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Woof: Cymbalta re-stabilization, after cold turkey withdrawal


woof

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I was interested in anyone's thoughts on the Cymbalta to Prozac crossover. 

 

Woof,

 

My personal view is that the benefits of crossing over to Prozac are, at best, uncertain.  This concept arose by analogy to the concept of crossing over to Valium in the benzo withdrawal context.  The problem is that A/D withdrawal and the effects of different A/Ds are not nearly as predictable as are the benzos.  I have seen a LOT of people struggle with the crossover to Prozac and am not sure that it is really the best approach for many. 

 

I would be in favor of a direct reduction from the Cymbalta using the liquid bead reduction method to do it in very small decrements.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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Hi Andy,

 

I did not know there was a liquid form of Cymbalta, that would be great if there is a liquid form. 

 

Does that need to be specially compounded?

 

Thanks so much,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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I did not know there was a liquid form of Cymbalta, that would be great if there is a liquid form.

 

Sorry, Woof.  I had a total and complete brain lapse when I responded and wasn't thinking of Cymbalta (even thought I typed the word).

 

You are correct that Cymbalta does not come in liquid and can't be compounded.  (I've modified my post above to correct my error.)

 

Even so, the bead reduction method has worked for many who have gotten off of the drug. 

 

I guess my point is that while some people may favor a crossover to Prozac, I've just never been a big fan.  I don't  know how others feel about this and would hope they would weigh in.

 

Best and sorry for the confusion,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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No problem at all Andy, I really appreciate all of your concern and guidance.

 

Considering my history of CT, wd sx's and full dose (20mg) reinstatement at 5 weeks; I realize I definitely have a sensitized nervous system. 

 

Do I need to come off of Cymbalta completely to have a chance at having my current symptoms, hopefully resolve?

 

On the contrary, if I were to hold here indefinitely, could the healing process begin from here and  my current symptoms, hopefully resolve?

 

 

 

As for the Vicodin, the anxiety has pretty much resolved, but I have no appetite, my body feels cold and I am getting more restless and having more trouble sleeping. 

 

Do I just hold at this level until this all resolves...hopefully?

 

I was doing quite well until my July 4th cut that's also 2 weeks before I had my surgery and 6 weeks of Vicodin.

 

Thanks Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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Do I need to come off of Cymbalta completely to have a chance at having my current symptoms, hopefully resolve?

 

On the contrary, if I were to hold here indefinitely, could the healing process begin from here and  my current symptoms, hopefully resolve?

 

Woof,

 

One of the great debates that persists in all areas of withdrawal from psychotropic medication is whether or not someone needs to be completely off the medicine in order to heal.  This is a difficult and complicated question.  In my view, the key question is whether your symptoms are coming from withdrawal or from an adverse reaction to the medicine.  Assuming it is the former, there is no reason you should not be able to stabilize prior to getting off the medicine and, given a long enough hold, find a place where your symptoms resolve.  The issue becomes complicated, however, when you are reacting in some adverse manner to the medicine.  If that is the case, you can't expect to feel completely well until the offending agent is no longer being introduced into your system.  This is, however, an area where I'd love to hear what others have to say because I think it is a very interested and complicated area.

 

Do I just hold at this level until this all resolves...hopefully?

 

That would be my recommendation, Woof.  I don't think there is anything you can do right now that will be better for you than holding firm.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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"One of the great debates that persists in all areas of withdrawal from psychotropic medication is whether or not someone needs to be completely off the medicine in order to heal.  This is a difficult and complicated question.  In my view, the key question is whether your symptoms are coming from withdrawal or from an adverse reaction to the medicine." 

 

 

Andy,

 

I had no sx's from Cymbalta.  All sx's have all come subsequent to the CT withdrawal. 

 

So would you say the CT, now puts me into the adverse reaction to the medicine category?

 

Or would I still fall into the symptoms from withdrawal category; desptie the CT and reinstatement and that I am having some symptoms now albeit stemming from the CT withdrawal?

 

Of interest is that during this entire time I felt best after I made one cut from 20mg to 18 mg. I actually felt pretty good then.

