Jump to content
Brussellsprout

Brussellsprout: 8 months - 3 antidepressants and 2 weeks klonopin

Recommended Posts

Brussellsprout

 Hi all, here is my story. I started with dizziness about 10 months ago. My doctor thought it was Vestibular  migraine and put me on Celexa 20 mg for two months.  Did nothing. They then weaned be off over 10 days before putting me on nortriptyline, getting up to 30 mg over three months. It started to affect me by giving me panic attacks so I weaned off of that over another month.  While weaning off of the nortriptyline, once I got down to 15 mg, the doctor started me on Effexor. I started at a quarter of a 37.5 mg tablet and worked up to 37.5 mg over three weeks. I was then on 37.5 mg for two weeks and had awful side effects so started tapering off over a three-week period.  Basically, I was on and off of Effexor a total of seven weeks.  Then, the doctor put me on Klonopin for two weeks to try to help me come off of the Effexor. I refused to take it for more than two weeks. However, I am now 45 days off all of the medication and I'm having really bad muscle twitches, unsteadiness still, sensations of the floor feeling squishy beneath my feet and a constant feeling of like my brain is cracking. Not to mention emotional upheaval  

 Has anyone here noticed significant improvement in recovery after short term use of these drugs? I'm terrified they permanently altered me and I won't get back to homeostasis. 

Share this post


Link to post
apathetic

Welcome to the forum!

Many people do get better and almost everyone feels permanently altered, I was feeling like that too (I still do, but I'm not that focused on that symptom that much).
45 days seems like a lot to you, but is not enough. I saw some improvement after couple of months, was still very close to the rock bottom, but I was better, at least not at the actual rock bottom, hey!

Now I'm again worse. That's how it goes, I guess. People definitely recover, you can read many success stories on here from people who are now much, much better.

You're not alone in this and there are many coping mechanisms for withdrawal. The journey is long and tough and symptoms change from one to another.

Hope you'll be even a tiny bit better soon. 

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thank you! How long were you on antidepressants? 

Share this post


Link to post
apathetic
1 minute ago, Brussellsprout said:

Thank you! How long were you on antidepressants? 

You're welcome! I'm still on medications and was on many of them, not "just" antidepressants. The medication that caused withdrawal was an antipsychotic for me.
But in general, I'm taking medications for 4 years.

Share this post


Link to post
KarenB

Hello Brussellsprout - welcome to SA,

 

That's quite a list of drugs you've been through, so it's not surprising that your brain is letting you know it's not too happy right now.  It will come right again, but it will happen slowly - because that's how proper, thorough healing happens.  Your brain and Central Nervous System are carefully taking the time to put everything back how it should be again. 

 

45 days off is very early stages where withdrawal is concerned.  We often suggest to people who have tapered quickly that they reinstate a small amount of the drug in order to stabilise, and then taper off by 10% of your current dose each month.  This allows your brain time to adjust as you go, and lessens any withdrawal.  Discussion of the pros and cons of reinstatement are here: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7562-about-reinstating-and-stabilizing-to-reduce-withdrawal-symptoms/ 

 

Let us know if you might want to do this and we can help you work out what dose to start with.

 

The troublesome thing with SSRIs is that you can't just flush their effects out of your system.  They change the way your brain works, and that takes much longer to heal.  Suddenly stopping the drug puts your brain and Central Nervous System into shock.  It's like yanking a trellis out of a garden instead of gently untangling the plants and slowly removing the wood – it’s too much trauma for the plants/your brain.  (For the source of that simile, plus further discussion, see http://survivinganti...el-your-brain/)

 

Withdrawals can last for months or years, depending on the individual and how they either tapered or CT'd.  There is also the possibility that they will get worse before they get better.  I say this not to alarm you but to be sure you've got all the facts before you make a decision. This link describes how healing happens:  Windows and Waves Pattern of Stabilisation  With time and care, things will come right again - that's the big picture.  And someone such as yourself, with less than a year on drugs, has a much better outlook than people such as myself who were on them for 5 years before beginning to taper.  And I'm healing!  You will too.

