joy2730

joy2730: withdrawing from citalopram

775 posts in this topic

Hi everyone and Hi Flowers

 

Flowers I intend to start following you.  I follow Genlady which I managed to set up on my own, but seem to be struggling with how to set up following someone else, so can anyone talk me through it?

 

This morning I took 19.9 mg citalopram but my careful reckoning.  I decided to try to work out the dosage properly, and it is 2 drops from the syringe for me.

 

It took me a lot more times of failure trying to get off diazepam than I have failed so far with citalopram.  Yet I persisted with trying to get off diazepam and ultimately succeeded.  So I have decided to use all the lessons I have learnt through  my failures to try again.

 

I have a 2 week 1 day old granddaughter now, Esme, and I don't want to live in this 'fog' while she grows up.  I lived in a psychiatric fog while I brought up my own two children and I am sure both they and I missed out on a lot.  I know my late llife career is important to me but it is not as important as my enjoyment of life and if I am careful enough another withdrawal attempt should not interfere with my ability to work.

 

I am married to the 20 mg anyway so might as well persist with a smaller dose and see where it leads.  Also taking citalopram not only makes me 'foggy' but it does make me eat loads of carbohydrates and does give me weight problems, which I know are not me.  I can't exercise anymore than I do, the only way is for me to try to address the underlying cause - that of taking citalopram.

 

Twice now when I have got down to 14 mg I have felt more in control of my food choices, so if I could just reduce to that it would help me a lot.

 

I am typing all this because sometimes a person's thoughts can help others to make more informed decisions.

 

So, I am now going to see if I can set up to follow Flowers.

 

Joy

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Hi Joy - First I must congratulate you on your granddaughter's arrival. Esme will be a great incentive to try and get off these drugs!

I am with you with the weight gain and food cravings! Since I hit this wave I have lost 1 1/2 stone but it is not a good way to lose it and I know it will go back on again when I get my appetite back.

 

I think it is good to try and go as slow as possible. I have gone slow but maybe not slow enough but like you say it is all trial and error.

 

I have followed you today and all I did was click on the follow at the top right hand corner of your post.

 

So good luck Joy- we are almost neck and neck with our dosage so lets see where this leads us.

 

xxxxx Flowers

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Hi Flowers, No not a good luck to loose weight by being in withdrawal.  However, I don't want to get any bigger in weight so anything is worth a good.  Second morning of 19.95 and fine.  Flowers have you maintained your updose and is it helping at all?  but I know it is early days yet.  I am curious to know if a small updose works because I have historically always lept back to 20 mg.  By the way I only live 4 miles from my daughter and Esme and although actually life away from home with my work 4 nights a week, my daughter visits me at work and when I am at home I can easily pop in for babysitting/visiting duties although obviously not child care, so I am not a remote granny but an involved granny, so I feel I want to enjoy this relationship without the fog.

 

To the moderators, I am trying to follow Flowers, but I know she is following me so that is enough really.  However, when I look at my right hand corner of Flower's last post on my story, I only see a post number and a pair of scissors sign.  When I click on those it doesn't seem to be a follow button.  I am following Genlady and managed to set that up.  I mainly use a laptop and mobile phone for these posts, but also have a desktop which I will look at when I get time.  I don't like technology to beat me so can you type me a simple guide to how to follow someone. 

 

Joy

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To the moderators, I am trying to follow Flowers, but I know she is following me so that is enough really.  However, when I look at my right hand corner of Flower's last post on my story, I only see a post number and a pair of scissors sign.  When I click on those it doesn't seem to be a follow button.  I am following Genlady and managed to set that up.  I mainly use a laptop and mobile phone for these posts, but also have a desktop which I will look at when I get time.  I don't like technology to beat me so can you type me a simple guide to how to follow someone. 

 

 

Joy,

 

Once you are in Flowers' thread, in the upper right hand corner -- below the "Donate" sign -- is a little box that says "follow" (or, if you've already clicked it "unfollow").  All you need to do is click it and you will be following her thread.