 

Thanks so much Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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Woof,

 

My gut would say the former, although I sometimes wonder if people can move from one category into the other as they withdraw.  If you don't find yourself having specific symptoms in reaction to taking the medicine, it is more likely than not that you are having withdrawal responses.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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Andy,

 

I would really like to attempt to fully reinstate to 20mg, or as close to that as possible and hold.  Or would that be too late at this point.  I started tapering 4 months ago on April 21st. 

 

The only symptom I was having after 4 months, January-April 21, at the full 20g dose was morning anxiety and the 2-4 wake-up.  At that time I used to fall back to sleep now I never fall back to sleep after I wake between 2-4 AM.  I was actually starting to feel pretty good.

 

The 25 mg Valium took care of all of my other symptoms.

 

Is updosing the Cymbalta the same process as tapering? 10% per month or so? Or slower? 2-3 beads per week, month?

 

This is getting very interesting and hopeful.  As I just realized I never had a problem with Cymbalta.

 

Thanks Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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Woof,

 

I understand the desire to "DO SOMETHING" whenever you don't feel well, but moving up and down in dose can be extremely destabilizing to your CNS.  The way I see it, you were just getting to a point on 14.5 that felt close to as good as you had felt earlier on 20.  Then you had to have a procedure that required you to introduce another med (Vicodin) that affects the brain chemistry.  You felt some issues in the aftermath of stopping that medicine.  It has not been very long.

 

Rather than updose to 20 (and risk potential further destabilization by changing the input to your brain), wouldn't it make more sense to hold at 14.5 for a while longer and see how you feel in a couple of weeks?  If you can stabilize at a lower amount and feel basically the same, you will (I) have less to reduce when you do decide to get off and (II) be putting a lesser amount of chemicals into your body on a daily basis.

 

I'm not anxious to see you jumping around in dose, Woof, especially when you had what seems to be a legitimate reason (Vicodin) that you had a small wave.  If it were me, I would stay at the 14.5 for a little while, keep close tabs on my symptoms, and try to de-stress as best as possible.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

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Thanks Andy

 

That sounds like a plan.

 

Thank you for all of your time, information and guidance.

 

Most Sincerely Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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Hi Woof--  the 4 week hold that is recommended is for the absolute minimum amount of time. It's not recommended to hold for less because it takes a long time for the brain to sort things out and symptoms have a nasty habit of showing up after a long time with no problems.  If a taper schedule is rushed those symptoms will compound on top of each other and then one day explode in a very unpleasant manner.  No matter how good you feel it is always safer to error on the side of caution and wait a little longer. Once the symptoms have compounded and showed up it leaves the brain in a sensitized state that is very hard and a long time recovering from.

 

If you're not feeling side effects or WD symptoms right now, that is a good place to be.  We all want off as fast as possible, but there is a lot of healing going on that we are not conscience of, which can't be rushed.

 

Help me please,

 

I have been really stupid and I think I may be in the state you described in your quote above.  From 4 months ago in May.  I really did not think I was rushing, but obviously for me I was.

 

I have been at this dose since July 4th and about 11 days after that cut I noticed anhedonia.

 

Now I have completely, (10/10) lost my appetite, I have no emotions (anhedonia) - I have no desire at all.

 

The anxiety from the Vicodin is all now gone.

 

But I started to notice the Anhedonia before using the Vicodin.

 

These symptoms from the July 4th cut are present and without any change at all.  My July cut was 15 beads

 

If I ever get back to where I was before the July 4th cut I have decided I am no longer going to taper.  I seriously just plan to hold at that dose. I can't take the tapering.

 

I am having a difficult time.  I am having a hard time I feel no HOPE, desire, no nothing.

 

I can't stay with no heart, no love, no nothing

 

I have never had any of these symptoms even during my CT and reinstatement.

 

Updose 1-2 beads for a week and see how things go or keep holding.

 

Thanks Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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On July 04, 2016 I made my third 10% per month cut down from 16mg to 14.5mg. 

 

One week after this last cut I noticed some anhedonia, which is new to me.

 

Any advice is greatly appreciated.  :)

 

Is it within the normal range of wd to notice a different wd sx during a taper?  

