☼ schizor: can the brain recover from antipsychotics?

[Petunia]

Malf,

Please would you start an introduction topic for yourself in the  Introductions and updates  section so that we can learn more about you and your recovery process.

[leticiaa]

schizor, u gave me hope that i will be ok someday, like u. I had same problems, although i was on antipsihotic more time then you (i was on leponex (klopin, Klozapin, azaleptin) for 3 years)

[servadei]

This thread is amazing!! That one day when you just wrote you feel good and how your tone in posts revolved... amazing.

[Martina23]

Schizor, I like your thread very much. Even if I dont know if OCD can also recover, your recovery is giving me hope.

[Offeverything27]

Hey schizor. Did you have pssd during this process?

[Destroyed]

I cant take this anymore.My parents are going to force me to go to a psychiatrist if I dont get better in 1 month.More pills? Great! I would rather kill myself.

Im off all drugs but my psych said hes got a form that can enforce more medication.  I told him I will kill myself than go back on that poisonous filth or run away to the seaside.   Im the same as you, I lost my personality.

[dalsaan]

Destroyed,

 

If you take the time to read through all of Schizor's thread you will see that he recovered. He is a success, someone to be inspired by. Quoting an old, outdated post and then saying you are the same is not just untrue, it is actually dismissive of Schizor's experience and disrespectful of his thread as a record of his journey.

 

Dalsaan

[LucaDiProspero]

hey schizor how are things going for you?

[schizor]

I know this thread brings hope to some of you but you have to know the truth.

I did feel wonderful for a couple of months and I tought I have recovered but actually it was a begining of a hypomanic episode. After a while I started to act weird, talk fast and was very agitated but I did not realise it at that time. I dont know and Im not sure if this was in fact caused by withdrawal, I might actually have some kind of mood disorder. I am now at stage one, but without the akathisia. Anhedonia came back with full force along with intense fear in the early mornings. Im so confused right now

[legan]

Hey schizor,

 

Your thread gave me hope . In fact i laughed alot when you started feel better as theres hope and i will recover .

 

I got to tell you something . I think its not withdrawal though i cant judge . But me , before used alcohol or psychatrist drugs In age 18 i was like in hypo manic state . Talk fast .act wired and agitated .i think this is my real personallity . May be its affected by smoking ciggaretes since age 12 .

 

Sonce when you felt that ?

 

Please tell us how things are going ?

[schizor]

There is hope you will recover. I dont know what happend to me, still trying to figure it out.
I didnt feel something was wrong with me when I was hypomanic. It was only after I came out of the manic state that I have realised it.

Im now very depressed and don't know what to do. I was basically feeling fine last year but after the summer became very agitated and euphoric after which i crushed in depression. I was drug free for a year, can withdrawal cause this big mood changes?

[lanah]

I think so. I also do not believe you can "just have a mood disorder" 
More and more proof is getting that toxins are causing these types of things. If it isn't withdrawal then you could be eating the wrong things, have some sort of neurotoxin in your house, 
your gut could be out of whack (did you do a test for it?) 
If you ask a psychiatrist what causes psychoses they are unsure. You could be in a massive wave. Do you see any change at all? 

[lanah]

Also were you still living a clean life? (no alcohol, caffein, sugar,...) ?

[Petunia]

Thanks for coming back to update schizor, I'm sorry to hear that you have had a return of symptoms recently. It sounds like you are confused about what may be happening.

 

After someone has recovered from withdrawal, the nervous system can remain vulnerable for several years and waves of symptoms can be triggered by various things like increased stress, over doing things, drugs, alcohol, lack of sleep, poor diet, not taking care of yourself properly.

 

You wrote that you were hypomanic, but that's a diagnostic term, maybe you were just happy to be feeling so well again and had a lot of energy and wanted to make up for lost time, perhaps you were doing things your nervous system wasn't quite ready to handle?

 

I've really overdone things when I've had windows and then have crashed badly. Perhaps if you could tell us a little more about what you have been doing since you recovered, we might be able to help you sort out what's going on.

 

Are you on any medications now?

[schizor]

Im not on medication. Yestarday I tried some 5htp and l-tyrosine but it does nothing. No alcohol,no caffein,some sugar, like chocolate.

 

I know that I was manic because the things I did were not normal like talking really really fast, breaking things and being agressive towards friends and family. It was not as severe as my first psychotic episode which I believe was triggered by someone lacing my drink but it was still bad. I dont know what caused it. I wish I knew. I dont want to go to psychiatrist so I can just be trown random pills at. I freaking dont. I have to find what is causing this. Im really scared and confused

[ang]

Thanks for your posts Schizor......................    if you manage ok with the mania, it will pass.

