Believer

[Believer]

Hello All,

I have been visiting for about 20 months and I want to give a HUGE thank you to Alto for starting this site and keeping it going. And to all of the moderators for giving so selflessly, providing support, comfort, tips and advise. And to everyone for sharing your journey. I am thankful to have found this harm reduction approach after I tapered to quickly from 100mg to 25mg of Zoloft and started having symptoms. I have successfully (not easily or painlessly) used the 10% and now 5% reduction method every 4+ weeks depending on symptoms, to taper from 25 mg to 5.5 mg. (With a short stint on Bupropion in 2015). 

I believe we will heal. Slow and steady!

[ChessieCat]

Hi Believer and welcome to SA,

 

I'm really pleased that you have found the information on this site helpful for your taper.  I'm also pleased that you have decided to join us.

 

Thank you for completing your drug signature.

 

This is your own Intro topic where you can ask any questions you may have and your can also journal your progress.  We encourage members to visit other members' intro topics so that they can support each other.

[samanthaelizabeth]

Welcome Believer,  You have come to the right place!  We have a very similar drug history.  I look forward to see your progress!

 

Sam

[Gridley]

Welcome from me too, Believer,

 

Here are some links about the 10% taper that may be helpful to you.

Before you begin tapering what you need to know

What is Withdrawal Syndrome?
Why taper by 10% of my dosage?

Brain Remodelling

Tips for tapering off Zoloft (sertraline)

 

[Believer]

Thank you for the warm welcome!

The past several cuts I have been dropping by 5%. I recently purchased a Radwag scale https://www.amazon.com/Radwag-60-220-R2-Analytical-Calibration/dp/B00CCTY9UE (I decided against making a liquid out of my pills) and discovered that my dosage was lower than what I thought it was using the Gemini.  I think that explains why my symptoms had been fluctuating so much once I got under 20mg, too much inconsistency from pill to pill and cut to cut. I will be holding at 5.5mg, beyond my usual 4+ weeks and do my next cut at 5% depending on my symptoms. Like many of you, mornings are the most difficult and things settle down by the afternoon. I use Natural Calm magnesium supplement most evening before I go to bed, and some mornings, depending on my waking anxiety level. I find it really helps. I also take 2000 IU of Vitamin D. I have stayed away from all other supplements based on my learnings from this sites. Thanks again for all that you are doing, keep up the good work!

[Gridley]

Sounds like a good plan, Believer.  You might also consider omega fish oil, which is also recommended by SA.

Omega-3 fatty acids (fish oil) 

[Rosetta]

Welcome Believer!

[Believer]

Thank you Rosetta. I've read your story. Very inspiring.

 

@Gridley I tried omega 3s early in the journey and found them stimulating. I'm thinking about trying vitamin C again to see if it helps with the morning cortisol. Any suggestions on what dose to start at? 

Thanks!

[Gridley]

I would start with a low dose, 500 mg, and see how that does.  You can always go up.

[Rosetta]

Thanks for posting on my thread.  Good luck with the Vit C.  --Rosetta

[Believer]

Started vitamin c, continuing to hold. Have had several days of feeling normal, thinking clearer and no anxiety. So thankful! Not ready to push on yet. 

[Believer]

Two weeks at 5.23 after a modified Brass Monkey slide of 1% a day for 5 days. Uptick in symptoms the first week, slowly calming over the second in the windows and waves pattern throughout the day. Experiencing some agitation and anger, which is new for me. 

[SkyBlue]

On 4/28/2018 at 9:50 AM, Believer said:

Two weeks at 5.23 after a modified Brass Monkey slide of 1% a day for 5 days. Uptick in symptoms the first week, slowly calming over the second in the windows and waves pattern throughout the day. Experiencing some agitation and anger, which is new for me. 

 

Hi Believer,

 

Your method sounds so sensible, a conservative pace including holds, and you are aware of the waves and windows pattern. I'm glad that you've had some days of feeling normal and "clear," too. That bodes very well!

I see from your signature you're using Natural Calm magnesium. I love that stuff! 

[Believer]

Just an update on the last year of my journey. I took an extended hold, I felt like a long break would be good through fall/winter but it turned into a longer hold than I anticipated. I had a mishap (about 30% decrease) with a single dose and the symptoms ramped up for several weeks.  I was unable to drive on the highway for a couple of weeks due to dizziness, felt like I was on a boat in the water, rather than a car on the highway.