 

Am I now getting down to a level of Cymbalta in which other sx's can and or should be anticipated?

 

About a week after this last cut, I have noticed a lot of anxiety in the morning until about 12 noon.  I have not had these sx's with my first two cuts. 

 

I was wondering if I should just try and wait this out for another week or two? 

 

Or should I try to updose?   If I should updose how much should I updose by? 

 

From now on I am going to hold for 2 or 3 weeks after I feel good. 

 

Please help me,

 

I can't believe this, but I just realized that not only was I beginning to have anhedonia July 14th.  I also just saw in my notes that I had additionally began to experience anxiety on July 18th.

 

Both of which were prior to me taking any Vicodin starting July 24th.  I believe the Vicodin was masking my Cymbalta wd anhedonia and anxiety during the 5 or so weeks of Vicodin use and when I stopped it the anxiety was overwhelming.

 

I have used Vicodin during my reinstatement and taper prior to coming to this site and never experienced any post use anxiety, it would just make me feel slightly down for 2-3 days when I would stop it.

 

So, I believe the extreme anxiety I was experiencing after the Vicodin, was actually due to me going to fast on my Cymbalta taper.

 

If I were to updose, how much should I updose from the 15 bead cut I made 2.5 months ago on July 4th?  

 

3 beads and wait a week?

 

Thanks Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Woof, it's probably better to stay at current dose than updose, even when you've been holding as long as you have.

 

What non-drug techniques are you using to cope with your withdrawal symptoms?

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results

Cymbalta 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 2016: 20 mg to 7 mg exact doses and dates in this post; 2017: 6.3 mg to  0.0 mg  Aug. 12; details here


scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet

Link to comment

If the primary problem with updosing is the lack of sleep I can deal with that.  But my other symptoms are unbearable.

 

I plan on staying on Cymbalta and not tapering anymore.

 

I just can't take the 8/10 insomnia, 10/10 , anxiety, anhedonia, my body is cold and if I force myself to eat, my body gets super cold and I get a paresthesia's on my arms, back and neck and my sx's are unbearable.

 

I realize updosing is a last measure, well I am there now.

 

Is it correct that the anti-anxiety properties of ADs takes about 3-4 weeks to take affect?

 

Is the primary problem with updosing primarily sleeplessness?

 

Thanks so much Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

I just glanced at your benzo topic. What dose of Valium are you taking? When did you last reduce dose, and what was the previous dose? Please add those details to your signature.

 

One of the challenges with a dose increase is the risk of symptoms getting worse, particularly when someone's CNS is sensitized. Cymbalta often functions as an "accelerator" -- a stimulating drug -- may aggravate the anxiety and insomnia that are your main concerns.

This is not medical advice. Discuss any decisions about your medical care with a knowledgeable medical practitioner.
1997-1999 Effexor; 2002-2005 Effexor XR 37.5 mg linear taper, dropping same #beads/week with bad results

Cymbalta 60 mg 2012 - 2015; 2016: 20 mg to 7 mg exact doses and dates in this post; 2017: 6.3 mg to  0.0 mg  Aug. 12; details here


scallywag's Introduction
Online spreadsheet for dose taper calculations and nz11's THE WORKS spreadsheet

Link to comment

Thanks Scally,

 

I have not changed my Valium dose, I have left it at 25 mg/day. 

 

I too wish that was a possible culprit.

 

Is it correct that the anti-anxiety properties of ADs take about 3-4 weeks to take affect?

 

Thanks Again,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Woof,

 

I'm a little confused to be honest.  Your post on the 16th was fairly optimistic.  Less than a week later you seem to have hit some kind of panic where you are ready to updose and do whatever is  necessary to get rid of the symptoms.  I understand you are very uncomfortable right now but how long has it been that way?  If it's been only a day or two that you've had the REALLY bad symptoms I will view things differently than if you've been in a really bad place for a while.

 

If you can clarify that would help.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

Hi Andy,

 

I am sorry for not telling you this before, but on the night of the 15th, I took an extra dose of Valium thinking that it would quell the residual of the Vicodin which is why I seemed to have gotten better on the 16th; I thought that was going to be the end of what I thought was the Vicodin anxiety which is why I did not mention it - again I apologize for if you are going to be able to guide me you need to know everything, even the smallest detail.