 

Very simple.

 

Best,

 

Andy

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Thank you apace41 sometimes we need a pointer!

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Hi Flowers, No not a good luck to loose weight by being in withdrawal.  However, I don't want to get any bigger in weight so anything is worth a good.  Second morning of 19.95 and fine.  Flowers have you maintained your updose and is it helping at all?  but I know it is early days yet.  I am curious to know if a small updose works because I have historically always lept back to 20 mg.  By the way I only live 4 miles from my daughter and Esme and although actually life away from home with my work 4 nights a week, my daughter visits me at work and when I am at home I can easily pop in for babysitting/visiting duties although obviously not child care, so I am not a remote granny but an involved granny, so I feel I want to enjoy this relationship without the fog.

 

To the moderators, I am trying to follow Flowers, but I know she is following me so that is enough really.  However, when I look at my right hand corner of Flower's last post on my story, I only see a post number and a pair of scissors sign.  When I click on those it doesn't seem to be a follow button.  I am following Genlady and managed to set that up.  I mainly use a laptop and mobile phone for these posts, but also have a desktop which I will look at when I get time.  I don't like technology to beat me so can you type me a simple guide to how to follow someone. 

 

Joy

Glad to hear you are OK after your cut. I only updosed Friday so not sure whether to expect any results yet. However, I am fairly certain the palpitations haven't been so bad and I slept OK for some of last night only waking up once. I am by no means well and get very tired quickly but hope that things are heading in the right direction! I will try to do more updates on my thread - I always forget to do that!

 

It's lovely that you are closeby to your family - they will need you with a new baby!

 

Flowers xxx

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Take good care flowers you are doing great. At the point you are at I always up dose to 20 mg which has been a mistake of mine.

 

I think it takes about 4 days for dose changes to take effect but I seem to have strong psychological reactions to dose changes in either direction. That is the trouble with withdrawal - it is hard to tease out what is really going on. I am now officially following your posts. Joy

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Hi I am doing well on my 19.9 mg.  I think I typed 19.95 mg on a previous post, but it is 19.9 mg.  I find it hard to think about these very small reductions but I will do my best.

 

My physical sign of something different going on is the sole of my left foot.  It tingles when I reduce.  Had a bit of tingling today.

 

I find it amazing that my body is so sensitive to even the smallest change, but I am 'good to go' as they say.

 

Joy

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Good news Joy - am sticking where I am for a couple of weeks to see if things improve.

 

Flowers xxx

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Have you noticed any difference yet from your updosiing yet Flowers.  Some people seem to get quite immediate relief?  I am curious to see what a small updose can do, rather than the large ones I have done that have provided me with almost immediate relief.  Although I recognise that the immediate relief might have been psychological.

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Hi Joy

 

I am not sure if anything has improved dramatically to be honest. It is still early days. I think I might be starting to feel a little more drugged and I needed that because I was so overwrought and not sleeping.

 

I fell asleep on the sofa this afternoon. Only for half an hour but it is the first time in weeks I have been able to do that. It was always my routine to have a siesta each afternoon as I was up and out at work very early.

 

I haven't posted anything on my thread because I am not sure yet what effects the updose has had.

 

Will wait another few days before posting unless anything of worth happens.

 

Flowers xxx

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I recognise the slightly drugged feeling feeling and the ability to sleep during the day again. Thatis exactly what happened to me when I last went back to 20 mg. Interesting. At least you sound quitell relaxed about it. I tend to panic.

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Oh No I am panicking like hell! I am still get very debilitating symptoms and low mood which I desperately want gone NOW!

 

But I am conscious of not upsetting my CNS anymore by jumping up dose too quickly.

 

All I seem to be saying is 'I will give it a few more days' like a record that has got stuck! Hey Ho!

 

Flowers xxx

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It is tough when you reach that point.  I think you need to wait until you are sure the present ujpdose is clearly not sufficient, otherwise you are jeopardising the progress you have made so far, and then if you still need to updose just do another really small one.  It is at this point that I panic and go back to 20 mg.