 

We are all different................ yes, we think we are well, then dives are harder, but shorter! ...............  They get less, and less,    so glad you recognise you dont want a psychiatrist!!!!!!    Ride the waves................... ignore the psychs........

 

 

Seems like the time you are well enough to stop judging your moods,  we all have these sorts of days, pre med...........................  I never took a med of any sort until age 35,      what a mistake that was!  Your reactions, are normal....  you have no idea what was in the food, the drink, anything............  could be damn MSG, or anything.................?

[lanah]

Chocolate triggers awful waves for me. I used to eat one tiny piece of chocolate every night because it calmed me down and made me sleep until one day I was in hell again. Then I understood that the fact that the chocolate made me sleep was not a good sign. So I'm avoiding all sugar now. It's not worth it. 

[schizor]

I am feeling terrible. Depression is getting worse and every night I have this overwhelming fear in my stomach that only lets me sleep for a couple of hours. I'm currently seeing a traditional Chinese medicine doctor and doing acupuncture but so far no effect. I don't know what to do. I went to see a psychiatrist and she proposed I go inpatient but I refused. I'm currently on no meds and have been med free since approximate two years. Are there any alternatives out there?

[Petunia]

Its hard to know what's going on, and I'm so sorry you're feeling bad again, my guess is if you give yourself more time, you will eventually get back to your normal self again, like you did before.

 

I did feel wonderful for a couple of months and I tought I have recovered ....

 

This may have been a window rather than full recovery your nervous system may still have been quite sensitive.

 

Besides chocolate, can you think of anything else you were doing which may have increased stress and caused your nervous system to become destabilized again? What was your lifestyle like? Did you have a regular routine, good sleep hygiene, regular exercise?

 

During my last window I was sure I was fully recovered and did too much. I also started having a little caffeine, less sleep and was doing too much activity and I ended up back in a bad wave. Just like you, at the time, I didn't realize anything was wrong, but looking back I can see I was acting a bit manic, although I don't see it in that medical kind of way, to me it was that I suddenly had more energy and enthusiasm and wanted to make the most of it, which is natural after not feeling well for so long.

 

Your first episode was most likely caused by the laced drink, and you probably would have recovered just fine without medication, but 6 months of psyche meds, followed by a CT has most likely caused some changes in your brain and nervous system which may take a little more time to bounce back fully from. You felt good for 2 months, so that's proof that you can experience normal, perhaps this is like a pendulum swinging from side to side a few times before it finally comes to rest in the middle at a balanced place.

 

Its your decision if you want to go the psychiatry route again, knowing that all they really have to offer is drugs, for me, that would be the last resort, I'd give it more time and go back to the basics of extreme self care, including improving diet and cutting out sugar and chocolate.

 

Have a look through the sleep topics for some ideas for getting your sleep back on track:  Important topics about symptoms, including sleep problems

[Fresh]

Hi schizor ,  can you tell us a bit more about how long the episode of hypomanic behaviors went for?

 

It's very common after an upswing in symptoms , whatever they were triggered by , to have a corresponding downswing.

Instead of feeling upbeat , chatty , enthusiastic etc , the feelings of depression , fear and hopelessness take over.

Using the analogy of a wave , the hypomanic feeling is like the peak , the depression the trough.

 

As you sit it out , the depression will lift and homeostasis will return.  

 

Are you taking any supplements from the Chinese doctor?   If your symptoms changed after starting any new supplement

or remedy , I'd stop taking it.  It may have triggered this episode.

 

The other standards are magnesium and melatonin - are you taking either of them?

Please start magnesium , your organs need it even if you don't notice any relaxing effect.

 

bw , Fresh

[KarenB]

Hey Schizor,

 

How many nights have you been having this new trouble sleeping? 

 

It may in fact be another wave as your CNS does some more stabilising and healing.  I can only imagine how distressing this is for you.  I agree with Petunia and Fresh that it will probably pass given some time.

 

Hooking back into some very focused self-care would seem a much better option than the drug-path again. 

 

Do you have a counselor with whom you can talk some of this over with?  See if you can find a way to settle those fearful feelings? 

 

So many things can cause us difficulties that we may not even think of.  For instance, it has been documented that some people experience trauma responses each year at the same time of year that they had the original trauma.  Not saying this is what's happening with you, but just wanting to point out the complexities of people as they heal.

 

I think with time and care you will continue to heal; it's just a matter of getting past these difficult spots along the way. 

 

Please keep letting us know how you're doing,

Karen

[Altostrata]

Very good suggestion, KarenB.

 

schizor, can you work on your sleep? Some people are very sensitive to lack of sleep, it can trigger all kinds of symptoms.

