☼ pinkfairy: rapid taper of Paxil

[pinkfairy]

Benzo topic:  pinkfairy-in-ad-withdrawal-possibly-zopiclone-and-now-benzo

 

Hi everybody am new around here....right here goes!i need some advice an help.am a single mum to a nine year old with no family or support.in janurary I was taken off Paxil which I was taking at 40mg...I had no clue about tapering,they took me off in 4 weeks I was on it for 3 an half years.they then gave me diazepam to stop the with drawals...so now am also in the process of weaning off this at 10% a month.have now educated myself on this one!!am in a right state an I feel like am in a deep dark hole!have got real bad depression but they can't get another AD into me,probably because my CNS is in a mess....am I too late to reinstate Paxil?or would you guys keep on going.any help would be amazing!!am really struggling xx

 

 

Edited November 23, 2018 by ChessieCat
added link to benzo topic

[scallywag]

pinkfairy -- Welcome to Surviving Antidepressants (SA)

 

Sorry that you were put on a grueling forced fast-pace march off Paxil earlier this year. Paxil is a nasty devil of a drug whose after-effects are often worse after a fast taper.

 

What are your symptoms now? Is there a daily pattern? Please keep notes on paper. Here's the most useful way to format a daily log:

Keep notes on paper

 

A request: Would you summarize your history in a signature -- drugs, doses, dates, and discontinuations & reinstatements, in the last 12-18 months particularly?

• Please include all medications/drugs you currently take for any reason -- prescription, over-the-counter, or street drugs.
• Any drugs prior to 18 months ago can just be listed with start and stop years.
• You don't need to include symptoms or diagnoses other than the initial condition that led to prescribing the first drug.
• We ask for this information in your signature so that we can see it at a glance. A list is easier to understand than one or multiple paragraphs.
• You can find instructions in this topic: Please put your withdrawal history in signature
• If you are using a phone, there are instructions and screen captures in Posts 8 & 9 of this signature topic.

You may want to read our topic on the Ashton Manual for tapering off benzodiazepine medications. There are many links to Professor Heather Ashton's work in the first post:

Ashton and beyond in benzo tapering

 

It might be a lot for your beleaguered CNS (central nervous system) to continue tapering diazepam, and either to reinstate Paxil or to introduce another SSRI like Prozac at the same time. If you reinstate/introduce, you *may* need to delay the next decrease in your diazepam taper. Your symptoms log will be critical to determining this.

 

Reinstating is most predictably effective when it is done soon after the final dose of the medication. We consider the optimal window to be 1 day to 3 months after last dose. To understand more about reinstatement and its risks, please read the discussion at this link:

About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms

 

Because the unpredictability increases after 3 months, our suggested reinstatement doses are what many doctors consider almost certain to be ineffective and ridiculously low, a tiny fraction of the published "minimum therapeutic dose" for a given medication. However, there are many stories on this site of the effectiveness of low dose reinstatement in relieving withdrawal symptoms. It's usually not an overnight improvement; thankfully negative effects are usually seen quickly.

 

For reference, some other threads/topics relevant to your situation:

Before you begin tapering -- what you need to know

What is withdrawal syndrome

Tips for tapering off Paxil (paroxetine)

 

When we have a better picture of your history and current situation, we can suggest a next step for you about Paxil withdrawal symptoms.

 

I hope you'll find the information in the SA forums helpful for your situation. I'm sorry that you are in the position that you need the information, but am glad that you found us.

[pinkfairy]

Hi thank you so much for getting in touch have put my signature up.hope it helps am honestly am so glad have found you all.❤️️

[scallywag]

Thanks for posting a signature. It's great.

 

Have a close read of the reinstatement topic, linked above. Please let us know whether you'd like to let your CNS (central nervous system) stabilize over time on its own or you would like to discuss reinstatement.

[pinkfairy]

Reinstatement am desperate please

[ChessieCat]

Hi pinkfairy,

 

It will be helpful if you would list your current symptoms.  Is there a daily pattern?