 

I have been taking an extra 5 mg Valium every 1-3 days, thinking it would clear up what I thought was the residual Vicodin induced anxiety. I did this because the anxiety would return within one to two days, but I still thought it was the Vicodin, with a plan to just stop the extra Valium within a week or so.

 

I was wrong, as it was not the Vicodin causing the anxiety, it was my Cymbalta cut of July 4th.

 

So, yes I have been in a really bad place since July 14th, it's just that the Vicodin followed by the extra Valium was masking it.  That's everthing.

 

Again I apologize for not mentioning the intermittent Valium dosage increases before.

 

Thank you so much,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Woof,

 

With all due respect, you are, I suspect, falling into the mistake that MANY/MOST/ALL of us fall into with regard to this process which is to think there has to be some logic to it and seeking to tie "feeling bad" to some event that took place.  In your case, you have looked at Vicodin, Valium and Cymbalta as reasons you are not feeling well.  It could be that any of them were, in fact, the source of the problem, or it could simply be that you are in a wave and at other times you were in something of a window.  I could make a chemically-based argument for each of them as the source of the problem but I would have no way of knowing if my post hoc justification was truly accurate or "just a nice story."

 

In the face of that and feeling crappy you have done the next thing MANY/MOST/ALL of us have done at least once which is to say, "Oh my god, what have I done and what can I do to fix it... NOW!"  And, as is also normal, you have said the next logical thing which is "once I get this fixed and back to the way I was, I'm just going to stay there and not deal with this tapering nonsense!"

 

That is all very normal, very withdrawal driven and fine.  If, after really weighing it all at a time when you feel better, you conclude you'd rather stay on the Cymbalta and deal with that eyes wide open, nobody can (or will) tell you that is wrong.  There are no rights and wrongs in this process.  However, if there was a strong and compelling reason you wanted off the meds in the first place, then you should revisit that reason and decide if you feel differently now or if you still want to get off. 

 

Have you made "mistakes"?  Perhaps.  You may have tapered too fast at times.  You may have jumped around in dose a few times.  You may not have held as long as you might have at times.  But there is no textbook for all of this.  It's ALL trial and error and each person will react differently.  You may have done things differently and still had the same adverse reactions you have had.  There is simply no way to know.

 

My personal view (and I just finished rereading your thread from July 4 on) is that you gained some additional cushioning from the Valium and then from the Vicodin (which acts on GABA and therefore can potentiate the Valium) which was adversely impacted when you went off the Vicodin (notwithstanding the periodic increase in Valium) which helped you along the way.  HOWEVER, I see several days where you indicated feeling better from the Cymbalta cut which were then followed by feeling worse again.  Those sound like windows and waves and sound very normal for the process. 

 

I would think that if you were to simply hold and tough through the symptoms you are feeling that you will return to what Brass would call Withdrawal Normal which for you was not too bad.  It's hard to say how long it would take and I know that is what you really want to know, but anyone who tries to give you a time frame in this context is kidding you and themselves.  It is possible that if you add a few beads you will recover sooner, but there is no way to guarantee that.  It is another change and another destabilization.  I think the way Brass puts it is the way that makes most sense -- if you are unable to function then you need to do something, e.g., a small updose.  If you can function but it sucks then I would probably counsel not to do anything and to hold on tight and ride this out.

 

Once you are stable you can look at what you want to do going forward, but I would not make any definitive statements about how you wish to proceed at this stage. 

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

Andy,

 

Thank you so very much!

 

I know this took a lot of time from your life to compose that post and explain in a most kind and insightful fashion all of the issues.

 

One last question is what would you consider a small updose, because I think I am there.

 

Thanks so much,

 

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Woof,

 

If you are set on trying to find a level where you see comfort, I would probably increase by 3-5 beads and wait 5 days to see if you improve.  If not, I'd add another 3-5 beads.  Wash, rinse, repeat until you find a level where you feel improvement. If you get through a month going like that and don't see improvement, it probably makes sense to revisit the issue.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

Andy

 

Thanks so much!