 

Can you turn off all the lights at nightfall and go to bed at 10 p.m. every night?

[schizor]

Petunia, when I felt recovered I did have a healthy livestyle and cant remember anything that might have triggered it. Unfortunately I did not realise at that time that I was acting manic and I was very very confrontational with friends and family and I had these grandiose delusions that I was going to become rich and famous. After all this settled down, I now feel worthless and guilty, Im afraid to leave the house, I dont any good emotions and spend a lot of time in bed.

 

Fresh, the hypomanic episode went for seven months and its worst point was in May when I broke stuff and yeld at my friends for nothing.In my "normal" state, I would of never did anything like that. Im taking melatonin but not magnesium.

 

KarenB, these nights started in December and countinie to get worse. The absolute terror I go every night is unbearable. Yestarday I even took half of bromazepam because I could not stand it. I dont think that a counselor will be of any help.

 

 

Alto, I will try that. Strange but around the time when the sun goes down usually my anxiety also decreases only to increase again in 3 in the morning.

 

 

I want to believe that all this was caused by the drugs but I dont know anymore. I cant stand this.
 The psychiatrist I went to said I have bipolar 1.Is there anyone here labeled bipolar? Please, I need to talk to them on how are coping

[KarenB]

Hey Schizor,

 

Sorry to hear things are continuing to be so hard for you.  Is there anyone in your life you trust who you can be in contact with during this time?  Any on-the-ground support?  The most reliable way to find healing is through connections and relationships, but of course you are the one who knows how things are in your life, and you'll have the best instincts about what you need to do. 

 

Something for you to take into consideration is that there is now a pattern of people being being (mis)diagnosed bipolar once their systems are destabilised by SSRIs.  In particular the withdrawal symptoms of depression and high/manic feelings seem to confuse doctors.  This is documented in the book Anatomy of an Epidemic.   You might like to read some discussion about it in http://survivinganti...r-drug-effects/

 

It is also documented in that book that in all cases, those who were never medicated, or least medicated, had the best long-term outcomes and quality of life.  I recommend you read the book.  Drugs are offered like some magical wand, and I do know how tempting it is to reach for them (that's why I'm here too!) but if you look to other ways of healing you'll eventually be better off.

 

Have you considered Fresh's idea of starting magnesium?  Right now it's worth giving yourself all the goodness you can.

 

Hugs,

Karen

[InvisibleUnless]

hey schizor.  i havent been around on here much, but i caught up on the second half of your thread right now and i wanted to specifically mention that you are describing a lot of symptoms i have had from antipsychotic withdrawal.

 

i never had any diagnosis including mania, but i was always an energetic sort of person and my primary issue earning my medications was anxiety.  i feel that those preceding architectural traits probably had some influence over my withdrawal experience.

 

i cannot say whether or not you have a 'mood disorder' or are just dealing with more withdrawal shite.  but, frankly, a psychiatrist or other doctor could probably not sort that out very objectively or helpfully, either.  perhaps someone with clinical psychiatric and psychological training with extensive experience in withdrawal patients would be able to contribute more meaningfully...but unless you see someone like that, i would be very wary of labels being slapped on you, much less by people who cannot know the full extent of withdrawal possibilities.

 

i did a lot of embarrassing stuff when i was feeling hypomanic and delusional during the first 1-2+ years of my antipsychotic withdrawal.  i felt kind of ashamed or weird afterwards, but i came to accept that i was just dealing with something other people would either understand or not.  seeing a therapist might not make the symptoms any better, but it can be nice to have an ally that sits with you through it all, and perhaps helps you feel more sane in how you deal with things.  they may or may not offer a grounding perspective, but having the opportunity to share with someone in a constructive and intimate environment might give you more strength.

 

one of the most important things i have found for my own recovery is a positivity of mind.  i dont have to feel great or have great impulses to treat myself well, or imagine good things.  sometimes it is a rage attack, and i want to just throw things all over and give up on everything in life.  sometimes i want to hate myself and all of existence.  it is all sudden, irrational, overwhelming.  it can saturate everything you perceive.  but if you make a commitment to yourself, to irrationally consider yourself in a positive manner instead, it can be a pretty powerful way to cope and to progress in a way that does not depend on withdrawal symptoms being intense or diminished to get you someplace better.

 

i dont know what what work best for you, but i do hope you find some peace.

[schizor]

This is too much for me

[KarenB]

What's happening for you today Schizor? 

[schizor]

I voluntary comitted myself to a psych ward because I had severe suicidal ideation. Im on depakote now

[Martina23]

Schizor, I am sorry that you suffer so much. Before you were such an inspiration for me. I thought already that you were healed. If I were on your place now, I would just wait now how the things will develop. It is ok if you take medicaments, if you feel that they might help you. You will see how you will feel and then you can decide what you will do further. I had in my life already so many times when I thought this is for me too much, this I cant make, but always there was a way afterwards and sooner or later the problem solved itself, let us hope that this time it will solve itself also. Keep us posted.

