☼ Prestorb

[Prestorb]

Hello, I am encouraged to find this site as I feel like I am on an island alone in this effort to withdraw from SSRIs. I'm sure my husband is sympathetic, but he doesn't understand and he is probably just really tired of dealing with it. So I basically don't talk to anyone other than my therapist about it. It sucks, and yet I know the SSRIs need to go. I asked for a change in SSRI about six weeks ago, so my Pdoc recommended I taper off the 40 mg of Paxil at 10 mg per week, while starting Zoloft at 25 mg per then up to 50 mg. So now I am off the Paxil (generic) and only on the Zoloft at 25 mg - I didn't tolerate it well at all. I know I am having a lot of WD symptoms, and I am just trying to manage them as best I can, which is okay some days and not good other days. I also have an 11 year old son, although I am not working outside the home right now - which I often feel is part of the problem. But I am afraid to commit to anything until my emotions stabilize. I start crying for no reason and can't stop. Sorry to ramble, I'm not sure what else to write, just hoping to find support here. Thank you.

Edited September 28, 2016 by scallywag
tags added

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Welcome to the site, Prestorb.

 

I would guess that the reason you are not 'tolerating' zoloft as well as you did the paxil is because your 'taper' off the paxil was too fast for your body to adjust. Adding in the zoloft did not take the place of the paxil. How long were you on the paxil all together? Do you plan on continuing to take the zoloft and increasing the dose?

 

It is not uncommon for SSRI's to 'stop working' after a time and when this happens, doctors often up the dose or switch to another drug and this is often effective for a time until symptoms happen again. I am wondering how you would like to proceed at this time because it is entirely possible that going back to the paxil (at a much lower dose) might calm the withdrawal symptoms and allow you to do a slow taper off that and ultimately become drug free.

[Prestorb]

Hi Platinum Star, thank you and yes, I agree completely and wondered that myself. I was on the Paxil for 5 years. I wonder if 10 mg of Paxil along with the current Zoloft might help? I didn't suggest this to my Pdoc, but I did tell her I thought I had tapered off the Paxil too quickly and that I wanted to ultimately withdraw from all SSRIs. Her recommendation was to stay on the 25 mg Zoloft and gradually taper off over time. For me, that is a lot of time, because I seem to be very sensitive. I like to keep my Pdoc in the loop (since she prescribes the medication!), but I feel like I know better what I need than she does most of the time.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

'Platinum Star' is my rating (based on the number of posts only), I am usually called CW. A lot of the times we mods shorten usernames because it lessens the amount of 'keystrokes' so if I call you 'PO' don't be offended

 

You could try taking 10 mg paxil in addition to the zoloft but maybe 5 mg (or even a bit less) would do the trick. Is your paxil a tablet that can be halved (since it is now available in a generic because it is an older drug I would not know) you'd have to say what kind of formulation it is in. You only need to take enough for about 4 days or so to see if your symptoms subside but you have to be aware that your body is also getting used to being on zoloft too. If you do decide to do that you may want to stay on the same dose of 25 mg zoloft and see if your body can stabilize there (on the 2 drugs). It would mean 2 drugs to taper but the most important thing right now is to prevent wd syndrome from getting worse and negatively impacting your life.

 

Did you read our topic about   About reinstating and stabilizing to stop withdrawal symptoms ? It will give you a little background that might help you decide what to do.

 

In this topic,  Important topics in the Tapering forum and FAQ there is a section on how to make different amounts of a drug using scales or converting to a liquid as well as other very helpful topics on tapering in general. You may have already found our topic on 'what is withdrawal syndrome' which is helpful too to know what you are up against and why you may feel the way you do.

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Another thing that is helpful is to enter all the drugs and supplements into the drug interactions checker at drugs.com and see if any combinations can account for uncomfortable symptoms. You'll notice there are moderate cautions between the ones you are prescribed:

 

Interactions between your selected drugs

clonazepam ↔ sertraline

Applies to: clonazepam, sertraline

Using clonazePAM together with sertraline may increase side effects such as dizziness, drowsiness, and difficulty concentrating. Some people may also experience some impairment in thinking and judgment. You should avoid or limit the use of alcohol while being treated with these medications. Avoid driving or operating hazardous machinery until you know how the medications affect you. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

Switch to professional interaction data

clonazepam ↔ paroxetine

Applies to: clonazepam, Paxil (paroxetine)

Using clonazePAM together with PARoxetine may increase side effects such as dizziness, drowsiness, and difficulty concentrating. Some people may also experience some impairment in thinking and judgment. You should avoid or limit the use of alcohol while being treated with these medications. Avoid driving or operating hazardous machinery until you know how the medications affect you. It is important to tell your doctor about all other medications you use, including vitamins and herbs. Do not stop using any medications without first talking to your doctor.