 

BTW - I had no idea that Vicodin worked on GABA receptors, but that information makes a lot more sense of all of this. 

 

Thanks Again,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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Wow, talk about windows. I slept great last night 9PM-4:30AM, I've had no tinnitus all day and have had no anxiety whatsoever this morning or at anytime all day.

 

This is quite a roller-coaster, but I am doing fine now.  :)

 

My goal is stabilization. :)

 

Thank you for your advice.

 

Hi Andy,

 

I just read my post from July 19th which was 3 days before my surgery and prior to the Vicodin and any additional Valium. 

 

With what you taught me about Vicodin and how it works on the GABA receptors, I know I was on it long enough at least 6 weeks to develop cause a Benzo like withdrawal. 

 

I even remember that while I was on the Vicodin I was sleeping 8 hours a night and had no anxiety and felt the best I've felt in some time. My appetite was great. 

 

I have been off the Vicodin now for about 2.5 weeks.

   

So coming off of the Vicodin was like a Benzo withdrawal from heck.

 

Now that I am putting all this information together, along with what you have taught me and suggested. 

 

I have decided to just stay and hold.

 

Is it correct that Benzo withdrawal can induce an absolute loss of appetite?

 

Thanks for everything

Woof :)

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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  • Moderator Emeritus

Is it correct that Benzo withdrawal can induce an absolute loss of appetite?

 

Absolutely, Woof. 

 

One of the places that is frequently hardest hit in withdrawal is the gut which sends signals to the brain and vice-versa.  If it's not happy it isn't going to be looking for reward in the form of food.  I believe your analysis above is probably accurate and that rather than causing serotonin syndrome the vicodin potentiated the benzo action on GABA so that coming off has given you a short-term benzo-like withdrawal reaction.  I like the idea of just staying where you are, toughing through it, and getting back to your baseline.  If things get unbearable, please let us know and we can try to help further.

 

Earlier, Scally asked about non-drug coping strategies but you didn't answer?  What are you doing to calm your system?  Yoga, meditation, walks in nature, etc. are all great.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

Great to hear from you Andy,

 

Prior to my surgery on July 22, I worked out for 20 minutes twice a day on a stationary bike, before and after work. 

 

I would also go for a walk in the morning at around 4:30 AM (heck I was up anyway) :)

 

Since the surgery I have not done any of these activities...so I think should resume them....ya think :)

 

Also, at the peak of my post Vicodin anxiety, I actually did meditation one time for one hour.  I couldn't believe it, but it worked and made me absolutely calm for about 2.5 hours after...I think I can hear you....let's do that too. :) 

 

Andy thanks so much for everything!

 

Most Sincerely,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

Link to comment

Hi Woof,

 

I'm just passing by and wanted to say that I hope you feel better soon. Cymbalta is a beast! I recently went through a very scary, difficult time and I know that desperate feeling to get rid of the anxiety, angst, anedonia (sp), etc. It is awful. Every moment feels like an eternity and it seems impossible to endure. It did for me, anyway. I sure hope you get some relief soon.

 

Take care,

MMarie

1991ish-1997ish: Prozac and Clonazepam

1997-2006ish: Effexor and Clonazepam

2006ish-present: Cymbalta and Clonazepam

Provigil/Nuvigil: 2007-2014

"Booster" meds: Zoloft, Wellbutrin (both briefly) and Abilify

Rapidly tapered Abilify (clueless about this process) a year or two ago. Tiny dose, no withdrawals noticed.

Tapered Clonazepam from .5 mg down to .125 mg as of 12/2015. Last cut was .0625 mg. Holding until I'm done with Cymbalta. Maybe. Began tapering Cymbalta in 9/2015 from 90 mg. Began taper @ 5% wkly, lowered to 4% wkly 11/2015 and now at between 1-2.5% wkly.

