." "There is still a need to identify this condition early as failure to recognize discontinuation symptoms may lead the physician to think that a relapse of the treated condition is occurring and he/she may re-start treatment with the same medication instead of dealing with the discontinuation symptoms. The patient feels better once back on the SSRI. A vicious cycle thus develops as each time the physician tries to discontinue the medication the same complaints occur and medication is continued longer than necessary. The consequences of stopping the medication and fear of experiencing strong withdrawal effects can lead some patients to continue these medications longer than necessary even when they are ready to stop (Verbeek-Heida & Mathot, 2006). Most of the discontinuation symptoms are physical and misdiagnosis can also lead to unnecessary investigations to clarify the physical complaints or to inappropriate treatment (Haddad, 2001) including use of other medications. " 1988-2012: Prozac @ 60mg (with a few stops and starts) Fall 2012: Returned to 40mg after discontinuing and horrid withdrawal Fall 2013: 40mg Fluoxetine, added 150mg Wellbutrin to treat fatigue Winter 2014: Attempting to taper both (too fast) April 2014: 9mg Fluoxetine + 37.5 Wellbutrin Summer 2014: 8 mg Fluoxetine + 0 Wellbutrin (way too fast a drop) Late summer/Early Fall 2014: Debilitating Withdrawal symptoms Fall 2014 - Wellbutrin successfully kicked to the curb but… Oct- Dec 2014: Panicked reinstatement of Fluoxetine ->30mg - held for 5yrs Jan 2021: taper to 20mg Fluoxetine then tapering by 1mg every 2-3 months Fall 2022 - held at 10mg->December 2022: 9mg->Feb 2023: 8mg ->March 2023: brassmonkey slide begins: 7.8mg -> 7.6 -> 7.4->2 week hold (April)->7.2->7mg->6.8->2 week hold->6.6-> 1-month hold ->(June)-6.5->4-week hold-> (July)-6.4 (discontinued brassmonkey slide and slowed taper)-> (Aug)-6.2->(Sept)-6.0->(Oct)-5.9->(Nov)-5.8->(Dec)-5.7->wave!->(Jan)-5.8->(Feb)-6mg and holding. My 2014 withdrawal experience: https://rxisk.org/antidepressant-withdrawal-a-prozac-story/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claudius Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 I tapered off during a 6 week period by skipping dosages... I dont know whats worse, skipping or cold turkey!!! I am no expert in this, but my guess is that alternating/skipping dosages is even worse than cold turkey, if possible. While cold turkey van make you sick as hell, recovery starts technically on the first day you don't swallow the drug anymore. The point is that during recovery you can be very very sick and due to the neuropathic destabilisation, recovery takes much more time than when tapering slowly. But when alternating or skipping doses, you get sick either but I believe that no recovery takes place when alternating, so the period of alternating does not make any sense: it only makes you sick but does not contribute to the healing. 10 mg Paxil/Seroxat since 2002 several attempts to quit since 2004 Quit c/t again Oktober 2007, in protracted w/d since then after 3.5 years slight improvement but still on the road after 6 years pretty much recovered but still some nasty residual sypmtons after 8.5 years working again on a 90% base and basically functioning normally again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Rhiannon Posted June 11, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted June 11, 2014 I've seen a lot of people in protracted withdrawal from various drugs and I can't say that Paxil has any special corner on the market of drugs from hell, although it does have the reputation for being harder to get off than some of its contemporaries (Prozac anyway, maybe Celexa). Some of the newer ADs like Pristiq and Cymbalta have pretty bad reputations too. And I've seen a lot of people sick for many years after coming off benzos. So I guess what I'm saying is that Paxil does seem to be pretty rough but I don't think we have enough evidence to say it's the worst. Not that it really matters anyway, I suppose. I think there's more variation from person to person than from drug to drug. In other words it seems to be more the person's individual genetics plus their individual history plus the way they came off, plus which particular AD it was--so many factors that which AD it was is only a small part of the story. And so many people have been on multiple meds. So many factors. As far as I know there's no good research of any kind that teases out these differences. Started on Prozac and Xanax in 1992 for PTSD after an assault. One drug led to more, the usual story. Got sicker and sicker, but believed I needed the drugs for my "underlying disease". Long story...lost everything. Life savings, home, physical and mental health, relationships, friendships, ability to work, everything. Amitryptiline, Prozac, bupropion, buspirone, flurazepam, diazepam, alprazolam, Paxil, citalopram, lamotrigine, gabapentin...probably more I've forgotten. Started multidrug taper in Feb 2010. Doing a very slow microtaper, down to low doses now and feeling SO much better, getting my old personality and my brain back! Able to work full time, have a full social life, and cope with stress better than ever. Not perfect, but much better. After 23 lost years. Big Pharma has a lot to answer for. And "medicine for profit" is just not a great idea. Feb 15 2010: 300 mg Neurontin 200 Lamictal 10 Celexa 0.65 Xanax and 5 mg Ambien Feb 10 2014: 62 Lamictal 1.1 Celexa 0.135 Xanax 1.8 Valium Feb 10 2015: 50 Lamictal 0.875 Celexa 0.11 Xanax 1.5 Valium Feb 15 2016: 47.5 Lamictal 0.75 Celexa 0.0875 Xanax 1.42 Valium 2/12/20 12 0.045 0.007 1 May 2021 7 0.01 0.0037 1 Feb 2022 6 0!!! 