 

Many people find Fish oil and Magnesium useful during withdrawal.  

Non-Drug Techniques to cope with emotional symptoms.

Please put your withdrawal history in your signature – all drugs/dates/dosages etc - so we can see your situation easily whenever you post, and help you more accurately.  Thanks.

Have a read of those and then you can come back to this thread to discuss things further.  This can be your journal to record your tapering and healing progress, and to ask questions. 

Welcome to SA,

Karen

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Hi Karen. Unfortunately I've been off the nortriptyline for 80 days and the Effexor for 60 now. The Effexor causes such severe effects that I can't reinstate. I'm not sure about nort. I was in nort really for 3.5 months and tapered off over a little over a month. The Effexor I was on for 34 days and tapered off over 3 weeks. I suppose it was too fast but of course, I followed dr. Instructions. I don't want to reinstate the benzo because I was only on it 2 weeks and don't want to risk more problems. SO, the only drug I could possibly reinstate is nort and it gave me night muscle jolts. Do you think reinstating nort at a microdose is worth a try?

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

Adverse effects (a.k.a. "side" effects) are usually dose-dependent - the lower the dose, the weaker and/or less frequent the symptom.

 

When you were taking noritriptyline at what time of day did you take it?

 

About reinstating: Did you read the discussion at the link KarenB posted about reinstatement?  The information in the first post and then the discussion  on the first page will give you enough of a sense of the risks and benefits. Please post your questions about your situation here in your intro topic, we'll see them sooner here than in the reinstatement topic.

 

A request: Would you summarize your history in a signature -- drugs, doses, dates, and discontinuations & reinstatements, in the last 12-24 months particularly?

  • Any drugs prior to 24 months ago can just be listed with start and stop years.
  • Please use actual dates or approximate dates (mid-June, Late October) rather than relative time frames (last week, 3 months ago)
  • Spell out months, e.g. "October" or "Oct."; 9/1/2016 can be interpreted as Jan. 9, 2016 or Sept. 1, 2016.
  • Please leave out symptoms and diagnoses.
  • A list is easier to understand than one or multiple paragraphs.
  • Link to Account Settings – Create or Edit a signature.
     
Edited by scallywag

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Yes I read it all. I added a signature. Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

Thanks for creating your signature and for acknowledging that you've read the reinstatement posts.

 

When you were taking noritriptyline at what time of day did you take it?

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

I took it at 7 pm

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

And the drug that seemed to cause so many issues was the last one - Effexor. Before that one I was OK

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

My symptoms are dizziness (which has morphed to a new kind), muscle twitches, reduced sleep and a "brain cracking" feeling. The Effexor immediately caused proprioception issues and vision issues. I was on for 5 weeks and tapered off over 3 weeks. I don't know what to do. The klonopin makes my muscles twitch worse and makes me unsteady 

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

I need some advice. You'll see my med history in my signature.  My wd is complicated by 2 meds. I was tapered off nortriptyline which was giving me muscle jolts, and cross-tapered onto Effexor 37.5. In all, I was on nortriptyline 20 mg for 3.5 months before I tapered off over 35 days. I was on Effexor for 34 days and tapered off over 21 days. The Effexor ignited proprioception, visual and head-pressure issues as well as a floaty boat dizziness. So, if I reinstate, itd have to be nortriptyline and how much? I'm 60 days into wd and some things (slightly less dizzy, fewer poor mental health days) some have improved, nothing is worse!and some things are status quo (head pressure, muscle twitches, sleep problems). 

Edited by scallywag
merged from topic: Reinstate, but what?

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout
On 2017-06-07 at 11:16 PM, KarenB said:

...

45 days off is very early stages where withdrawal is concerned.  We often suggest to people who have tapered quickly that they reinstate a small amount of the drug in order to stabilise, and then taper off by 10% of your current dose each month.  This allows your brain time to adjust as you go, and lessens any withdrawal.  Discussion of the pros and cons of reinstatement are here: http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/7562-about-reinstating-and-stabilizing-to-reduce-withdrawal-symptoms/ 

 

Let us know if you might want to do this and we can help you work out what dose to start with.