 

Are you taking anything else? You can check here and post your results here in your topic.

[Athena]

Hello Prestorb and welcome to SA!

 

I am glad you have found us. It is normal to feel alone when we start having withdrawal symptoms, but here we all understand you very well! You have found a friendly place where you can share your feelings and questions. Also please don't be too hard on yourself for feeling sad and depressed and not being able to do outside activities much, these are all part of the symptoms.

 

You are in good hands here, with knowledgeable people like CW giving you great tips and suggestions. Please know that you will eventually feel better, and meanwhile you have a great place to turn to!

 

Take good care!

 

Athena xx

[Prestorb]

Thank you CW and Athena for your welcome and feedback! I truly appreciate being heard and understood. Yes, my Paxil is a 10 mg tablet, so I can easily cut it in half. I may need to try that, I was feeling better when I was still taking the Paxil but at the reduced dosage with the Zoloft. I don't take any other Rx drugs, just vitamins and minerals. Thank you again for your input and encouragement! Rachel

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

Ok, so maybe start with a half of a 10 mg tablet and see how you feel. If nothing drastic seems to occur then keep on with it for at least 4 days but go down if you begin to feel anything too strong in the way of start up symptoms. You can even start with 1/4 tablet (2.5 mg) too, it is your choice. You will be able to tell what works because your symptoms will calm a bit.

 

The only caution we would make is that be careful with the vitamins. For some reason, when withdrawal syndrome symptoms start, many people find that the B vitamins cause them to feel funny, like more anxious or 'wired'. If this happens, stop taking them and see if things improve. You want to only be changing one thing at a time (like the paxil dose) otherwise you won't know what is causing what.

 

Let us know how it goes.

[Prestorb]

So I started with 5 mg of the Paxil yesterday, seems as if I already feel a little better but I am sure it is too soon to tell. I also generally take Vitamin D, a fish oil supplement, a multivitamin, a PMS Comfort supplement, Biotin, and Magnesium Chelate at night. It sounds as if from what I am reading, maybe I should only take the Vitamin D and Magnesium Chelate until I stabilize? Sounds as if the others might be affecting my nervous system negatively? I have a cold right now and took some Benadryl and a daytime allergy med a couple of days ago, and it seemed that my system didn't like those at all. I am just now beginning to understand how sensitive we become in WD mode, ugh. Thank you again, this is a lifeline, what a blessing!

[Rhiannon]

Some people find vitamin D overstimulating, so you might want to take a lower dose. Magnesium is usually tolerated well, and fish oil (again, watch the dose, some people find it stimulating at too high of doses). 

 

You're right, we become very sensitive to many things in withdrawal.

 

I like your plan of going back on the 5 mg Paxil. I would say now, don't change anything else for a while. Your brain is struggling from all the changes you've made recently and it's trying to establish a new homeostasis. Give it time to do that. You're not going to feel back to normal overnight, because that super fast taper off Paxil (10 mg a week! OMG!) has caused biochemical chaos, and the brain is incredibly complex, so that everything affects something else downstream which then affects something else which then feeds back and causes something else to change back upstream again, which then affects everything else, et cetera. It takes time for all these processes to readjust themselves. Give them that time.

 

Eventually you'll find that things are feeling distinctly better. It might take a couple of months, or maybe longer. At that point, that's the time to begin a slow taper. 

 

Meanwhile you have time to study the Tapering section and learn your options for how to do that.

 

Welcome to the forum! It sounds to me like you're going to do well. It might not feel like that for a while, but hang in there.

[Rhiannon]

I should add to the "don't change anything else" that that's presuming that you don't get overstimulated by the 5 mg; as CW says you could try 1/4 tablet if the 5 mg is too much. But give the 5 mg a few more days. And then if you decide to go down, that's probably enough changing (at some point the changing causes more problems than getting just the right dose would solve).