 

I have made two 5% cuts over the last couple of months and they have gone well. Symptoms are manageable. Sleep is good, morning anxiety is low, dizziness is better. Heart palps are random throughout day, but they should diminish in the next few days. Getting better and better at changing the channel when I need to. Energy is lower than I’d like and I am fairly easily stressed at times. But I know it will pass.

 

I am now at 4.03mg. Next cut will get me into the 3s! Symptoms haven’t been as high as in the past, not sure if that’s due to lower dose. Most likely the slowness of my taper. Taking it slow and easy.

 

Still taking Vitamin C, D and Natural Calm.

 

I agree with @Skyblue, Natural Calm is great!

 

Hope you all were able to enjoy this holiday weekend.

 

 

 

 

 

[Gridley]

58 minutes ago, Believer said:

 

 

I am now at 4.03mg. Next cut will get me into the 3s! Symptoms haven’t been as high as in the past, not sure if that’s due to lower dose. Most likely the slowness of my taper. Taking it slow and easy.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Great update, Believer.  Congratulations on nearing the 3's!

[nick1990]

Good on you Believer , you are doing great . Keep it up  

[Believer]

Hi all, thought an update was due. I continue my SLOW taper based on how I’m feeling and what’s going in my life. I am still easily stressed so the going is slow. I have globus sensation in my throat that becomes a good indicator of my stress, even when I don’t feel it in other ways. 

 

My goal is to be as symptom free as possible so I generally cut 5% every 12 weeks or so. This schedule has kept my symptoms very low and manageable. I have given up on a timeline for being off, day to day quality of life if what’s important to me. 

 

I have a bit bit more energy than I used to and have found that my interest in old hobbies and new is back. 

 

I am not into the 3s yet. I had been going off of the 100mg pill weight that I started my taper with, rather than 50mg I have been on for the past couple of years. When I realized that, I had a good cry and let it go. Acceptance really is key on this journey.

 

Stay strong and keep going. Hold on to hope. You will heal.

[Altostrata]

Good to hear from you, Believer. Well done, listening to your body and going off at your own rate.

 

How much Zoloft, in milligrams, are you taking now? Please update your signature.

[Believer]

Thanks Alto. Signature updated to current dose of 4.57 mg. Stay well and thank you for everything you’ve done for all of us!

[Altostrata]

Was the 100mg tablet heavier than the 50mg tablet?

 

What are your symptoms like when you make a reduction?

[Believer]

Yes, the 100 mg were heavier. 221mg total pill weight.

 

I do a slide dropping 1% a day for 5 days. Symptoms increase about 5-7 days at the new dose. Increased morning anxiety that dissipates throughout the morning, cog fog, memory issues, difficulty word finding, muscle tension, some irritability, ruminating/intrusive thoughts, shortness of breath, sluggishness, sleep issues, night sweats, heart palps, balance and equilibrium issues and increased desire to isolate after getting home from work, come to the top of my mind. Some of these symptoms are likely due to or compounded by premenopausal and now being in my first year post menopause, but I treat them the same. I try not to over extend myself. AAF, change the channel, breathing exercises, minimal exercise and trying to eat more whole foods. I was seeing a counselor before COVID who experienced a psychotic break many years ago, shortly after taking Paxil,  so she is knowledgeable and very helpful at helping me recognize what’s real and what isn’t. I am very fortunate to have found her and to have a very supporting and understanding man in my life who has taken the time to listen and learn and is 100% on board. He acknowledges and accepts the affects and withdrawal affects that these types of drugs can have on the brain/body. He also cuts my pills, thankfully, numbers are not my thing. Lol!

[Believer]

Hi all, 

I could use some thoughts on my taper. I have updated my signature to reflect the last couple of tapers (I have been very slowly tapering since mid 2016). As you can see I haven’t tapered much the past couple of years, and nothing in the past year. I chose to hold at my current dose of 4.57 mg due to the stress of world, life and work. The past year has been particularly stressful for me personally and work wise so I chose to hold my taper. I have had a significant increase in symptoms the past several months so I recently resigned from my job in the hope that alleviating that stress would help. I am also considering the idea that my symptoms may in part be to poop out, so hoping to get some advice from the poop out experts @brassmonkey and others. Can poop out happen holding a dose for a year? I didn’t see anything in the posts with that short of a timeframe.