 

Here is a symptoms list which may help:  Dr Joseph Glenmullen's WD Symptoms Checklist

[grandmaD]

Welcome Pinkfairy!  Unfortunately like myself and many others we did not find this site/help until it was too late!  Just the same, there is plenty of help and advice as to how to proceed from here.  40mg paxil!!!!  Unbelievable!  There is evidence I believe that we don't even need a full dose, that 10mg is sufficient enough to do the job!  I should think the valium would be good to calm down the w/d symptoms that you might otherwise have, so go very, very slowly off that over a long time.

 

I think you will get better advice from the site if you can read all you can first and arm yourself with knowledge.  As for me, I tried cutting back over weeks, months and then years and still ended up on the full dose.  I tried skipping days and that didn't work.  I was switched to 3 other a/d's and that didn't work.  I know NOW that was because I stopped the paxil and therefore got full blown w/d and ended up in hell.  Then I tried CT.  WORSE HELL!

 

You asked if it was too late to re-instate, and I can't answer that from the top of my head, but I will check my journal and see how long I CT before re-instating back to full dose.  Hopefully, it isn't too late for you.  It was after I did that that I gave the Drs. the flick and found internet help and began with a 10% taper over 6 weeks.  Anyway, I will get back to you tomorrow on that.

 

I would encourage you to keep a journal of your symptoms, etc. as it really does help from week to week because you forget things and even from day to day you can't tell, but over weeks, months and years you get a better idea.

 

Do you have any symptoms or just dopey from the valium?  How are you today? 

[scallywag]

Just wanted you to know that I'm working on getting an answer for you about reinstatement.

[Altostrata]

Welcome, pinkfairy.

 

Please stop tapering the benzo. As ChessieCat requested, what is your daily symptom pattern? Please keep notes on paper about your systems, when you take your drugs, and their dosages.

[MattUK]

Can I just point out that until yesterday I did not know that our (UK) diazepam was Valium or also known as BENZO on this and other sites

[pinkfairy]

Hello every body thank you for all getting back to me ❤️️!!

 

my symptoms are insomnia,anxiety,depression,an on constant alert I can't seem to switch off at all!!these are all a daily symptoms constant oh an my emotions are all over the place!!

 

am down to 5 mg of diazepam now,am not going to cut again for ages!i was also taking zopiclone along with the AD an then crossed over to diazepam in July.started tapering in August I was on 8mg...

 

they are now trying to diagonis me with BPD?i feel lost because I don't know what's what!

 

am in such a mess,with a young son to look after an am starting to be non functional it's not good!!i keep pushing forward for him....

 

what would you all recommend.thank you for getting back in touch with me X

Edited November 15, 2016 by scallywag
paragraph breaks

[pinkfairy]

Infact I have every symptom going.to many to list I don't know from what's what!!they have tried other AD but they sent me nearly to ER am so so sensitive to medications!thats why am really struggling with the diazepam xx

[scallywag]

It's best to keep a log of your symptoms on paper. You may find that there is a pattern to your symptoms either within a day or over many days. Please have a look at this post:
Take notes of doses and symptoms

Often psychiatrists will provide a diagnosis "label" to a set of symptoms that are actually caused by either a medication itself or withdrawal. Please don't take any Dx to heart while you are taking any neuro-psycho-active medications. Many many psych disorders that were diagnosed when a person is taking or tapering meds, "magically" disappear when their CNS (central nervous system) stabilizes OFF medication.