 

I think given the history you describe that your system probably needs time to settle down now.

[Prestorb]

Thank you RHI, I agree and will see how I am feeling after a few more days. I think I will cut out the Vit D and reduce my coffee consumption for now to see if that helps. I seem to be having some nausea, dizziness, headache, and brain zaps that hit me within a couple of hours after I take my medication. I usually take it late morning or midday, after I've had coffee and eaten. My coffee is mostly decaf, but then I put molasses, honey, and half-n-half in it, so I need to minimize that for now. Today, the real yuckiness only lasted for an hour or so, and I have general tiredness and unclear thinking that comes and goes, but not as many symptoms as many other members. Not that it isn't debilitating, it is and has been, but I know it will get better and it just takes time. I am fortunate to have my husband to support me (financially and emotionally) right now, so I can focus on getting better and taking care of my son. And SO grateful for this forum! Thank you again and Happy Valentines Day!

[Prestorb]

So I added the 5 mg of Paxil to my 25 mg of Zoloft 4 days ago, cut all my vitamins except for 400 mg of chelated Mg at night two days ago, and am trying to avoid stimulants as much as possible (challenging because I have a sweet tooth!). Not sure what has had the most impact, but I definitely feel WAY better than when I first logged in on Friday, Feb. 13th. So I plan to sit here for now and count my blessings for the very moderate side effects I am having at the moment that come and go - brain zaps, dizziness, unclear thinking. Thank you, thank you, thank you for your continued encouragement and support!

[cymbaltawithdrawal5600]

That's what we like to hear, PO. Now the challenge will be to stay the course. You need to keep with that dosage for at least a month, don't change anything if at all possible. Your body needs to stabilize and it may rock a bit while it is doing it but don't panic and change the doses, not yet. Lets wait and see what happens, you have plenty of time to get off the drugs safely.

[Prestorb]

I have been taking Paxil for 5 years, but I just started with the 25 mg of Zoloft around January 10th of this year (it was supposed to replace Paxil). It seems the Zoloft would be the easier one to taper off initially, whereas the Paxil will most likely be harder and take longer. Any thoughts? I didn't see this addressed in the taper section, but maybe it is. It just seems that maybe my system hasn't really had time to adjust to the Zoloft yet, so I would like to taper it out as soon as possible. But I did go from 40 to zero mg Paxil in 3 weeks, then back up to 5 mg Paxil two weeks later. I guess I feel that the Paxil is the short straw here (I was definitely experiencing WD from it), the Zoloft is just there and I'd like to be rid of it. I am ok right now, sleeping well but very grumpy and irritable most of the time with my 11 year old son. I have WD symptoms, but they are very moderate relative to others on the site.

[Prestorb]

I think I am doing ok although I have definitely had WD symptoms that are affecting quality of life but they mostly come an go - dizziness, teariness, lack of motivation, tiredness, brain fog, anhedonia, headache, hot flashes - mostly at night, interrupted sleep. My knees are sore and aching a lot, so I think this is also a WD symptom because it's not due to over exercising and I am in good health and not overweight. I cut out all my vitamins which seemed to help with overstimulation, although I still get overly emotional from time to time - but that could very well be hormonal.

 

Overall, I think I am managing the symptoms OK. I am not working right now, which is a blessing and a curse. It eliminates work related stress which can make WD so much worse. But it leaves me with too much time to ruminate about how unmotivated and unproductive I am at this point in my life, so that is frustrating and depressing. I would welcome more distraction and yet, I don't want to stress myself unnecessarily. I've been there too many times and it wasn't pretty. I guess that is impatience with the process, and I am sure we all feel that way.

 

My plan is to be completely off the Zoloft within another couple of weeks (since I have only been on it for about 6+ weeks). I don't anticipate this to be a major hurdle (hopefully!), as I really think that most of my symptoms are from tapering down on Paxil. This site has been such a blessing in that I don't feel SO alone in this process when I can read everyone's posts and glean helpful info and tips. Thank you, thank you, thank you to all the folks that keep this site up and running - it is truly a Godsend! Cheers :-)

[clearday]

I have definitely had WD symptoms that are affecting quality of life but they mostly come an go - dizziness, teariness, lack of motivation, tiredness, brain fog, anhedonia, headache, hot flashes - mostly at night, interrupted sleep. 