Thanks so much for your thoughts.

 

[Believer]

Hi again, @Altostrata, any thoughts on my above question? I continue to experience symptoms. Only getting about 2 broken hours of sleep, adrenaline/cortisol surges. Dark thoughts. I’m at a loss being at such a lose dose for over a year.

thank you for your input.
 

[Rosetta]

Hi Believer,

 

I’m sorry that you are feeling so bad.

 

I don’t know if AD poop out can happen during tapering or not.  Someone else will have to answer that question.  
 

I do believe that some people are told to taper out of AD poop out symptoms.  Making sure that there is not any other reason for your symptoms is a good idea, of course, before you taper.  Can you think of anything — any medicine, any change, that could cause the uptick other than Stress at work.  Of course, stress could do it.  Perhaps if you have stopped working you will start to feel better.  I hope so.  It’s too bad you had to do that.

 

Gentle walks and Epsom salt baths — I think people get tired of hearing that, but they work.

 

All my best, Rosetta

[Believer]

Thanks for the encouragement @Rosetta. I was thinking the same about tapering out of poop out, than wondered if you can poop out on a non therapeutic dose? It’s all a mystery. I have been doing Epsom salt baths and was walking until I injured my back. Too much muscle tension. I was hoping that relieving the work stress would help but now find myself with not much to occupy my mind/time. No med changes other than chamomile tea which I stopped a few days ago.

I appreciate your taking the time to respond.

Take care of you.

[Rosetta]

It is so hard to switch gears, isn’t it?  I find myself having change my routine far too often.  Quitting a job and suddenly being home is very challenging.
 

Your back must be quite painful if walking is a problem.  You may find that it miraculously heals.  I believe that muscle contraction and the strains they cause can be WD symptoms.  Sometimes they disappear mysteriously.  
 

I suggest reading.  Children’s chapter books are a good choice for people feeling the kinds of emotions we do.  The books for third, fourth and fifth grade are interesting, but have low stress plots.   We have been listening to Odd and the Frost Giant by Neil Gaiman over and over for a couple of weeks. It’s very entertaining.  I can recommend other books if you like.  He wrote several books for kids including Fortunately, the Milk.

 

Perhaps you can sit outside to read depending on the weather.  Get some vitamin D and sunlight.

 

There are a few shows on Netflix I could recommend.  
 

Hang in there, Rosetta

[Altostrata]

What are these new symptoms? Are they better or worse at any particular times of day?

[Believer]

@Altostrata constant fight or flight. Light and sound sensitivity. Restlessness, anxiety, intrusive thoughts, loss of appetite/weight loss, muscle loss in arms/legs tension/cramps/spasms for which I have been using Epsom salt baths, heat/ice and alternating Advil/Tylenol. Both of which I have used occasionally without issue my entire taper. I was walking 20-30 a day but have been unable to the last week or so due to back pain. I am eating high protein foods and realized I cut out too much salt so trying to incorporate that back in. Spinach/fruit smoothies. All of my food is passing too quickly. 
Symptoms are vacillating throughout the day. I used to get relief in the afternoon but now they kick up around 2:00pm. My GP thinks my tapering schedule is ridiculous and says I should either get off or go back on so no support there and, there is only one psych doc in my area taking new patients, I have a call into him to see if he has any knowledge about tapering. I take my dose at 0700 and magnesium in the morning and at bedtime along with 500mg of vitamin C. I don’t notice any symptoms related to foods.

thank you for getting back to me.

Edited April 28, 2021 by Believer
Added symptoms light/sound sensitivitey.

[Believer]

@RosettaThanks so much for the tips. I am so easily triggered right now I don’t watch TV and we don’t have Netflix. I do get out in the sun a few times a day. Now that I am not working I’m struggling to find things to occupy my mind and time which makes it all the more difficult. I had hoped that by relieving the stress of work things would improve but it seems to have only added a new/different stressor. Feeling quite down and despondent about it unfortunately. I had hoped to be outside working in my yard/garden but with the back pain that isn’t happening.