0.00167 0.98 2.5 mg Ambien Oct 2022 4.5 mg Lamictal (off Celexa, off Xanax) 0.95 Valium Ambien, 1/4 to 1/2 of a 5 mg tablet I'm not a doctor. Any advice I give is just my civilian opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Jemima Posted June 11, 2014 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted June 11, 2014 Olivia, I moved your topic here because it's a debatable subject rather than information on non-drug ways to relieve withdrawal symptoms, which is what the 'Symptoms and self-care' discussion is about. I've observed on this forum that folks who are trying to get off Paxil and Effexor seem to have the hardest time, although for the most part I agree with everything Rhi said. There are people who are able to go cold turkey with no problems and people who are so sensitive to the SSRI and SNRI antidepressants that they get sick almost immediately. I suspect, if there's ever any valid research on the subject, we'll find that people with a longer history of drug use, especially drug cocktails, or a history of being switched from one drug to another are those who will prove to have the hardest time. I was only on antidepressants for fifteen months and it's taken me over two and a half years to get close to normal again. I had been prescribed Remeron and Pristiq at the same time, got off the Remeron, and switched to Lexapro, from which I did a too-fast taper. I was also advised to do the every-other-day routine at the end, fortunately only for a week if I remember right. And remember that feeling like you'll never get better is a withdrawal symptom. It helps to keep a journal or at least keep up your Intro here. Reading back through mine and seeing that I'd made progress helped me to believe that eventually I'd be okay. Psychotropic drug history: Pristiq 50 mg. (mid-September 2010 through February 2011), Remeron (mid-September 2010 through January 2011), Lexapro 10 mg. (mid-February 2011 through mid-December 2011), Lorazepam (Ativan) 1 mg. as needed mid-September 2010 through early March 2012"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity." -Hanlon's RazorIntroduction: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1588-introducing-jemima/ Success Story: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/6263-success-jemima-survives-lexapro-and-dr-dickhead-too/Please note that I am not a medical professional and my advice is based on personal experience, reading, and anecdotal information posted by other sufferers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barbarannamated Posted June 11, 2014 Share Posted June 11, 2014 I've been on and off approximately 25-30 psychoactive drugs used to treat chronic pain and depression since 1993. I'm still on a few and at 3 years off of the SNRI, Pristiq, I have to agree with all that Rhi said. I am still struggling tremendously. I don't mean to frighten anyone. I did a very quick taper off of Pristiq and CT'd Vyvanse. Pristiq tapered over 8 months ending Spring 2011 after 18 years of polydrugging that began w/Zoloft for fatigue/general malaise (not mood). CURRENT: 1mg Klonopin qhs (SSRI bruxism), 75mg trazodone qhs, various hormonesLitigation for 11 years for Work-related injury, settled 2004. Involuntary medical retirement in 2001 (age 39). 2012 - brain MRI showing diffuse, chronic cerebrovascular damage/demyelination possibly vasculitis/cerebritis. Dx w/autoimmune polyendocrine failure.<p>2013 - Dx w/CNS Sjogren's Lupus (FANA antibodies first appeared in 1997 but missed by doc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 prozac was the only AD I took . Despite the claims of being easy to get off ( which was never the case with me ) it has a very bad reputation among many people who stopped it and stayed very sick for many many years and some never got better .I found many horror stories with prozac specifically . I'm scared to death , not only i was cursed with prozac instead of another drug , I- as well - quit it cold turkey preceded by several fast tapers and reinstatements which means I messed a lot with my system and caused it immense chock , not to metion that I was drugged at a really young age (14) when my bain wasn't even fully developped which certainly increases the