☼ joy2730: withdrawing from citalopram, quetiapine

[joy2730]

Thanks scallywag. I also had crawly skin and pins and needles and jabs of p a in under my left foot which is where I felt it during more acute withdrawal.

 

So I suspect it might still be the odd symptom. Much worse this morning than tonight when all seems to have resolved.

[joy2730]

Have been cheking my signature and have now been back on 20 mg for roughly 8 weeks so I wasn't expecting any withdrawal symptoms to pop up

[Flowers]

HI Joy

 

Maybe it is down to the changes you made a while ago before you settled on 20mgs. I hope things improve soon.

 

xxxx Flowers 

[joy2730]

Yes flowers I think it is. Today I had the very familiar foot pains and sweating I am still having withdrawal symptoms but feel OK in myself

[joy2730]

My recent odd symptoms have resolved now, yesterday the symptoms made it clear they were withdrawal, which as I have been back on 20 mg for 8 weeks now, means that reinstatement has not cancelled them out.  I thought it would.  So, withdrawing from citalopram is a truly long term project with many hidden obstacles along the way.  I personally think the obstacles are harder than when I withdrew from diazepam.  One week out of diazepam and I felt like a new woman and no hidden surprises after that.

[joy2730]

Something strange is happening.  I have only ever managed to reduce from 30 mg citalopram to 20 mg citalopram but at long last I am starting to get my figure back.  I haven't weighed myself but I look better and more shapely and am losing that 'obese' look.  Is this possible after a long time?  Although I went back to 20 mg ages ago now to stop withdrawal symptoms I am still getting the odd symptom such as dizziness and pain in left foot (not bad, tingles really).

[scallywag]

I've lost a few inches and pounds while moving to a lower dose, my clothes fit more loosely than they did last year. These medications affect more than just the brain's neurotransmitter processes. Appetite changes, up and down, are a known side effect of these medications. Many people, not all but many, shed some weight when the med is finally discontinued.

[Flowers]

Very interesting. I am always craving bad things to eat like chocolate and crisps! Maybe it will get better as I get to lower doses.

[joy2730]

Hi, I have not been on the site for ages and have been doing well on 20 mg citalopram, but am now lethargic so have done a minute cut. 

 

I can't work out the maths.  I have taken 10 mg as normal, half a tablet, and then diluted the other 10 mg with 5 ml of water.  From the dilution I have taken out 1/10 of a mil which I think means I have 19.8 mg of citalopram instead of 20 mg, but I am not sure!

 

Anyway I have done this for a few days now and have had the odd head zap and dizziness but so far OK.  My aim is no longer to get off citalopram but just to take the edge off the lethargy.

 

Can anyone solve my maths puzzle, and Flowers how are you doing?  Where have you got to with your reductions?

 

I hope everyone has a good new year despite the antidepressant problems.  Joy

[scallywag]

joy - Nice to see your name and intro pop up on my "new content" list!

 

Your calculations look correct to me: 5 ml = 10 mg, 4.9 ml = 9.8 mg.

[Flowers]

Hi Joy

 

Nice to hear how you have been doing. They say that no news is good news so I am pleased for you that things have been going well.

 

I am afraid I haven't been doing that great over the past few weeks. Probably in a wave!

 

Hope your taper goes smoothly and it gets rid of the lethargy. I am just the opposite right now really ramped up! 

 

Take care.

 

Flowers xxx

[joy2730]

Thanks scallywag for maths confirmation. I never thought I would be reduced to such small cuts but there is nothing wrong in acknowledging the truth of the matter. Flowers you must be making small cuts too judging by your signature. How are you measuring yours.

[Flowers]

Hi again Joy - I am doing 5% cuts every 4 weeks or so depending on how I am. I am holding at the moment as have hit a few problems possibly from changing generic to another generic. Have gone back on original generic and am waiting to stabilise.