Thanks for your support and thoughtful ideas, very much appreciated.

[Altostrata]

When did this increase in symptoms start? Did you accidentally skip any doses? How old are your tablets?

 

11 hours ago, Believer said:

I am eating high protein foods and realized I cut out too much salt so trying to incorporate that back in.

 

How did you realize you cut too much salt? Have you have your electrolytes checked recently with a blood panel?

[Believer]

The increase started around end of Jan and have continued to progressively get worse. The tablets were prescribed in 2018, they expired in 2019. Ugh... I am requesting a new script tomorrow. You think they lost some efficacy? So it would be like I have been doing continuous minor drops? My husband said he researched expiration of drugs and thought they would be fine. I’m guessing you don’t agree? So dumb on my part. No doses skipped.
 

I am seeing the Dr tomorrow to request a blood panel. Mostly guessing it’s salt deficiency because of muscle twitching and change in diet that was to restrictive of salt. Added some salt back and twitching has stopped.

 

https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/drug-expiration-dates-do-they-mean-anything

 

The psych Dr is possibly not a good idea, I will see what kind of response I get from my GP tomorrow about a new script and go from there. I just want a doc who will continue to write the script.

[Altostrata]

On 4/28/2021 at 3:46 PM, Believer said:

The tablets were prescribed in 2018, they expired in 2019.

 

If the drug has degraded even slightly, that could explain your increase in symptoms. If you get new tablets, at least that factor is excluded.

 

Do you have a tendency to hyponatremia?

[Cruizer]

On 4/14/2021 at 5:18 AM, Believer said:

Hi all, 

I could use some thoughts on my taper. I have updated my signature to reflect the last couple of tapers (I have been very slowly tapering since mid 2016). As you can see I haven’t tapered much the past couple of years, and nothing in the past year. I chose to hold at my current dose of 4.57 mg due to the stress of world, life and work. The past year has been particularly stressful for me personally and work wise so I chose to hold my taper. I have had a significant increase in symptoms the past several months so I recently resigned from my job in the hope that alleviating that stress would help. I am also considering the idea that my symptoms may in part be to poop out, so hoping to get some advice from the poop out experts @brassmonkey and others. Can poop out happen holding a dose for a year? I didn’t see anything in the posts with that short of a timeframe.

Thanks so much for your thoughts.

 

Hi Believer, I am wondering the same thing. I have also been tapering since early 2016. During my time I have found the longer I have held the worse I feel in general and when I am tapering I feel better. Unfortunately I always get a bit over excited and tapered at more than 10% from about 9mg down to 4.5mg. I crashed and have held for 13 months and counting. I too have seen an increase in symptoms the longer I hold and am in the longest wave currently since the hold began. I too wonder about poopout and whether this is still effecting me. I was in poopout which was identified by Brass and started to improve as I was dropping. The journey is frustrating enough without the confusion of whether we are in poop out or withdrawal. 

[Altostrata]

You had intermittent periods of drinking heavily, @Cruizer That has a big effect of destabilzation.

[Cruizer]

6 hours ago, Altostrata said:

You had intermittent periods of drinking heavily, @Cruizer That has a big effect of destabilzation.

I totally get that drinking alcohol can do that, but I have not had a drink since July 2020 so we are talking 9 months ago. 

[DaBro]

On 4/26/2021 at 3:26 PM, Believer said:

Hi again, @Altostrata, any thoughts on my above question? I continue to experience symptoms. Only getting about 2 broken hours of sleep, adrenaline/cortisol surges. Dark thoughts. I’m at a loss being at such a lose dose for over a year.

thank you for your input.
 

 

Hi @Believer  just another input for you. I cold turkeyed Zoloft and had a period of dark thoughts and terrible (2 hours) sleep about 15 months after stopping. My sleep was fairly good for the first 9-12 months after my CT. Your taper will of course help massively but maybe it won’t prevent symptoms completely. 

 

My comment is that from my own experience the symptoms are a sign of readjustment of the CNS / healing and can be quite delayed. I suppose I’m suggesting perhaps to not overanalyse if this is related to something in the last few days or weeks. It could be symptoms of healing that you’d experience around this time whatever tapering path you take?

 

Just a thought. It will pass! Congratulations on your taper management and progress.