 

I had each and all those symptoms (except I had no headaches) when I quit Prozac years ago; they all went away eventually;

 

And as far as the "teariness", I had a lot of that during my first six months off Lexapro this past year, and it slowly went away too.

 

The teariness (tear-up at the drop of a hat) is very common. As are all your other WD symptoms.

[Prestorb]

Thank you Clearday, I just need to keep hearing that over and over! I appreciate the reinforcement. Just keeping the faith...

[ten0275]

Prestorb, hey.

 

Thanks for coming over to my thread and leaving your words, it means a lot. And I am glad if any bit of what I wrote proves useful or comforting to you.

 

Sorry to hear you're dealing with the uncontrollable weepiness. That was a big symptom for me for awhile. I think it was at its worst between months four and eight. I would wake up in the morning and in very short order, begin sobbing. It baffled me. I've never been the type of person to hide my emotions. If I'm watching a film, reading a book, or seeing something unfold that beckons tears, I've always let them flow. But I was never in the frequent-crier club. Until withdrawal. It was hard to go out in public because I'd be crying prior to leaving, fighting back the tears the whole time out, and returning to weepdom as soon as I was back in my utilitarian environs. Neuro-emotions. But damn if those tears didn't come from some deep saline reservoir within my own wounded self.

 

Here's how it stopped. It began to lessen in duration. Subtly. I'd spend less time per day with moist eyes, runny nose, and tissue in hand. Real subtle. Like you know how in the spring, the days get longer ever-so gradually? It was that subtle. Just a little less crying per day. Also, I found that when I wanted, or moreover needed to hold back the tears - say for a business meeting or while with my young children - I'd be able to actually set the emotions aside until a more private moment. This was impossible in the worst days, but did become feasible as I healed.

 

Now it is the other way around. If I am feeling stressed out or if I make a cut off the measly portion of mirtazapine I am still on, and the hurting gets going real good, I actually have to force myself to cry. Usually I have to use a sentimental movie to aid me. Crying, neuro-emotive or not, causes biochemical changes in us. And in certain moments, I need that shift. So I went from uncontrollable weepiness to weepiness on-demand. How's that for a turnaround?

 

Anyway, that's how that bit worked for me.

 

It was nice to read your story - to get a feel for what you are surmounting. You have a positive vibe and you are looking very squarely at what stands before you. Take your time with your taper and stay strong of spirit. You are going to be all-good in due course. Trust that.

 

Hang in there.

 

Dave

[Prestorb]

Thank you so much for stopping in and writing Dave, I really appreciate hearing about your experiences and your words of encouragement! I like the perspective I gain from what others write, my symptoms often seem so mild by comparison - even though they don't feel that way to me. No crying at all today - go figure, but thank goodness because it gives me such a headache!

 

I am trying to be positive, especially with what I post, but what really goes on in my head is less so. This site and encouragement from folks like you make a huge difference though. Thank you again, you definitely deserve the little "sunshine" symbol because I think you send out a little sunshine every time you post! ☺️

[Prestorb]

Just an update, I am OK given that I increased my Paxil dosage to 10 mg to slow down the emotional roller coaster and discontinued the Zoloft completely - all within the last week. I definitely noticed a calming effect and slightly uplifted mood when I increased Paxil, and most definitely irritability when I discontinued Zoloft, along with some sleep disruption. But otherwise, not too much else so I feel pretty fortunate. I've made a lot of med changes over the last couple of months, and although I don't feel great or particularly "happy", I am glad to be down to just the Paxil. I intend to hold here for at least a month, possibly longer.

 

I am praying (and I do that a LOT these days) that in time my mood will lighten a bit, the irritability will lessen, my brain function and productivity will improve, and I will start to feel a little "happier". I am trying to NOT commit to anything new and stay away from unnecessary stressors for the time being, I know I need time to heal. Oh, the only supplement I am beginning to take again is the chelated magnesium at night to help with sleep and irritability. But I have to be careful with it, because too much can also make me lethargic.

[Rhiannon]

Glad you're doing okay with the changes. Again, I encourage you to minimize drug changes now. You're off the Zoloft. I would be thinking more in terms of changing nothing for three to six months, than one month. Your brain seriously needs some steady stability now so it can rebalance itself from all these drastic changes.