6/27 22.7 mg (210 beads), 7/4 22.5 mg (208 beads), 7/12 22.1 mg (205 beads) and later that day added back the 3 beads to 22.5 mg, 7/14 updosed to 23 mg (213 beads), 7/16 updosed to 24 mg (219 beads), 7/23 updosed to 30 mg, 10/18/16 30 mg Cymbalta, ~.08 mg Clonazepam, 11/7/16 ~.06 mg Clonazepam, 11/14/16 ~.05 mg Clonazepam

 

Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/12043-mmarie-tapering-cymbalta/

Link to comment

Hey Woof. I can't add much to what Andy has already said. Great advice.  You seem to know what you have to do. Certain things seem to be working and you hopefully could/ should get back to them very soon.

 

To reiterate : what are you doing for " non - drug "  coping skills ? It's so important to get some of these lessons under your belt , so as not to rely on the drugs. As you are weaning off it is important to have strategies in place for the future , otherwise you could possibly fall back into the " drug model "

 

I noticed in your sig - Tylenol & aspirin. What are you taking them for ?   

Many SSRI's and SSNRI's over 20 years. Zoloft for 7 years followed by Effexor, Lexapro, Prozac, Cymbalta, Celexa, Pristiq, Valdoxan, Mianserin and more - on and off. No tapering. Cold turkey off Valdoxan - end of May 2014

 

                                                  Psych Drug - free since May 2014
.
         

Link to comment

Hi Woof,

 

I'm just passing by and wanted to say that I hope you feel better soon. Cymbalta is a beast! I recently went through a very scary, difficult time and I know that desperate feeling to get rid of the anxiety, angst, anedonia (sp), etc. It is awful. Every moment feels like an eternity and it seems impossible to endure. It did for me, anyway. I sure hope you get some relief soon.

 

 

Take care,

MMarie

 

Hi MMarie,

 

Thanks so much for the kind words and and your empathy.  That is exactly how I feel.  Things were going along fine and after this last cut, all heck broke lose, it is as you said very difficult to endure,.. crisis time. :(

 

I noticed in your Sig that you updosed. 

 

Did that eventually help?

 

Thanks so much for caring, Woof

 

 

Hey Woof. I can't add much to what Andy has already said. Great advice.  You seem to know what you have to do. Certain things seem to be working and you hopefully could/ should get back to them very soon.

 

To reiterate : what are you doing for " non - drug "  coping skills ? It's so important to get some of these lessons under your belt , so as not to rely on the drugs. As you are weaning off it is important to have strategies in place for the future , otherwise you could possibly fall back into the " drug model "

 

I noticed in your sig - Tylenol & aspirin. What are you taking them for ?   

AliG,

 

Thanks you so much for the support. I really need it now. This my first Crisis situation.

 

I thought that I read on this site that Tylenol was one of the "Cortisol fighters."

 

I believe AltoStrata has used aspirin for sleep and in the AM.  I may be incorrect, I was just copying her.

 

Thanks so much for all the support,

 

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

Link to comment

I know everyone is different, but if I were to updose 3-5 beads of Cymbalta, is it likely that the DP and anhedonia, would most likely to be helped first?

 

And the anxiety/insomnia would most likely take about 3-4 weeks to improve?

 

Thanks so much,

Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

Link to comment
  • Moderator Emeritus

Woof,

 

I know you are upset and scared about this and I know you want some kind of reassurance and certainty.  I could lie to you and say, "this is exactly how it will happen..."  But that would be dishonest and not very helpful (other than in a placebo fashion).

 

The honest answer is that we simply don't know how an increase will affect any one person with any one drug and any one symptom.

 

I wish I could give you certainty but I simply can't.

 

Just hang in there and things will get better over time.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Sertraline 50mg and Clonazapam .375mg from 2000 -- symptoms of dizziness Spring 2012

increased to .5 Clonazapam and 100mg Sertraline -- no improvement

Benzo microtaper from November 2012 to November 2014 (followed benzo sites "taper benzo first")

Started Sertraline taper in December 2014 cut by 25mg to 75mg; 62.5mg 1/1/15 and 50mg on 2/1/15

Held at 50mg through April 5 to use liquid 
Reduced dosage in 10% or less drops from 50mg to 25mg -- at single tablet of 25mg on 10/5/15

Transitioned to all liquid for accuracy while tapering -- Horrible insomnia -- back to 25mg liquid and held until October 1, 2016

10/16 -- 11/18 tapered very slowly to 10.6mg.  No real improvement and never really stable so updosed to 12.5mg (1/2 a pill) for convenience and long hold.