risks . Is there hope that I'm not permanently damaged ? any possibility for me to make a full recovery ? I'm I doomed for 7 years or more like may other people who took the same drug ? I'm 15.5 off , the first 12 months were horrible , I had many inhumanly difficult symptoms that come and go , and some that never seem to fade like impaired memory , flat feeligns ,DR/DP and a hellish anxiety but In the past month I started to have some decent times where I feel some happy emotions and clarity of mind , it only lasts minutes though . does that mean that there's hope for me ? I'm really scared ! On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamfine Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 You've been off Prozac since March 2014 and are still seeing symptoms? You will be fine, I went off Prozac twice, one time with a two week taper (from 80 mg to zero in two weeks) and another time a few months ago I came off 20 mg cold turkey but onto another seretogenic drug. Prozac is one of the easier of the ssri's to come off of because of it's crazy long half life. You will be fine, just hang in there. What are your symptoms like now? As requested. In the last 3 years to the best of my recollection I first dropped the max dose of Lamictal. Yes I just stopped it was doing absolutely nothing. Then I dropped Lexapro, that was even easier I had been on and off that a dozen times before. There were at least 2 odd off label attempts at anxiety that I won’t be able to remember. Then there was sweet/evil Seroquel. That was the last to go it’s been around 16 months. Lithium, Prozac, Paxil, Wellbutrin, Effexor, Celexa, Lamictal, Lexapro, Luvox, Viibryd, Brintellix, Pristiq, Zoloft, Seroquel, Zyprexa, Geodon, Abilify, Latuda, Ritalin, Adderall, Valium, Clonazepam, Alprazolam, Propanalol, Spravato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 my main symptoms : head pressure muscle twitiching/ spasms impaired short and long term memory impaired cognition severe anxiety +horrible feeling of terror disturbed sleep / insomnia headaches DR/DP weight gain general fatigue frequent mood swings neuro emotions : anger , depression , nostalgia , regret , guilt , self consciousness , nervousness restlessness akathisia anhedonia On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theon Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Hello a99: I thik I share your opinion of prozac being evil. I have read a lot of success stories in this forum, but very very few are prozac success stories... I think prozac withdrawal comes sooooo much later than the other withdrawals, making it more tricky to deal with, and I have read of a lot of people permanently damaged by prozac.... I just hope that you and me can recover from this. About me ------------------------ College student with a history of anxiety, excessive worrying and health anxiety. April 2014 - May 2015---------- Prozac 20mg On and Off. Second time on it I developed apathy, changes in personality, asexuality. May 2015 - July 2015----------------- Tappering off prozac. Still no feelings,anhedonia, apathy, no libido, asexuality. Current symptoms-------- pssd (asexuality in my case). Anxiety and depression developed some months afer stopping prozac, could have been caused by obsessing and beating myself up too much when I found myself unable to like girls again. The best thing to do with pssd (which in my case is asexuality) is accept it and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 God I hope not. I'm on Procac. Also no other drugs. I've been slowly tapering for 2 years and down to 2mg. I'm currently holding in preparation of my last micro taper to zero. Expecting this to take me about 6 months to get to 0. I have to say that I've had very few symptoms until now. (Which were set off by a couple of doses of Tramadol after an op 4 months ago) this has been so different to any CT's that I'd did. Hopefully I'll be able to give you a bit of a success story in a year or so. I'm keeping positive that I will beat this drug. Wish me luck. Luck and love to you Theon and A99. Hope you are feeling better soon. 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theon Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 God I hope not. I'm on Procac. Also no other drugs. I've been slowly tapering for 2 years and down to 2mg. I'm currently holding in preparation of my last micro taper to zero. Expecting this to take me about 6 months to get to 0. I have to say that I've had very few symptoms until now. (Which were set off by a couple of doses of Tramadol after an op 4 months ago) this has been so different to any CT's that I'd did. Hopefully I'll be able to give you a bit of a success story in a year or so. I'm keeping positive that I will beat this drug. Wish me luck. Luck and love to you Theon and A99. Hope you are feeling better soon. Good luck Aliwill . I am sure you will do it! Looking forward to hear your success story! About me ------------------------ College student with a history of anxiety, excessive worrying and health anxiety. April 2014 - May 2015---------- Prozac 20mg On and Off. Second time on it I developed apathy, changes in personality, asexuality. May 2015 - July 2015----------------- Tappering off prozac. Still no feelings,anhedonia, apathy, no libido, asexuality. Current symptoms-------- pssd (asexuality in my case). Anxiety and depression developed some months afer stopping prozac, could have been caused by obsessing and beating myself up too much when I found myself unable to like girls again. The best thing to do with pssd (which in my case is asexuality) is accept it and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Petunia Posted July 3, 2015 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted July 3, 2015 Prozac is no more evil than any other antidepressant. You can find horror stories and success stories with every drug you search for. This is one person's opinion. Most people going CT off any psychiatric drug after long term use are going to have some problems, occasionally for quite a long time, this is why we recommend careful tapering. I think prozac withdrawal comes sooooo much later than the other withdrawals, making it more tricky to deal with, and I have read of a lot of people permanently damaged by prozac.... Please would you provide links to the evidence of permanent damage because I've never seen any. I'm not a doctor. My comments are not medical advise. These are my opinions based on my own experience and what I've learned. Please discuss your situation with a medical practitioner who has knowledge of tapering and withdrawal...if you are lucky enough to find one. My Introduction Thread Full Drug and Withdrawal History Brief Summary Several SSRIs for 13 years starting 1997 (for mild to moderate partly situational anxiety) Xanax PRN ~ Various other drugs over the years for side effects 2 month 'taper' off Lexapro 2010 Short acute withdrawal, followed by 2 -3 months of improvement then delayed protracted withdrawal DX ADHD followed by several years of stimulants and other drugs trying to manage increasing symptoms Failed reinstatement of Lexapro and trial of Prozac (became suicidal) May 2013 Found SA, learned about withdrawal, stopped taking drugs...healing begins. Protracted withdrawal, with a very sensitized nervous system, slowly recovering as time passes Supplements which have helped: Vitamin C, Magnesium, Taurine Bad reactions: Many supplements but mostly fish oil and Vitamin D June 2016 - Started daily juicing, mostly vegetables and lots of greens. Aug 2016 - Oct 2016 Best window ever, felt almost completely recovered Oct 2016 -Symptoms returned - bad days and less bad days. April 2018 - No windows, but significant improvement, it feels like permanent full recovery is close. VIDEO: Where did the chemical imbalance theory come from? VIDEO: How are psychiatric diagnoses made? VIDEO: Why do psychiatric drugs have withdrawal syndromes? VIDEO: Can psychiatric drugs cause long-lasting negative effects? VIDEO: Dr. Claire Weekes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamfine Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Prozac is no more evil than any other antidepressant. You can find horror stories and success stories with every drug you search for. This is one person's opinion. Most people going CT off any psychiatric drug after long term use are going to have some problems, occasionally for quite a long time, this is why we recommend careful tapering. Please would you provide links to the evidence of permanent damage because I've never seen any. I agree with Petu, I have been on almost all of them at one point or another and they are mostly evil, no need to be scared by one post. They actually use Prozac as a bridge drug to get people off other ad's because of its long half life. I'm not quite in the camp that says all these drugs are evil but many of them are, everyone is different. I can just tell you that, in my experience, Prozac was one of the easier drugs to come off of, even at a high dose. And Petu, I don't think "most" people have trouble after a ct, maybe a better word would be "many". As requested. In the last 3 years to the best of my recollection I first dropped the max dose of Lamictal. Yes I just stopped it was doing absolutely nothing. Then I dropped Lexapro, that was even easier I had been on and off that a dozen times before. There were at least 2 odd off label attempts at anxiety that I won’t be able to remember. Then there was sweet/evil Seroquel. That was the last to go it’s been around 16 months. Lithium, Prozac, Paxil, Wellbutrin, Effexor, Celexa, Lamictal, Lexapro, Luvox, Viibryd, Brintellix, Pristiq, Zoloft, Seroquel, Zyprexa, Geodon, Abilify, Latuda, Ritalin, Adderall, Valium, Clonazepam, Alprazolam, Propanalol, Spravato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Iamfine, great to hear a positive story re prozac. I also