...

 

If reinstating nortriptyline may help, I can do that. My lowest dose was 5 mg but I was only estimating that. 

Edited by scallywag
trimmed quote to relevant portion

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

I've moved your post/question to your introduction topic so that all your information, questions and answers are in one place. This topic, your introduction, is the best place to ask questions about your situation.

 

Please confirm: Your last dose of noritriptyline was 5 mg and you took it on March 30, 2017.

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thanks. Sorry about the misplay. Yes. March 30 at 5 mg

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thank you for any guidance. I'm afraid of reinstating but can't go on this way. 

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

To test whether you get a negative reaction, you could try 1 mg of noritriptyline for 4-7 days. For a more cautious approach, start with 0.5 mg. If you get a strong negative reaction, stop taking it.

 

The best way to get accurate and precise doses is to use liquids. It does not dissolve in water easily (Prozac has a solubility of 50 mg/ml; noritriptyline's solubility is 0.000874 mg/ml) so if you choose a do-it-yourself liquid, you'll be dealing with a suspension that will need shaking before each dose.

 

Noritriptyline is available as a commercially prepared oral solution in the U.S. Your doctor would need to prescribe the liquid and your insurer cover it. Sadly, insurance coverage for prescription liquid formulations isn't universal. If they won't cover it, ask your pharmacist what the price is. Older medications such as tricyclics can be significantly less expensive than the newer ones.

 

These two topics have information about DIY liquids

Making a liquid from a tablet or capsules .

Using an oral syringe and other tapering techniques].

 

Another option is using a scale. Several members have weighed their doses through their tapers:

Using a digital scale to measure doses.

Edited by scallywag

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thank you!

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Just to Clarify,  even though the last drug I took was Effexor that ended on April 20 (21 days after stopping nort), my brain was still likely molded around the nort? I'm going to try 0.5 mg and see 

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

I suggested noritriptyline because of your remark in this post:

 

6 hours ago, Brussellsprout said:

And the drug that seemed to cause so many issues was the last one - Effexor. Before that one I was OK

 

Share this post


Link to post
Altostrata

Hello, Brussellsprout.

 

It looks to me like you going off Celexa and then ramping up nortriptylilne sensitized your nervous system to these drugs, and then you had adverse reactions to whatever else you took, these got worse and worse. Some people are quite sensitive to them.

 

Going on and off and changing drugs is wearing on the toughest nervous systems.

 

I am dubious that reinstating any antidepressant is going to help, but scallywag gives excellent advice about giving nortriptyline a try. Of them all, it's probably the least likely to set off your tender nervous system. But there are no guarantees it will help or not hurt.

 

Recovery from bad reactions to psychiatric drugs can be very frustrating and gradual, and take months rather than weeks.

 

Many people do better with fish oil and magnesium supplements, see
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/36-king-of-supplements-omega-3-fatty-acids-fish-oil/
http://survivingantidepressants.org/index.php?/topic/1300-magnesium-natures-calcium-channel-blocker/

 

A lot of people find them helpful. Try a little bit of one at a time to see how it affects you, and not at the same time you experiment with nortriptyline.

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thank you so very much! What you say about Celexa to nort etc makes so much sense. I know people recover but when you're in the trenches it's so hard to remember. In your experience, although all individuals, have you seen that people on meds less time tend to recover with less time or is it all about the same? I can't imagine my babies (ages 2 and4) having to wait 10 years to have a healthy mama. Sniff sniff.  Thanks again for taking time out to respond!

Share this post


Link to post
KarenB

There is a correlation between the number of years drugs were used and the time needed to heal, so in that regard you could be hopeful of a shorter healing time. 

 

Other influences are the number of drugs used, the number of dose changes, and if cold-turkeys or fast tapers were done.

 

It's important to remember that you will be doing pretty well even before you feel completely healed.   