 

I have also become frightened of some of my  reading which has suggested some people never feel well again even after updosing fully.  It is an awful predicament.

 

I also do not like it if I think people are starting to notice I am unwell, and in my job I see a lot of people in the course of a day.

 

I had a light bulb moment in my studying yesterday.  I am currently studying Autism, but it has made me realise some behaviours that are compulsive are an attempt to control anxiety.  It is so obvious that I don't know how I didn't realise it before.  Therefore, some of my eating I think is a compulsion based on anxiety and using food as a medicine really.  How I have lived 58 years and have not realised this before I just don't know.  There was something on the TV about a woman who had gone from dress size 12 to 20 while on the contraceptive pill, and the doctor was saying the weight gain, although a small amount was caused by the Pill, was due to other reasons.  It made me think about when I eat more food and when less.  I ate more food when reducing citalopram as I thought I would be able to eat more and so gained weight which I thought was paradoxical weight gain.  With further thought I think I was wrong.  Also citalopram is meant to help with anxiety every bit as much as depression, so not taking citalopram could in fact be a back move.

 

Anyway I feel OK on my recent reduction and want to see where this is leading me.  It is like a journey on which I am discovering such a lot about myself and that can only be good.

 

Take care Flowers, it is so awful when you feel unwell and don't know whether to updose further or not, and so want to feel well again.  It is a lonely place to be.

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Hi Joy

 

Thanks for the support.

 

I would just say there may be some people who never feel well after total reinstatement but I went back up to my full dose when I was first in WD. Mr Dr told me to and although I had found this site I was too ill to process the info here. It took a while but I stabilised and felt really well which is why I started to taper. Maybe some people will always need to be on drugs - we are all different.

 

 

I am hoping that I can get back to that place again even if it means adjusting my dose. I won't be able to cope like this otherwise.

 

I agree that overeating could be linked to OCD but I find I comfort eat a lot more since taking Cit. I am sure it increases my appetite usually which is why I can't understand the problems I am having with my stomach at the moment. I feel sick and have no appetite until around 11pm! I take Cit in the evenings.

There must be something to this but I don't know what! Any ideas?

 

I think our faces particularly our eyes show exactly how we are feeling with any illness. My husband can tell what sort of day I am having just by looking at my eyes. It is good if people notice you are looking well.

 

Yes this experience does make us focus on ourselves and will be a great strengthening process I feel.

 

Thanks for your words of comfort - I am finding it hard patiently waiting to see any improvements but what else can I do?

 

Will keep posting on my thread of any developments.

 

Take care.

 

Flowers xxx

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My very small cut has so far only resulted in a tight feeling in my throat (I have had that before) and a very slight headache (like a watered down version of other withdrawal headaches I have had.  So far, all OK.

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Doing well on this cut, so far so good. When I logged on it said you were currently online Flowers - maybe a mistake on this site.  If you are Flowers I hope you are feeling a bit better.

 

If you have decided to switch or updose further do not feel guilty or that you are going backwards, it is all about what is best for you at this present time.  People on this site, including me, will not judge you - just wish you well.

 

When I have gone back to 20 mg I always felt I had let everyone on this site down, but that is wrong thinking.

 

Joy

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Today I pushed out 3 drops from my 1ml syringe, instead of 2.

 

3 drops is 0.1 ml which is a tenth of 1 ml. 1ml of my solution is 2mg of citalopram so I think I am now on 19.8 mg citalopram in a homemade solution, which is where I was at the beginning of January.

 

If anyone wants to try to work out the maths for me they are welcome.  So I think I am on 19.8 mg cit now.

 

Anyway whatever I a

 

m on I am well and it is a tiny reduction.  I doesn't help that I find liquids hard to think about in terms of mls  - I never learnt metric at school!

 

My next drop will be to 4 drops and that might be impossible to put into a figure,  but if I make progress it will become clearer.