had a great post to my page today from Petu, thanks again. Interested Iamfine, as I am unaware of the class of many drugs, (I do know that seroquel is an AS) is the Luvox or Geodon an SSRI? When you tapered from Prozac, did you have any other SSRI's in your system or was your taper from Prozac a full taper from SSRI's? I'm really interested to gain information on all things Prozac tapering. As I am at the pointy end of my Prozac taper, 2mgs, am starting to think about when I come off totally. I'm not going CT from 2mg's as Ive had too bad a reaction to cold turkeys, so am planning to micro taper the last bit by 0.1mg per week down to 0.1mg before I finish. I know this seems very conservative but better that than the alternative. Hopefully this will put me in a good place for stopping this drug once and for all. 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iamfine Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Yes, Luvox is a ssri, Geodon is an AS like Seroquel. Both times I went off Prozac was to go to another seretogenic drug. Both times I went to Lexapro, which was my go to drug for years but it finally pooped out on me. The ssri's haven't been good to me as a class for the most part. Prozac worked for awhile the first time, and Paxil worked for a short time. Lex worked the longest. I'm finishing tapering off Luvox now and will not go back to that class again. I have not ruled out keeping Geodon onboard since it has worked for me better than anything else. My doctors have always had me do a two week cross taper and I've done it many times without trouble. If I do decide to dump Geodon I will do it at a 10% rate. As requested. In the last 3 years to the best of my recollection I first dropped the max dose of Lamictal. Yes I just stopped it was doing absolutely nothing. Then I dropped Lexapro, that was even easier I had been on and off that a dozen times before. There were at least 2 odd off label attempts at anxiety that I won’t be able to remember. Then there was sweet/evil Seroquel. That was the last to go it’s been around 16 months. Lithium, Prozac, Paxil, Wellbutrin, Effexor, Celexa, Lamictal, Lexapro, Luvox, Viibryd, Brintellix, Pristiq, Zoloft, Seroquel, Zyprexa, Geodon, Abilify, Latuda, Ritalin, Adderall, Valium, Clonazepam, Alprazolam, Propanalol, Spravato Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Thanks Iamfine. I am sending you good vibes for your taper with Luvox. I will keep an eye out and check on your progress. Best of luck. 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theon Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Prozac is no more evil than any other antidepressant. You can find horror stories and success stories with every drug you search for. This is one person's opinion. Most people going CT off any psychiatric drug after long term use are going to have some problems, occasionally for quite a long time, this is why we recommend careful tapering. yeah you are right, Petu. I am sorry, I think I tend to see my problems worse than those of the rest of the people (when actually mine are better than most of the people here), and I wrote that comment without thinking too much. About me ------------------------ College student with a history of anxiety, excessive worrying and health anxiety. April 2014 - May 2015---------- Prozac 20mg On and Off. Second time on it I developed apathy, changes in personality, asexuality. May 2015 - July 2015----------------- Tappering off prozac. Still no feelings,anhedonia, apathy, no libido, asexuality. Current symptoms-------- pssd (asexuality in my case). Anxiety and depression developed some months afer stopping prozac, could have been caused by obsessing and beating myself up too much when I found myself unable to like girls again. The best thing to do with pssd (which in my case is asexuality) is accept it and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Altostrata Posted July 3, 2015 Administrator Share Posted July 3, 2015 Prozac is not particularly evil, we see prolonged post-acute withdrawal syndrome from ALL the psychiatric drugs. This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner. "It has become appallingly obvious that our technology has surpassed our humanity." -- Albert Einstein All postings © copyrighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 4, 2015 Share Posted July 4, 2015 thank you everyone for your positive replies . Theon : wishing you recovery and success Aiwil : you've come a long way , best of luck to you , looking to hear a success story from you soon . I do have a question : my symptoms used to be persistent 24 h for over a year , lately I'm noticing improvements that last a few hours everyday , does that make me far away from being permanently damaged ? do permanently damaged people have windows too ? I'm sorry if I sounded pessimistic , I just never was this scared On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 All windows are good