 

I can only get 30mg tablets in the usual generic so have to dissolve in water in a syringe  and squirt out what I don't want. For example dissolve 20mg tablet in 100 ml of water in syringe. A 5% cut would mean you would have to squirt out  5ml and take the remaining liquid in the syringe which should equate to 19mgs. Hope this makes sense. My husband does all this for me as I am terrible at maths!!!

[joy2730]

Thanks Flowers, glad I am not the only one messing around in this way.  I now use a 5ml syringe and a 1ml syringe to get a more accurate dosage.  Glad you are doing well.  While resting from reducing you are in fact giving yourself the best chance in effect.  I am dissolving in much smaller quantities of water than you.  My 20 mg pills are scored so I am taking 10 mg by half a tablet, then dissolving the other half tablet in 5 ml of warm water, having crushed the tablet first,then using 1 ml syringe taking out 1/10 th of a ml and disposing of it and taking the rest.  Complex or what?  But if it works to reduce the lethargy then it is worth it.

 

Joy

[Flowers]

The things we have to do! Let us know how you get on.

 

 

xxxxx Flowers

[joy2730]

I weighed myself and somehow gained 5llbs while back on the 20 mg.  I wasn't watching what I was eating and just ate whatever and as I have kept up my exercise of swim and sauna I thought I would be OK.  The citalopram seems to get me to eat more and especially sugar things and carb things, but I don't know.  I could just have the ordinary sort of problem with food that most people have. 

 

So as well as getting rid of the lethargy I want to get a bit more control of my weight back.  I will update my signature to show this latest micro cut and let you know how I get on with it all. 

 

I am a lot wiser about w/d from citalopram but still can't do it.  My aim now is just to reduce slightly and not to get off it completely.  My goals have been modified.

[Flowers]

I had weight gain with Citalopram too. Put on a few pounds over Christmas but was expecting it! Always craving snacks even after I have eaten. I am doing Slimming World online and it is helping to get the weight off. 

 

I understand what you are saying re coming off the drug. It is very hard and you never know when the next blip will hit. Minimising the dose as much as possible without causing you too many problems seems to be the right balance.

[joy2730]

Felt a bit sick and sweaty this morning, perfectly normal and fine at this level.  I think my only way forward is these very fine cuts.  By the way I have stopped crushing my meds and just started to dissolve them in water.  Crushing them was a good idea but totally unnecessary.  I realised this flowers when I read your description of how you dilute your meds, thanks for helping me to see that.  Anything to make it simpler. 

 

Also having decided I am not aiming to get off citalopram completely, just to reduce a little, has really taken any pressure off me and I feel so much better about the whole situation.

[joy2730]

Flowers how are you doing. I saw on another post you said you are not doing well. I have come unstuck yet again. I seem to be super sensitive to any cuts in citalopram at all now.

[Flowers]

Hi Joy

 

I am not very well at all - like full blown WD all over again. I have not changed my dose since last cut in November and waiting since then.

 

Sorry to hear you are struggling. What are your symptoms?

 

xxxx

[joy2730]

Hi flowers

 

My symptoms are headache sickness insomnia feeling hot - the lot really. it is not good news what are your symptoms?

[Flowers]

Hi Joy - Oh Dear - we are in the same boat......

 

The full works - nausea,tremors,exhaustion,heart palpitations,muscles twitching, anxiety and depression,dizzy, headache. Am sleeping a bit more but still not right.

 

Have been like this for 6 weeks - don't know how much longer I can go on like this.

 

When did your symptoms start? Did something trigger it like stress?

[joy2730]

Hi Flowers

 

For me, whenever I reduce now from 20 mg I get very ill within a few days, and feel strange within a day.  I used to be able to get down to 14 mg, but all my leaping back to 20 mg seems to have caused worse withdrawal symptoms.  Now I get symptoms if I just drop by a really tiny amount.  I have not had any stress, it is, in my opinion, that I have become sensitive to withdrawal and as such am trapped on 20 mg.  I used to take 30 mg.