 

Did you have a chance to look at the discussion topic on tapering benzodiazepine drugs? (link above)
 

[pinkfairy]

Hi yes I had a look,am doing diazepam taper 10% a month it's horrendous!!am quite scared because I don't have family an am doing all this alone!!my health is shocking as have never looked after my self!had a teamatic childhood,so self medicated!!ie alcohol an AD an sleepers...so I have no coping skills,have walked into a battle field unarmed I have no tools an don't know how to start getting them??i don't even no how to self soothe I have a poor diet an smoke to cope,it's like self abuse because am in a mess...I turned my whole life around an then that happen in Jan,ripped off Paxil...am just devastated as my son as no one else but me....stopped alcohol in jan.thank you for your reply I feel so isolated an a lost cause xx

[pinkfairy]

Am even starting to believe I could have BPD....such a mess!!i want to take an AD my CNS cannot handle it!!infact I need one,because I ain't the strength to feel like this every day!its breaking my heart am not the mum I was xx

[grandmaD]

Sorry, but my notes back then were very scratchy - I couldn't tell if I cold turkeyed for 3 months or 6 months.  Definitely 3, that's for sure, but no more than 6.  I was in a very bad place, couldn't walk to the front gate with muscle spasms, suicidal, in great torment.  I went back to 20mg and it only took 3-5 days to feel like normal, it was absolutely amazing.  That sudden change for the better  was what finally convinced me it was the drug w/d causing all ml health problems.

 

So, I don't know what to advise you.  all I know is I re-instated within 3-6 months successfully but you have been off it for almost a year.  Did you read the info above?  What does it suggest?  I am not sure how long you can go before it is considered "too late" to re-instate.

 

What dose were you on and for how long?  What was your last dose you were on?  I have read that when people do re-instate they sometimes go back to the full dose, but that is not always necessary, but that you should go back to the last dose you were on.

[pinkfairy]

Thank you for the reply....am glad you caught it in time grandma D ❤️️

I was on Paxil 40mg for 3 an half years.4 week taper so my last dose would of been 10mg for a week.am 9 month off,plus in the process off weaning off Valium!!i just don't know what to do anymore xx

[coldturkmama]

Paxil is extremely difficult to cold turkey and make it out without reinstatement. If I know how what I'd know then, I'd get back on a low dose and see if it would help stabilize and then begin to taper slowly. You do not likely have BPD, these drugs mimic all sorts of disorders when we are in extreme WD.

[coldturkmama]

And a 4 week taper is NOT A taper at all, that's more like cold turkey.

[pinkfairy]

Do you think I could try to reinstate it?yea my lovely doctor did it!!!never affected me unti may then bam!!i cannot get stable at all an am fighting for my life every single day!just don't know what to do...have tried other AD an they sent me manic like pushed me over the edge so am frightened am so very very sensitive to anything!!do not know what to do ????

[scallywag]

What is your symptom pattern?

Please keep notes on paper of your symptoms and the times of your dose(s). This post has a useful format for a daily log:
Take notes of doses and symptoms
 
Reinstatement:

Once we have a picture of your symptoms over several days, we'll suggest a reinstatement dose for you to consider. It's probably best to test for a reaction with a very, very low dose.

 

Please do not reinstate your last dose. Your CNS (central nervous system) has done some work adjusting to the absence of Paxil. Reinstating 10 mg risks further destabilizing your CNS.

[grandmaD]

I agree with coldturkmama.  It seems like it is not too late to re-instate and a much lower dose.  Scallyway has  some great advice for you also.  You might be surprised to see a sudden improvement, which would be nice of course, but don't be frightened if it takes a while for the adjustment to stabilise after re-instatement.  I certainly wish you all the best!

[grandmaD]

What do the mods think?    Would it be a good idea to stay at the dose of valium you are on while you re-instate and then stabilise first, before tapering it any further?  It might help get you through some rough patches?  Not sure about that one as I haven't been on it. 

 

Once you re-instate, make sure you are well and truly stabilised before tapering the paxil.  I waited 6 months and it was NOT LONG ENOUGH!

 

Also, you cannot taper 2 drugs at once, so you might want to ask the mods about that one - you might have to decide whether to taper the valium first and then the paxil, which is probably what I would do.