signs. Unfortunately you just have to hang on, then hang on some more when you have waves. Now that you have started having windows, no matter how small, hopefully they just keep increasing for you. Pessimism can definately be a side effect of the withdrawal, I know that when I've been CT in the past I became extremly pessimistic. No-one else can understand the pain you are experiencing unless they have been through it. Even in my recent destablization (Has lasted about 1 month but definately improving) I started to wonder whether 2mg was the lowest I will ever get. Now that the symptoms have started to subside, I am back to positive again that I will be dropping again soon enough. Please try to see these windows as a breakthrough in your recovery. You are getting better. Sending love your way 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Emeritus Addax Posted July 5, 2015 Moderator Emeritus Share Posted July 5, 2015 I am a Prozac veteran. I started in 1988/89. It was only after a horrific withdrawal experience in 2012 that I realized I'd become physically dependent on the drug. I had been on 60 mg until 2012, then after the withdrawal experience reinstated to 40mg and added Welbutrin, which essentially meant I was probably taking the equivalent of 60-80mg of Prozac. Anyway, you can read my journey in my thread, but right now I'm at 20mg and have held here for just over 4 months now to ensure I can get through that lag of 4months before the delayed onset of symptoms. This hold has been great. No symptoms in nearly two months and I'm past the 4 months and still nothing. I'm so thankful. This is not to say I'm not nervous for my next drop. But I'm confident that my conservative taper plan and self care will get me through the next steps. Aliwill - Stay conservative! I think that's great. I'm being incredibly conservative and with long holds from this point on. a99 - I understand your fears (dread?). I've been there and was convinced I was forever brain damaged and would never be off... I was 18 when I started, so my brain wasn't fully developed, but our brains are so much more plastic and adaptable then you'd expect. Here I am at nearly middle age and I can say that from experience my brain seems to be firing on all cylinders despite the drug and two horrific withdrawal experiences. Also, beware of the hopelessness and belief that you will never heal! Those thoughts, in and of themselves, are w/d symptoms. I'm serious on that. Our brains can become incredibly cruel to us when withdrawing and the thoughts are incredibly convincing. I promise you, they are just thoughts and the "evidence" you find to support them are, for lack of a better word, delusions. It sounds crazy, but it's so true. These delusions that we are permanently damaged and will never heal Is one of the cruelest symptoms of withdrawal. And despite me telling you this you will probably believe your brain over me even though I've lived it :-). And that's okay, because when you come through this I'll simply go to your thread and write, "I told a so!" :-P 1988-2012: Prozac @ 60mg (with a few stops and starts) Fall 2012: Returned to 40mg after discontinuing and horrid withdrawal Fall 2013: 40mg Fluoxetine, added 150mg Wellbutrin to treat fatigue Winter 2014: Attempting to taper both (too fast) April 2014: 9mg Fluoxetine + 37.5 Wellbutrin Summer 2014: 8 mg Fluoxetine + 0 Wellbutrin (way too fast a drop) Late summer/Early Fall 2014: Debilitating Withdrawal symptoms Fall 2014 - Wellbutrin successfully kicked to the curb but… Oct- Dec 2014: Panicked reinstatement of Fluoxetine ->30mg - held for 5yrs Jan 2021: taper to 20mg Fluoxetine then tapering by 1mg every 2-3 months Fall 2022 - held at 10mg->December 2022: 9mg->Feb 2023: 8mg ->March 2023: brassmonkey slide begins: 7.8mg -> 7.6 -> 7.4->2 week hold (April)->7.2->7mg->6.8->2 week hold->6.6-> 1-month hold ->(June)-6.5->4-week hold-> (July)-6.4 (discontinued brassmonkey slide and slowed taper)-> (Aug)-6.2->(Sept)-6.0->(Oct)-5.9->(Nov)-5.8->(Dec)-5.7->wave!->(Jan)-5.8->(Feb)-6mg and holding. My 2014 withdrawal experience: https://rxisk.org/antidepressant-withdrawal-a-prozac-story/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 thank you for the replies and the positivity ! I can't wait for the day when all of this is behind me ! On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 5, 2015 Share Posted July 5, 2015 anyone else with an experience with prozac ? On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