[KarenB]

Schizor, I don't know the details of your situation there, but I'm really glad that you did what you needed to do to keep safe.  Are you back home now? 

[schizor]

Im back home with a mild depression taking depakote.

[ChessieCat]

Hi schizor,

 

Thanks for posting and letting us know that you are home.  I hope you are managing all right.  Take care.

 

PS when you feel up to it could you please update your signature so it remains current.  Thanks.

[consciousre]

I'm glad and sad that this thread is still going. I'm new here. 

Where's Jim24?

His story sounds very similar to mine.

I got put on 6mg of risperidal for less than a year but for longer than six months then got switched to abilify because I couldn't ejaculate and I was getting sore nipples. 

That was when I was 15. I'm 18 now and I don't get proper pleasure from things. Am I just remembering back to when I was a kid and thinking I enjoyed music and other pleasurable activities more back then or am I suffering from anhedonia?

Would you put this down to being on APs or a I suffering from depression? Would you reccomend I go and get prescribed antidepressants? Which ones?

 

 

Love to all. 

Don't know if it's a trigger warning. Very very sorry if this post upsets anyone. I don't mean to. 

Edited April 27, 2016 by consciousre

[schizor]

Why did you get put on risperidal?

[KarenB]

Hello Consciousre,

 

Would you like to start a thread for yourself in the Introduction forum, so we can help with your situation there?  I think everyone on this site would encourage you to stay well away from anti-depressants.  The damage they can cause is huge. 

 

What we find is that people heal much better when they work on learning really good self-care.  There's a lot of ideas about that on this thread:  http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1112-non-drug-techniques-to-cope-with-emotional-symptoms/

 

Welcome to SA - hope to meet you in your own thread soon,

Karen

[well]

hi there guys,I have the same problem but I think worse,the thing is that I was put on this antipsychotics because I was arguing with my mother,after 3-4 months I feelt the same like schizor,the difference is that I can't think at all,do you think guys this can because of the antipsychotics as well? I don't know what to think because many people say that the pills I was taking it's not so powerfull as the other typical neoroleptics,first I was on haloperidol but everything was okey,outside the thing that I wasn;t able to get angry,but the other things like personality and reaction was still here,I was on it 3 weeks,then when going home they said I need already to take ketilept(seroquel or quetiapine) so I did because was afraid to be again in the that horible place,but things didn't go so good after it,after taking the first pill of ketilept I was feeling somehow depressed,after some more days after the pill I wasn't able to feel the music anymore and after 2 weeks I wake up like I didn't know who I'm,my personality was like gone,I wasn't able to remeber anything from the last year or something from the past,I wasn't able to feel the nature anymore,I was like on some ireal place somehow,and my head was empty,I tried to left them off but after some hours I started to feel a very very big fear and maybe a little agresion after that I wasn't able to left them off,I taked them like a mounth and half after one day when I wasn't able to speak,I went to the personal psychiatric and she gave me instead triftazin,she told me that my emotions will come back from this one,so I left ketilept and taked trifrazin,in the beggining 10 mg but then 5mg because I started to cry all the time so she though because of the dose,after 2-3 weeks I started to feel like my thinking is coming back,so in the beggining I started to feel some euphoria and some thoughts,but didn't feel like old me,this thing was just for 2 days,then I got back on the same **** like I was before,I told that to the her and I don't know why she gave me some more pills,but others,so after that I started to take eglonyl(sulpiride) 300 mg at day and also 5mg of triftazin,and started to feel more stupid  then I was,after 2 and half weeks of sulpiride I left it and also after some more 3 weeks I left triftazin as well,all the taked antipsychotics in total was like 4 mounths,I was on 200 mg of ketilept,just only like 3 days I taked the 400 mg dosage because of the fear,then I get back on the 200mg dosage of it,300mg of eglonyl and 5 of triftazin,also was on haloperidol in the begging but it was there on hospital so I don't know the dosage there,do you guys think that it can be posible to have depersonalization because of ketilept?everything has started after it,many people say that ketilept it's not a strong antipsyhotic as others so I don't know what to think,it's possible to return to my old self? I'm off the pills already one month and a half but no improvements at all,just that now I only can hear the music in my head after listening one,but I don't feel anything and the major problem is that I can't think,I also had a stress situation,do you think it's because of that?its possible it to come back?the thing is that I can't remeber anything,so I don't remeber if I was able to think after the stress or it was after the pills,thanks and sorry for my english