 

Joy

 

Bad news with my weight this morning, up a pound that I can't afford to do.  I do seem to have a weight/citalopram problem, but who knows?

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Hi Joy, I am useless with maths but will ask if one of the other mods can help. Don't worry about an extra pound of weight, women's weight fluctuates so a pound isn't too bad. Citalopram can cause weight gain but that settles when it has been tapered, for some the weight starts to drop as the dose lowers. 

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If you'd like help with the arithmetic of the doses using syringes, please post exactly what you do to get the 19.8 dose.

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Hi  Scallywag

 

I have 2 syringes a 5 ml one and a 1 ml one.

 

I am swallowing normally half of my 20 mg pill and dissolving the other half in 5 ml of water.  Then from this little pool of water I am taking out 3 drops of the mixture using my 1 ml syringe.  My 1 ml syringe is divided into 0.1 to 1.00.  3 drops is the amount say between 0.1 and 0.2 for example in the 1 ml syringe. ie a tenth of the syringe full.

 

My next step will be 4 drops.

 

If anyone can give me a clue that will be brilliant.  I have to do this super slow because I have failed at all other ways.  I used need a guide as to where I am in dosage.  It will become easier to calibrate as I start to drop more???

 

I know I am somewhere just a little under 20 mg

 

Joy

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Okay. As you've no doubt figured out the half-tablet  is 10 mg.

 

Now the math-y part.

 

You put 10 mg in 5 ml water. This gives you a solution where 1 ml  =  2 mg citalopram

 

You withdraw 1 ml (2 mg) using a 1 ml syringe and expel 3 drops, ~ 0.15 ml. You take the remaining solution from the 1 ml syringe, ~ 1.85 mg

 

You take the remaining 4 ml of solution = 8 mg

 

so you take

10.0 mg as ½ tablet

 8.0 mg from 5 ml syringe

1.85 mg from 1 ml syringe

for a total of ~19.85 ml.

 

You could make your life a WHOLE LOT easier by dissolving the half-tablet in 10 ml water -- use two 5 ml syringe-fuls of water in a small container. That solution would be 1 mg = 1 ml. Then the 0.1 ml marks on the 1 ml syringe will be 0.1 mg citalopram.

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Thanks Scallywag, I am going to change how I measure out.  Anyway I am doing well on the 3 drops I am getting rid of = that she is the main thing.  Pathetic, but less.

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I have now dropped 5 drops of solution and doing well.  This last week I gained a very slight amount of weight which I put down to reducing citalopram, it happens every time to me, but I now have it under control.

 

Slow but sure.  Exercising appears to be helping.

 

Joy

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Good to hear that you're doing well with your microtaper approach.

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I am discovering that hard regular exercise at the gym plus swim and sauna is really helping me, I feel so much better and am sleeping so much better.  I shouldn't be surprised because years ago when I withdrew from diazepam I used exercise then, and it was one of the standard recommendations at the time to cope with withdrawal symptoms.

 

This sleeping well is such a surprise to me.  I am nearly asleep by the time I get into bed and sleep really deeply until about 6 am when I wake up feeling very refreshed.  Of course, I have to make the time available to exercise, but it is such a welcome change.  Or it may be temporary. 

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That's good to hear, Joy.  You may also be finding that regular sauna is allowing you to more effectively detox your system which could also be contributing to the positive feelings.

 

Best,

 

Andy

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Down by 6 drops this morning which is a fifth of 1 ml which is not much but I feel well at this pace. I know that when I have reduce my this 1ml I will be down to 18 mg.

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Hi  I am now down to 19 mg citalopram where I am sticking for ages before starting with drops again.  I feel well at this stage, but it is nearer to 14 mg that I start to have severe problems with nausea, sweating, dizziness and headaches.  My weight is stable but I am eating a lot less and exercising a lot more as I know instinctively I suffer from paradoxical weight gain when withdrawing.

 

My previous attempts have all been self jeopardised by going too quickly for me, and making big drops and then reinstating back to 20 mg at the slightest sign of trouble.