indigo Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 So glad to find this thread. Good to hear from somone else who was only on Prozac and is down to very low dose. I have only taken Prozac. Was on it for more than ten years, and been tapering for two years, coming down from 20mg to about 3.50 mg. It seems to be getting harder as I get lower, but that might be a WD delusion. Six months ago I switched to liquid prozac so that I could do minute drops with a 1 mL syringe. Even after these tiny drops I get severe anxiety, repetiive negative thoughts and sadness. (Also that tricky WD symptom where you think you'll never get off the drug, that you're permanently damaged) One WD symptom I have not heard talked about much is having an extremely low stress threshold. I'll feel O.K., think I've recovered from last drop, then some big stressor will happen (like my house got burgarized) and I'm back into full WD anxiety mode. On 20 mg of Prozac for about ten years. Sept 2012 started reducing 10% a drop using gram scale, with average of one month holds. When I'd reached the half way mark, taking 10 mg powder out of the 20 mg capsules, I switched over to 10 mg capsules and cutting down from those. Withdrawals got harder the lower I dropped. May 2013 changed to 5% drops, holding until all withdrawal symptoms gone. January 2015 changed to liquid prozac (concentration of 20MG per 5 mL) using a 1mL oral syringe. Current dose of fluoxetine solution equivalent 3.4 mg. Any effort to drop below this has been disastrous so for the time being I'm staying at this level. Adding 200 mg Tryptophan and 200 GABA a day has helped with anxiety. Also take 1,300mg Omega- 3, 875mg Magnesium, 1800mg Curcumin, 1000mg Vit C, 5000 Vit D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluebalu86 Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 We have talked about this symptoms indigo - decreased ability to handle stress. It is very common. I suffer from depression, anxiety, pure-o ocd, and panic attacks since 2004. Been on multiple different psychiatric drugs since 2006. Never had a significant WD problem before, only brain zaps for a month and then I'd be fine...............Been on Cipralex (escitalopram) 15 mg and Fluanxol (flupentixol) 1 mg since Sep 2014. Stopped taking the Cipralex after a fast 20-day taper.Took the last 5 mg Cipralex on Feb 5th, 2015. Then took Seroxat (paroxetine) 10 mg for a week, and stopped it too. Severe WD started suddenly on Feb 16th. RI 5 mg Cipralex on Feb 18th, 2015. RI worked and was relatively stable for a while................April 7 - decreased Fluanxol from 1 mg to 0.5 mg and took it at this dose for a week. - BIG MISTAKE; April 13 - WD starts creeping in; April 14 - RI full dose of Fluanxol 1 mg => severe muscle twitching and jerking when trying to relax and fall asleep, overwhelming sense of doom, dread, terror, and horror, insomnia, hoping to stabilize.Tried doing a 10% cut off Fluanxol in the end of May for a few days, but quickly updosed to full dose because the twitching returned.Experiencing waves and windows in the following months.Unsuccessful brief taper attempt of Fluanxol by 5% on November 1st. Symptoms hit the next day. Too scared to continue tapering, reinstate full dose.Severe crash in November after stupidly trying a barbiturate on November 9th. Grave mistake. Sense of unshakable inescapable internal torture, like my soul is in hell being tortured, terror/horror/dread/doom (probably akathisia?) that gets especially bad when trying to relax and fall asleep, muscles twitch, jerk and move on their own, shaking, insomnia, can't eat, confusion, disorientation, brain not working normally. Never felt so bad in my entire life. Never experiment with other meds while in WD! Praying to God I stabilize and get back to my baseline.December - things getting even worse. January - unbearable suffering Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 So good to find other Prozacers here. I'm currently in a holding pattern after a recent destalilization. At 2mg. I believe it to be from Tramodol that I took for pain a few months ago, you can read about it on my thread. I'm feeling better, withdrawal symptoms definately getting better, but intending on holding another couple of months before I swap to a micro taper to 0. I'd love you all to come over to my thread too and wish me luck, chat, and keep me positive. I'll also start following all the Prozac peoples threads here, and will check in regularly to offer encoragement. We can do this guys, I believe the most important thing is patience, and the holds. Although, I too want this drug out of my system ASAP. The holds are definately what has allowed me to get this far. A99 sorry for hijacking your thread. I know you can do this, but with this drug please do long holds. I cant wait to follow your story, which I believe will be a success. Keep positive, and if you can't then check in and we will become your cheer squad. Sending love. 