 

Brains don't grow and heal fast. In fact, they don't really know how to heal from what these drugs do to them. We have no built-in mechanisms for healing from something our bodies have never before encountered during evolution at any point. So it's very up and down, overshoot, undershoot; turn on a gene, turn off a gene, see what happens, another gene gets turned on, another off, it's a very very complex process. And during that process every time you add in a new drug or take away a drug, it's back to square one.

 

So give your poor nervous system some time now. You won't feel better immediately. Nothing is going to make you feel 100% at this point. It's going to be up and down. Focus on the Symptoms and Self Care section, focus on taking care of yourself, giving your nervous system the most consistent and calming environment you can so it can do its healing work.

 

Them's my suggestions...

[Prestorb]

Thanks so much you for your feedback Rhi, I am in no hurry at this point. I wanted to get off the Zoloft as quickly as possibly because it was relatively new to my system. But I am good with staying where I am now for the time being, and just trying to get healthier emotionally and physically. I appreciate your support and encouragement! ☺️

[AliG]

Just came to say hi and i hope you're doing well. Thanks for your kind words on my thread. I appreciate that. It sounds like you are doing all the right things and time will do the rest.  I think you're right in trying to just get better emotionally and physically at the moment. You said you weren't working, but in a way this is your work at the moment. That's how i'm trying to look at my recovery. It's easy to beat yourself up because you're not  being as productive as you would like. I feel that way too, but i'm trying not to put any extra pressure on myself. For now, it's fine just "being" . I'm being gentle on myself. Maybe you could to. I would recommend the book "The Power of Now  " by Eckhart Tolle.  It's about living in the present, as things are . Hope that helps. 

[Sarasmiles]

Hi Rachel!  I'm glad to have found your thread!  I just wanted to send out my good wishes to you!

[Prestorb]

Thank you AliG and Sara, for stopping by to say hello and wish me well, I appreciate it! Thinking about this process as my "work" for now is a good suggestion AliG. I hadn't considered it in that way, but I like that idea. I do struggle with not being as motivated and productive as I normally am and like to be. And thank you for the book recommendation, I will definitely check that out, I recognize the author's name but haven't read any of his books. I am praying for healing for you both as well...☺️

[Skylarblue75]

Hi Pre, thank you for stopping by my thread, I've tried so many meds to try to break the cycle and I'm so sensitive that they all ramped up my symptoms, I'm so sensitive to everything, never like this before. But thank you for the kind suggestion. I hope you continue to do well

[Prestorb]

I seem to have hit the mimic depression stage of WD, just a general lack of interest in anything. What fun, but at least I am not angry, irritable, emotional and crying all the time. Although I am not quite sure which is worse? I seem to seesaw between these extremes. Hopefully, this symptom will be short lived!

 

It makes me question if I reinstated too much with 10 mg of Paxil, because this is similar to how I felt on 40 mg Paxil except that I was even more lethargic and slept a lot. But I am trying to just hold here because I have made a lot of changes since the beginning of the year, and it has only been 10 days since I cut out the Zoloft completely. I know I need to be exercising and just getting out of the house more (both would make me feel better, I think), but I have zero motivation. Normally, I am a very motivated person, so this is one of the most challenging symptoms for me. On the upside, I am easier for my family to be around than when I am angry and irritable! Ugh, very frustrating. I'm trying hard to just accept it as it is and convince myself that it will pass.

[Sarasmiles]

How are you doing, Prestorb?  Just wanted you to know I was thinking of you.

[Prestorb]

Thanks Sara, I appreciate you asking and thinking of me! I am just struggling with a general lack of interest and motivation, depression mimicking symptoms I think. I desperately want to to feel some zest for life, but at the same time I am thankful that I am not having any other dreadful symptoms! Like you, I am impatient with the process and keep wondering if I reinstated too much Paxil, or is this just WD from my quick taper? It's frustrating but I know it could be a lot worse, so I am trying to be patient with it and just hold at this dosage for now. I am also starting to experiment with various supplements, one at a time, because I had cut them all out about a month ago. And I have too much time on my hands! If I were motivated, that would be great.... Thanks again for checking on me, hope you are feeling better! Rachel

[Sarasmiles]

I feel kind umotivated, too.  I feel as though I go through the motions; yoga classes, walks in the woods with the dogs; even housework (which I'm mostly neglecting) and work work.  I am tired.  I figure I'll keep faking it til I make it, as they say...