After 8+ months of holding with no noticeable improvement decided to add .4ml of liquid Prozac (about 1.5mg) to see if that improves the situation

Supplements, Magnesium, D3, Omega 3, curcumin, Valerian, 81mg Aspirin, L-Theanine, Vit. C,

 

Link to comment

Hi Woof,

 

To answer your question, I do feel better - mainly in the last 3 weeks. I am not totally sure it's all due to my updosing. I wish I did know for sure one way or the other. I was having a terrible time and it appears that I was having side effects from 2 other drugs I was taking at the time - Cytomel and Progesterone. I have no way of knowing how much each contributed to my misery. I am also in the thick of menopause and I think it may be contributing more than I previously thought.

 

I had been struggling since around April but in July, I was feeling hopeless and scared enough to contemplate signing myself in somewhere. Prior to April, I ran myself into a few walls by tapering faster than I should have. It wasn't intentional, it all just caught up with me. After April, it seemed as though I wasn't able to reduce by even 1 bead. The pattern of symptoms changed and they became unbearable. Again, the other meds may have been causing some of my misery unbeknownst to me at the time. I sure hope they account for some of it.

 

I am holding off on tapering any further until I develop some DBT, CBT and mindfulness skills. The anxiety I experienced was WAY more than I can manage at this time. I am hoping these skills can help me down the road. I may try EMDR after the DBT, too. For right now, I need a break from the psychological torture. And, so does my family!

 

Hang in there,

MMarie

1991ish-1997ish: Prozac and Clonazepam

1997-2006ish: Effexor and Clonazepam

2006ish-present: Cymbalta and Clonazepam

Provigil/Nuvigil: 2007-2014

"Booster" meds: Zoloft, Wellbutrin (both briefly) and Abilify

Rapidly tapered Abilify (clueless about this process) a year or two ago. Tiny dose, no withdrawals noticed.

Tapered Clonazepam from .5 mg down to .125 mg as of 12/2015. Last cut was .0625 mg. Holding until I'm done with Cymbalta. Maybe. Began tapering Cymbalta in 9/2015 from 90 mg. Began taper @ 5% wkly, lowered to 4% wkly 11/2015 and now at between 1-2.5% wkly.

6/27 22.7 mg (210 beads), 7/4 22.5 mg (208 beads), 7/12 22.1 mg (205 beads) and later that day added back the 3 beads to 22.5 mg, 7/14 updosed to 23 mg (213 beads), 7/16 updosed to 24 mg (219 beads), 7/23 updosed to 30 mg, 10/18/16 30 mg Cymbalta, ~.08 mg Clonazepam, 11/7/16 ~.06 mg Clonazepam, 11/14/16 ~.05 mg Clonazepam

 

Intro: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/12043-mmarie-tapering-cymbalta/

Link to comment

Hi Woof,

 

To answer your question, I do feel better - mainly in the last 3 weeks. I am not totally sure it's all due to my updosing.

 

Hang in there,

MMarie

Hello Marie,

 

Thank you for the answer to my question and I am way glad you are doing better. :)

 

Woof

 

 

Woof,

 

I know you are upset and scared about this and I know you want some kind of reassurance and certainty.  I could lie to you and say, "this is exactly how it will happen..."  But that would be dishonest and not very helpful (other than in a placebo fashion).

 

The honest answer is that we simply don't know how an increase will affect any one person with any one drug and any one symptom.

 

I wish I could give you certainty but I simply can't.

 

Just hang in there and things will get better over time.

 

Best,

 

Andy

 

Hi Andy,

 

Thank you for the encouragement and your honest and wise analysis.

 

You are always there for me and I can't thank you enough for that.

 

All the Best, Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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I'm not sure. Will get back to you . :blush:

Many SSRI's and SSNRI's over 20 years. Zoloft for 7 years followed by Effexor, Lexapro, Prozac, Cymbalta, Celexa, Pristiq, Valdoxan, Mianserin and more - on and off. No tapering. Cold turkey off Valdoxan - end of May 2014

 

                                                  Psych Drug - free since May 2014
.
         