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a99 Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Indigo - you have come a long way , congratulations ! good luck with the rest ! Aliwill - you're doing a great job , best of luck with your micro taper ! thank you for your encouragement . I agree on the importance of holds but i'm not concerned with them as I went cold turkey but patience and time are definitely the answer ! On and off prozac from 2010 -2014 . Several failed fast tapers and reinstatements . Cold turkey : March 2014 . ----------------------------------------- took lysanxia 40 mg a day for almost a year november -14- 2018 weaned to 30 mg november -26- 2018 weaned to 20 mg symptoms that got better : fatigue current symptoms : severe anxiety one rescue dose (10 mg ) december -15 -2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 Sorry a99, I have read your thread and did know that you had gone cold turkey, but my concentration is a bit off at the moment. (Insert sad face) Sorry if I upset you. Yes holding on is the key for tapers, but cold turkey, thats painful. Just remember each day is a new day and hopefully the one where your symptoms start to get less and less. Each day is a day closer to freedom for you. Sending Love 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theon Posted July 9, 2015 Share Posted July 9, 2015 Hello prozac fellows. My experience with prozac 20 mg so far has been of two periods of 3 and 4 months with a period of 5 months drug free in between. Now I am in my third month of tappering and holding on 5 mg. I really want to finish the tapper before the end of july, and unless I get very sick this month, I think I will do it . I am quite sure that next winter I will get bad anxiety again (my anxiety always gets worse in winter), but this time I am determined to hold on without prozac. I have read the threads of all of you guys, and wish you all the best. About me ------------------------ College student with a history of anxiety, excessive worrying and health anxiety. April 2014 - May 2015---------- Prozac 20mg On and Off. Second time on it I developed apathy, changes in personality, asexuality. May 2015 - July 2015----------------- Tappering off prozac. Still no feelings,anhedonia, apathy, no libido, asexuality. Current symptoms-------- pssd (asexuality in my case). Anxiety and depression developed some months afer stopping prozac, could have been caused by obsessing and beating myself up too much when I found myself unable to like girls again. The best thing to do with pssd (which in my case is asexuality) is accept it and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aliwill Posted July 10, 2015 Share Posted July 10, 2015 Theon, Please understand that to go from 5mg to 0 in 3-4 weeks is far to fast. I.m seriously considering a small up dose (from 2 back to 2.5ml) , after being detabilized from an Operation and Tramadol 3 months ago. (Well not considering, I'm going to do it tonight) You have also dropped the Prozac from 20mg so quickly. It has taken me 2.5 years to get this far and I'm still having hiccups. You need to hold and see how you go for atleast another few months. Huge alarm bells ringing for me, I just want you to be OK. A long slow taper at the end is the only way to ward off withdrawal and I'm really concerned that you are putting yourself in harms way. Please take it slow. (Sorry again A99 for hijacking your post but felt I really needed to say something). Let us know your decision on your thread Theon, I'm following you so will get updates. 2003 Zoloft for PND. No other Psych history before this. 2009 CT. Huge withdrawal. Voluntary hospital admission. Successfully stabilized on 40mg Prozac. 2012 CT after 2 years of tapering to 10mg. Another Disaster. No hospital admission. Stabilized 40mg Prozac 2014 CT after 2 years of tapering to 5mg. Destabilized but not as bad as previous. Found this site. Reinstated 5mg. Stabilized quickly but held for 6 months. Feb 2015 4mg Prozac March 2015 Tramadol for Pain after an OP. Didn’t realize it was an SNRI. March 2015 3 mg Prozac April 2015 2.5mg Prozac May 2015 2mg Prozac June 2015 Destabilized (After research believe it was delayed withdrawal due to the Tramadol) July 11th 2015. Updosed to 2.5mg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tweet Posted August 14, 2019 Share Posted August 14, 2019 Hello all, I am 14 months out after a ct off 20 mg prozac. Thank you all for your input and please stay in touch. I sure would like to hear some updates🙂 This is the best of my recollection. 20 mg Prozac 3-4 days per week from 1994 until May 2018. Beginning May 15 I began to drop doses. I dropped 1 dose per week for the next 4 weeks. It was not systematic at all. I don't have which days I took what. so the week of May 13 I took 4 doses, which was pretty normal for me. Then the week of May 20 I took 3 doses 20 mg. The week of May 27 I took 3 doses 20 mg. The 1st week in June l took 2 doses 20 mg. The week of June 10, 2018 was my last dose 20 mg. I had been on Prozac only for over 20 years. No other medications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eastcoastgirl Posted August 27, 2019 Share Posted August 27, 2019 An interesting study about Prozac. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5068807/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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