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

I've tried just one day of the 1 mg nort and it made me feel a bit more head pressure, floaty feeling, and muscle twitches. I have these all the time since ADs so I can't tell if it's a normal fluctuation or the nort. I'll try it out for the advised 4-7 days. My ? Is this: if I don't have any reaction, do I then increase the dose a bit to see if more helps? If it doesn't work, are the past 3 months of wd for naught?  Does this start the whole recovery process over? Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Could one of the moderators help me out?

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat

I've asked the other mods for their input.

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Anything? My brain zaps returned at night and muscle twitches increased definitely. Is this a sign to stop? If so, should I taper after 2 days of 1 mg (by .5 mg)? Please help. Thanks 

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

I was off nortriptyline (on for 3 months and tapered off over a month). I've been off for 3 months and tried reinstating at 1 mg with poor results. I've been on it for 2 days. Do I need to taper off the 1 mg now?

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

I stopped because I have constant daily dizziness and seem to have a disconnect between where my body is in space and my brain registering that space (floor feels weird). I was making progress in that reconnected feeling until I took the nort again and it seems to have reset back. Also, my muscle jumps and spasms significantly increases and brain zaps returned. 

Share this post


Link to post
ChessieCat

If it were me, and I knew for certain that the drug was causing the symptom/s I would stop completely and immediately.

 

From About reinstating and stabilizing to reduce withdrawal symptoms:

 

When to discontinue reinstatement
If, upon reinstatement, you very soon feel worse, most likely you are sensitized to the drug and need to take a smaller dosage or, possibly, none at all.

  • Sometimes reinstatement does not work. The nervous system has taken such a hard hit from withdrawal, it's destabilized beyond whatever effect the drug might have had.
  • Sometimes reinstatement not only does not work, it causes an adverse reaction from a nervous system sensitized by withdrawal.
  • If you have an immediate bad reaction, reduce or stop taking the drug.

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

Thanks! I have no doubt it caused the increased symptoms bc brain zaps were long gone. 

Share this post


Link to post
mammaP

Unfortunately there are no guarantees with reinstatement, and the longer people are off the less likely it is to help.  Sadly it seems that you are going tp react to any psychotropic drug after the experiments by your doctor with several different ones in a short time. At least you tried, it may have helped and was worth trying. It will take time to get back to how you were before reinstating but shouldn't be too long. Your brain and nervous system will regain homeostasis, take each day as it comes and you will get through this.

Share this post


Link to post
Brussellsprout

 Hi all. So my journey began about eight months ago when I was given medication for migraine associated vertigo.  I was trail on three different medications over a short period of time. Unfortunately,  my withdrawal situation is muddied with a migraine situation. So, now my  nervous system is hyper sensitive to medication, which it wasn't prior to trailing these meds.

 

I have to find some sort of preventative to take and the doctor wants to try me on the next med, which is amitriptyline. Yet another antidepressant. I'm not sure what to do. This is a medication they like for migraine associated vertigo because it suppresses the vestibular system, the inner ear.  

 

Anyway, I miserable for withdrawal symptoms but I'm also miserable from migraine associated vertigo. I'm not sure if I should instead try something else like Topamax for Depakote but I think they all work as neurologics.  Anyway, if, and that's a big if, we decide to trial the amitriptyline for migraine, would you suggest a 1 mg dose to start with to see if my system hyper responds? Thanks so much 

Edited by scallywag
merged topics, inserted paragraph breaks

Share this post


Link to post
scallywag

Brusselssprout - We don't have any experience to give you suggestions about medications and doses in an effort to treat migraine and vertigo. All I can suggest is that if you choose to take medication, start with ¼ or at most ½ of the starting dose for a week to see if it helps the symptoms. You may not need the full dose and low doses cause fewer "side" effects than high doses.

Share this post


Link to post
Altostrata

Brussellsprout, see this topic 

As long as your doctors are talking about anti-seizure drugs like Depakote or Topamax, you might as well consider very low dose lamotrigine, which can calm a hypersensitive nervous system. Please read the above topic carefully.

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.