 

I once read that people don't benefit too much from dosages above 20 mg, and I am beginning to think this may be true.  For me, it seems as though my body has got used to 20 mg and can't cope without it.  I feel withdrawal would make me too ill to live my life and could ruin this late life career of mine which I love.  

 

And I think the longer you have been on them the worse it gets.  My daughter withdrew from sertraline after 2 years use with very little trouble, only nausea for about 2 weeks.  But I have been on citalopram approx. 17 years now and before that other antidepressants.

 

The situation is unacceptable.  I am going to research into sensitivities during withdrawal, but I don't think there are any solutions at present.

 

Let me know how you are doing, are you going to try to move forward and stick with it?

[Flowers]

Hi Joy

 

I remember you had trouble going below 20mgs and then had to updose. Maybe there is something in it and you won't be able to get down past 20mgs. I see from your sig you are at 19.8 mgs now. Are you going to updose again?

 

As for me I don't know what to do! I changed from one generic to another generic beginning of November so it could be that that has caused this. I also had alcohol (not a lot but some rum in hot toddies for a cold!) I found out yesterday that I used some steroid cream for a week in December for a skin rash. Didn't realise it was steroid and I can't tolerate oral steroids as I get anxiety and depression. Don't know if steroid cream could have this effect.

 

I am just waiting it out but don't know how much longer I can stand the symptoms.

 

Wish I had never taken these pills.

 

xxxx

[Junglechicken]

Hi JoyI remember you had trouble going below 20mgs and then had to updose. Maybe there is something in it and you won't be able to get down past 20mgs. I see from your sig you are at 19.8 mgs now. Are you going to updose again?As for me I don't know what to do! I changed from one generic to another generic beginning of November so it could be that that has caused this. I also had alcohol (not a lot but some rum in hot toddies for a cold!) I found out yesterday that I used some steroid cream for a week in December for a skin rash. Didn't realise it was steroid and I can't tolerate oral steroids as I get anxiety and depression. Don't know if steroid cream could have this effect.I am just waiting it out but don't know how much longer I can stand the symptoms.Wish I had never taken these pills.xxxx

Flowers,

 

My homeopath is anti steroid creams as they don't really heal. They just "push back into the body" the underlying problem.

 

It could well be that they affect the CNS and exacerbate anxiety and depression.

 

Our skin is our biggest organ.

 

JC xxxx

[joy2730]

Hi Flowers, I haven't kept my signature up to date, I only managed a week on 19.8 mg and then went back to 20 mg. My trouble is I have invested a lot of time and energy in this late life career so find it hard if I am struggling with symptoms.  So I will have to wait until I no longer work.

 

Although, I am 58 now and don't want to spend years in withdrawal only to keep updosing.  To put it plainly I don't know how long I will live so don't want to waste the time I have suffering unnecessarily.

 

Years ago in my 40s I withdrew successfully from diazepam after numerous attempts, but only worked mornings then and found I could go to bed in the afternoons.  Even at aged 40 I read of some people who decided to stay on for life.  I am so glad I got rid of the diazepam when I did.

 

I do think it is possible, even for me, it is definitely my work that is stopping me. I have a Student Loan to pay back and love my work anyway.  I didn't realise I might have to make this choice.  I don't want to go to my GP and go off sick and on to benefits just to get off citalopram but that I think is what I would have to do.

 

I think we have all been part of an experiment re these SSRIs.  No one knew at the start that they would cause these problems.  It was hoped they would solve the problems of the previous generations of antidepressants but haven't.

 

I was on dothiepin before citalopram and have done better on the citalopram.  The dothiepin never really relieved the depression, but did at times make me too happy, it also caused me weight gain, confusion and general poor cognitive functioning.  If I have to be stuck on a SSRI until retirement then citalopram is better than dothiepin.

 

Let me know flowers how you are doing.  Joy

[Flowers]

I understand totally Joy. You need to get on with your life. Are you feeling better now you are at 20mgs again?