[pinkfairy]

What dose would I be best off starting at?am in a mess I haven't slept for 3 days straight am seriously going to have to take anything.am very unstable am this isn't good for my son.thank you all for getting back to me ❤️️ Xxx

[pinkfairy]

have got every sysmptom going!!insommina is brutal DR DP,everything apart from brain zaps.cannot believe am also tapering diazepam while in this mess!!am putting that on hold.its my sleep what's frightening for me,I feel like am actually going to end up going crazy!!am exhausted to the point of craziness now....really struggling with my eating as well!!any advice would be great as am going down hill rapid xx

[AliG]

Pinkfairy. What is your symptom pattern ? Please keep notes on paper of your symptoms and dose timing.  See link above.

[pinkfairy]

Am currently taking diazepam 2mg 7AM 1 mg 2pm an 2 MG 11 PM!have tried to go to the link but I can't do it xx

[AliG]

What do you mean ?  Just " click " on it . Post 21 .

 

How long have you been following this pattern ?  Was this what your doctor advised ?

[pinkfairy]

Have been doing this Pattern by myself...sorry really bad cog fog today an not in a good place ????!!

[pinkfairy]

Since July when I cold turkeyed the Valium.then reinstated 3 weeks later at 8 mg am now down to 5 mg.....I also take matazpine at 7.5 for sleep but it's stopped working!!am in such a mess from all this drugs I really don't know what to do any more!!so that's Paxil CT Jan,CT diazepam July.stopped zopiclone July an reinstated diazepam an added 7.5 of matazpine.what a mess I don't do what to do xxx

[AliG]

That's ok. We have all been there and understand. Take your time , breathe . Then when you are ready come back and we can follow up.

[pinkfairy]

Am really starting to freak out with lack of sleep I just can't stabalize!!i went to the doctors yesterday I was in that bad of a state they gave me olazpine 2.5 because am just losing the plot!i can't carry on like this an my son as only me...I just keep thinking I can't carry on like this any more am just to distressed

[pinkfairy]

If I don't sleep am going to end up in a hospital...I can't go another night of no sleep am already staring to see things

[scallywag]

Here is the post on taking notes of your symptoms:

 

Keep notes on paper about your drug dosages and daily symptom pattern

 

A symptom pattern that occurs regularly over several days could mean the symptoms are from withdrawal, other adverse effects of drugs, or something else you do on a daily schedule.

 

In the course of discussion in your Introductions forum topic, you may be asked to keep notes on paper of your daily symptom pattern, including when you take your drugs, their dosages, and any symptoms.

 

What we need to see for every individual day over several days is:

 

- Time and dosage for drugs taken in morning

- Time and description of any symptoms in the morning

 

- Time and dosage for drugs taken in afternoon

- Time and description of any symptoms in the afternoon

 

- Time and dosage for drugs taken in evening

- Time and description of any symptoms in the evening

 

- Time and dosage for drugs taken in middle of the night

- Time and description of any symptoms in the middle of the night (such as waking)

 

And so forth. A diary, in chronological order, such as:

 

6 a.m. Woke and vomited

8 a.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro

10 a.m. Had diarrhea

10:30 a.m. Ate breakfast

11:35 a.m. Got a headache, lasted one hour

12:35 p.m. Ate lunch

4 p.m. Stomachache

5 p.m. Took 2.5mg Lexapro

6 p.m. Ate dinner

9:20 p.m. Headache

10:00 p.m. Took 50mg Seroquel

10:20 p.m. Headache got worse

10:30 p.m. Fell asleep

2:30 a.m. Woke, took 3mg Ambien (NOT "took 1/2 tablet Ambien")

2:45 a.m. Fell asleep

4:30 a.m. Woke with headache

[scallywag]

Do what you can to remain calm. Some people find the work of Dr. Claire Weekes helpful:

 

The Dr. Claire Weekes Method of Recovering from a Sensitized Nervous System

 

If you can't access that link, search on her name.

[pinkfairy]

Have got her book thank you for replying every body!!i will do the pattern soon I just can't think.i think am becoming hymonia to lack of sleep!i know another drug shouldn't be added but I can't go another day like this ( I feel trapped this is so all unfair am sick of been unstable an not wanting to carry on.i do for my son tho.but am finding it harder an harder with no sleep xxx