Link to comment

Whatever Alto says is correct. She is the " boss lady ". Totally  correct ! :)  Always.  

Many SSRI's and SSNRI's over 20 years. Zoloft for 7 years followed by Effexor, Lexapro, Prozac, Cymbalta, Celexa, Pristiq, Valdoxan, Mianserin and more - on and off. No tapering. Cold turkey off Valdoxan - end of May 2014

 

                                                  Psych Drug - free since May 2014
.
         

Link to comment

"Charlottes Webb" CBD oil I believe is most effective, much more so than Cibdex.  I think it is a much higher quality product which really works.

 

It has dosing information and lists the mg of CBD, 24 mg per dose.  But it comes in lower and higher concentrations as well.

 

Sleep aid, (for the 2-4 AM wake up) is "Charlottes Webb" hemp oil. 

 

It's almost pure CBD and legal in all 50 states.  Also used for anxiety.

 

"Charlottes Webb"

http://www.cwhemp.com/

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

Link to comment

If I were to updose by 3-5 from 143 beads for 4-5 days and the appetite and anhedonia do not go away; would it be best to cut back down to the 143 beads which I have been on for almost 3 months, since July 4th, to minimize the destabilization (5 days vs. 90 days)?

 

Or would it be best just to stay at the new udose of 148 beads (143+5) even though I will only have been at that dose for 5 days?

 

Lastly, if the initial over stimulation causes me so much anxiety, that it would cause me to take an extra few Valium would that indicate that updosing is not an option for me?  I know I am super sensitized to meds, especially Cymbalta due to my CT wd.   

 

I was doing great until my July 4th 10% cut, after a 6 week hold and my subsequent 6 weeks on Vicodin no neuroemotions at all.  Just 2-4 AM wake up and mild 2/10 Tinitus.

 

After the Vicodin is when all heck broke lose 10/10 anxiety and anhedonia and no appetite.  Anhedonia and Anxiety is much better now 2-3/10.  But what's up with the lack of appetite, is this last thing to go after a Benzo-like Vicodin withdrawal.

 

Thanks Woof

If on a Benzo for a relatively short period of time, such as less than 6-12 months, one may want to consider tapering off their Benzo first (please see Will Hall's book on Harm Reduction)

 

Prior to commencing with an AD taper please consider what problems the AD is causing, as tapering is an extremely serious endeavor.   

If one has been on an AD for more than 10 yrs. please consider the potential long term negative consequences of AD withdrawal prior to tapering. (please see Drs. Healy, Glenmullen and Shipko) 

Prior to re-starting an AD taper, please do not resume tapering until all w/d sx's from any prior taper, especially CT, have resolved. 

 

2004 - Dec. 2015,  Cymbalta 20mg/d  for neck pain - Never had problems with Cymbalta.   Dec 2015, CT 20mg/d Cymbalta.  5 weeks later reinstated 20mg/d Cymbalta - without increase in CT sx's.   

Feb 2016 STARTED VALIUM 25mg/d for CT Cymbalta wd sxs.    Jan-April 2016 Held Cymbalta 20mg/d - doing pretty well (AM 3/10 anxiety and 3/10 tinnitus)

April 2016, CT Cymbalta sx's had not yet resolved and I prematurely tapered 10% q 4 wks x 3 mos.  After 3rd cut developed 10/10 wd sx's of Anxiety, Anhedonia, Anorexia, Panic attacks, dark, incresaed Valium to 28mg/d. 

November 2016, after 3 cuts, UP-DOSED all (41 beads) back up to 20mg (193 beads total) Cymbalta - from , dark to light.

VALIUM TAPER: Jan 2017 28mg to March 2019 Zero   Cymbalta has partially stabilized and helped with the Valium taper.  The only sx I have now is 3/10 Tinnitus, which I only notice when it is quiet.

http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11900-woof-cymbalta-re-stabilization-after-cold-turkey-withdrawal/  Benzo Posts http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/11951-woof-valium-scheduling-and-dosage-with-cymbalta-wd-symptoms/

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