 

You have done well in getting off the diazepam.

 

I will keep in touch.

 

Best Wishes

 

Flowers xxx

[joy2730]

Yes, Flowers, I am feeling better and people are saying I look well at the moment, which suggests perhaps I have not been looking too well recently.

 

I never thought for one minute it would turn out like this for me!  How are you today, any better?

 

Joy

[Flowers]

That's good news that such a tiny increase can make all the difference for you to feel and look good.

 

This morning was awful. Woke with dread and nausea. Got out to walk and my legs were like jelly. Since then it's been tailing off a bit.

 

I never know what each day will bring!

 

xxx

[joy2730]

Hi Flowers

 

I am such a wimp, it is so easy to give up.  Looking back although I didn't have any stress when at 19.8 mg citalopram I did have a very heavy cold which lasted a long time and I could have got the symptoms mixed up.

 

I have heard of people having to reduce venlafaxine one bead at a time.  I am now going to try one drop at a time of citalopram, which dosage wise will be difficult to quantify.

 

Let me know how you feel over the next few years, you are giving me encouragement!

 

Joy

[Flowers]

Oh Joy - this is all so confusing not knowing what are WD brain symptoms or other illness symptoms!

 

 

I have decided to do a little updose to see if it helps me get stable. I have been losing my mobility due to the dizziness and unsteadiness on feet and I just can't afford for that to happen! I am normally a very fit and active person.

 

 

 

What do you mean by 1 drop? Are you talking about liquid Cit?

 

Flowers xxx

[joy2730]

Hi Flowers

 

My previous post said 'next few years' and I meant 'next few days'.

 

By a drop I just mean a drop from the oral syringe I have been using for measuring my own liquid.  It is just as case of pushing the plunger until a drop falls out!  Very basic, but it is a start.  My GP didn't want to give me the liquid so I have just  been making my own.  If I can build the drops up it will eventually get to a measurable amount.

 

I have done some extra reading today and basically I have always gone too fast and then crashed, and then when I have crashed I have always gone back to 20 mg to play safe.

 

How are you going to work out what to updose to.

 

I am very interested to know what you go up to and if it works.  This is a very difficult thing to work out.  Keep in touch at this important time.  So basically I am doing 20mg minus one drop of a 1ml oral syringe!

 

There are some articles on this site that talk about the slowest of tapers and they are very helpful.

 

Joy

[joy2730]

Hi Flowers

 

Joy again, I have just read your signature, and see you have gone up to 20.5 mg.

 

I am very interested to know if that small updose helps your current distressing symptoms.

 

Joy

[Flowers]

Hi Flowers

 

My previous post said 'next few years' and I meant 'next few days'.

 

By a drop I just mean a drop from the oral syringe I have been using for measuring my own liquid.  It is just as case of pushing the plunger until a drop falls out!  Very basic, but it is a start.  My GP didn't want to give me the liquid so I have just  been making my own.  If I can build the drops up it will eventually get to a measurable amount.

 

I have done some extra reading today and basically I have always gone too fast and then crashed, and then when I have crashed I have always gone back to 20 mg to play safe.

 

How are you going to work out what to updose to.

 

I am very interested to know what you go up to and if it works.  This is a very difficult thing to work out.  Keep in touch at this important time.  So basically I am doing 20mg minus one drop of a 1ml oral syringe!

 

There are some articles on this site that talk about the slowest of tapers and they are very helpful.

 

Joy

Hi Joy

 

Oh right - I get what you mean now with the one drop. I have read about really slow tapers too. I might be with you on that one if I manage to stabilise with the updose. I think it is prudent for those of us who have been on the drugs for many years. Have you read about Brass Monkeys Slide?

 

I am not sure if I will get any effects from the updose for a few days but will keep you up to date with how I am.

 

Flowers xxx

[joy2730]

What is brass monkeys slide

[ChessieCat]

Here's the link:  brassmonkey