 

Hang in there, Rachel.   What makes you think you might have reinstated too much Paxil?  This "unmotivated" feeling was a side effect of Paxil for you?

[Prestorb]

Hi Sara, I think the "fake it 'till you make it" is a good way to go though, I haven't been motivated enough to do that! Of course, you have to get enough rest too - that is not a problem for me! Sounds like maybe you need a little more rest though? Try not to push yourself too hard, we have opposite problems right now.

 

The Paxil was (is) weird for me, when it seemed to be working, I felt great and had tons of energy. But periodically (usually along with some stressful life event), I would go into a major depression that would last for months and along with that, very low motivation. This only happened when I took antidepressants. I never had this type of depression before that. So maybe the ADs just amplified whatever my emotions without them would have been.

 

I think I would feel better if pushed myself to do more than I have been doing at least, so I just need to do that and stop yammering about it! And I plan to make a 1 mg cut when I've reached my month at 10 mg, so maybe I will notice more energy and motivation then. I hope so! You hang in there too Sara, and get enough rest - sounds like you stay very busy! ☺

[AliG]

Hi P, just dropping in to say hello and see how you're going?  I'm dealing with similar issues (rebound depression).  Ironic isn't it, as that's why we started on them in the first place.  That seems like a "picnic" now!   Wishing you well.

[Prestorb]

Hi AliG, thank you so much for stopping by my thread! I am struggling with the rebound or mimic depression, but also thankful that I am not having many of the other dreadful symptoms. I try not to beat myself up about being so tired and unmotivated all the time, and just accept that this is WD and a sign that I am healing. I have been reading a couple of books by Baylissa Frederick that talk a lot about acceptance. She had a long bout with WD from benzos and is now recovered. Thank you again, I am wishing you and everyone else here well in your journeys. I appreciate your support so much! ☺️

[Prestorb]

I suppose I should post an update (it has been a while) but not much to report really, not a lot has changed since the last update. Just general malaise for me, although I do have a cold so I have been extra tired and unmotivated, joy. I also tend to wake up early morning, 2 or 3 am, and it often takes an hour or more to get back to sleep. I am fortunate to be able to go to bed early and not get up too early, so I still get enough sleep, but this is definitely a WD symptom. I did get a little emotional yesterday (which hasn't been happening) and attributed it to some Benadryl I had taken the night before for my cold. I was more productive last week before I started getting a cold, and felt kinda good about that. My feelings in general are mostly just flat, except when I am irritated with my son. It's dull but I just keep telling myself it's temporary, part of the process. Still very dull and I don't like it, but I am trying hard to accept the process for what it is for me and be thankful for what I am spared.

 

I am more reclusive than normal, which I don't particularly like either, but don't really have the energy for much social interaction. I do have my 11 year old son and husband to deal with, and sometimes that is more than I manage very well. This is definitely WD, because I am normally more social, although I have always a needed a fair amount of alone time as well. I have been corresponding with a couple of local SA members and that has been good for lifting my spirits I think. I plan to make a 10% cut in a couple of weeks, so that will probably spice things up a bit. I feel like I have probably stabilized as much as I am going to. The main reason I am waiting to make a cut is because my son is home with me on Spring Break this week, and I am always more irritable for several days after a change so I want to spare him as much of that as possible.

 

I pray for healing for all of us and am thankful for this community! Cheers

[clarabella79]

:)Hi Prestorb, it's good to see an update from you  

 

I'm sorry to hear you have a cold and the withdrawal's causing you to wake during the early hours  I suppose the one saving grace is that you are able to fall asleep again after an hour. I experienced early morning waking after I'd fully tapered off my medication during 2008, so I think it's safe to say it's definitely a part of withdrawal. I hope it's just a passing thing for you and you're able to get a better night's sleep as time goes on.

 

I'm glad to hear you've forged some links with local SA members. I hope it's helping knowing there are others close by who're experiencing and recovering from the same condition.

 

Hope you manage to enjoy the time you've got with your son this week, too