 

So my expectations are pretty grounded this time round.  The rest of my life is in a stable condition so who knows, I may do better this time. 

 

Take care everyone. 

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Stable is good, boring is good. Who needs a rocking boat of symptoms!

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That was then, this is now and you have experience under your belt.  Don't fall into the trap of anticipatory-anxiety

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Stable and doing well on 19 mg.  Have just lost two pounds in weight so I have made inroads into my paradoxical weight gain.  However I am tracking my food now and have increased my exercise a lot.

 

So far so good, had a few wobbly bits of emotion yesterday but I was fine.

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Hi everyone

 

I have now dropped another drop from the syringe.  So I am now19 mg minus one drop of citalopram. I feel fine. Just noticed a very slight patch of dizziness at lunch time.

 

I am trying to write a book about dementia and need all my cognitive skills in place.

 

I think part of the reason I am feeling well is the exercise and sauna that I am doing.  I have started something called 'Spinning' and am finding it very hard but I sleep much better. Who knows? I am not recommending it as it is energy/time consuming and expensive, but I am overweight and out of shape so it is ticking a lot of boxes for me, and if it helps with cutting down on citalopram that is a bonus.

 

I seem to remember that I got ill at about 14 mg last time, so I would be fine at 19 mg then. I think I speeded up too much and brought about my own failure. But again, who knows?

 

I am troubled by reports of individuals who have got off citalopram and then several months later have become very ill and ended up back on citalopram plus a truck load of other meds.  But no one can give anyone a forecast.

 

I think the blog I was reading was from Singh6 or something like that, but can't find it now.

 

Take care everyone

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Hi all

 

I am fine on 19 mg minus one drop!  No trouble so far, but going very slowly.  I can tell the drug is at a slightly lower level in my body because I feel a little more alert and more calm, and I get the odd jab of a tingle in the bottom of my feet now and then, like a little electric shock, but it is not painful or unpleasant.  I had this before when withdrawing more quickly and it was more severe then.  I have the odd bout of feeling slightly hot but that is all, not serious sweating like before.

 

So for me it sees that SLOW works better than QUICK, and may be a way forward.

 

Exercise seems to be helping a lot, doing a Spinning class tomorrow and Tuesday and Pilates on Wed.  I only have 3 days a week to exercise hard so I am trying to make the most of my time.  Hard exercise, when I sweat and huff and puff a lot, and get a raised heart beat, seems to be helping the withdrawal, but of course I may be wrong.  I am still also swimming and doing sauna as well.

 

I am not naturally a physically active person and in the time I have been taking psychiatric drugs have done so little exercise it is a wonder I am still alive, but my body and mind seem to really like exercise.  This is all a big surprise for me.  I never thought I would have a subscription to a gym in my life, and at 58 years of age it does seem crazy, but if this is what it takes, then I will do it.

 

I have no idea what Pilates is, I had no idea what Spinning was, but my body and mind seem to need this.  Years ago when I withdrew from diazepam I used to go running on a night and that helped, I guess exercise might not work for everyone though!

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A runny nose today which I had when withdrawing from citalopram before and very badly when I withdrew from dothiepin years ago.

 

I really enjoyed my Spinning class today and it does seem to be helping my weight, flexibility and withdrawal.

 

The runny nose pleases me because it means my body is reacting to the reduced amount of citalopram.

 

However, I have taken all the pressure of withdrawing completely from citalopram off myself, and have decided to be kind to myself about my earlier failures. 

 

My sleep is super, but I think a lot of that is because of the exercise.  Other people in the Spinning class are reporting sleeping really well too.

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Need expert help on 5 htp. I was reading this site last night and some were enthusiastic about 5;htp. I had previously tried it and found it made me feel rotten - but had a full bottle and I am easily led. This morning I had nausea and a headache which of course is classic withdrawal but have I worsened it by taking the 5 htp. I have now finished my first exercise class and eaten and feel better. What are the moderators thoughts on 5 htp?

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