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Nikki

Nikki: Hi My Rundown with A/D's

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Thanks Ato for suggesting this...

 

In 1996 I was put on Pamelor (tricyclic) for panic attacks which led to depression. Made a commitment to overcome panic/depression...did alot of homework/self help/counseling.

 

My former spouse is alcoholic and has sex addiction issues so at that time although I was working hard on myself to recover (this included Al-Anon Meetings) I was in a toxic situation and the Pamelor did not seem to touch the depression. Switched to Paxil.

 

Paxil worked very well for me. It alleviated the panic/depression and I was able to walk through a divorce and being a new life as a single parent.

 

In 2006, GlaxoSmith Kline did not release Paxil to drugstores. They were pushing the Time Release Paxil which was an entirely different dosage. This thrusted me into W/D. Very adverse reaction & cold not wait for GlaxoSmithKline to release the orgininal Paxil (40mgs).

 

This led me to crossover (in a few weeks time) to Lexapro which we thought would be similar. The crossover wasn't too bad, however two weeks later I got slammed by Paxil W/D. Paxil W/D supercedes any medication.

 

It took about 3 months to settle down and I was actually okay. After due to weight gain from both drugs I decided to wean down from Lexapro. That took (2) years. Such a loss of precious time.

 

When I got down to 11 mgs. of Lexapro I had reached the end of my rope with the anxiety/depressive episodes from W/D (dropping doses using liquid). MD suggested using Imipramine (tricyclic).

 

In February of 2009 I finished the Lexapro taper and was on 75mgs. Imipramine. And the....we had the ecnomic downturn from Hell. My former spouse who was rather sucessful lost his job (I had alimony which was substantial) and

then I lost my job.

 

It was like surviving from crisis to crisis. My daughter become ill and we found out that she has an autoimmune disease. She was hit by a drunk driver and walked away. Lucky. There were days I wished I just wouldn't wake up.

 

My daughter told me "Mom there isn't a pill in the world that could relieve your anxiety, everything is anxiety producing right now." She was right.

 

In August 2011 I made a decision to crossover from Imipramine to Celexa. The anxiety was lifting, life was improving, however I kept having depressive episodes (severe, uncontrollable crying).

 

About (7) weeks back I finished the Imipramine taper and I am now on 40mgs. Celexa. After about two weeks, Ibegan to experience W/D. I went thru every symptom. And now I am just having Insomnia.

 

In my heart-of-hearts I know that these drugs caused lot of harm. For now, I do not want to do anything (although sleep would be nice) -_-

 

I am hoping to level off/stabilize & at some point in time get off of this stuff.

 

It was long haul, but life is improving each day (econmically).

 

Thanks

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Your positive outlook on dealing with what has happened to you, with life and the meds, will certainly assist your recovery.

 

You have a lot to be proud of.

:)

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Thanks for telling your story, Nikki. It's quite a story!

 

In August 2011 I made a decision to crossover from Imipramine to Celexa. The anxiety was lifting, life was improving, however I kept having depressive episodes (severe, uncontrollable crying).

 

About (7) weeks back I finished the Imipramine taper and I am now on 40mgs. Celexa. After about two weeks, Ibegan to experience W/D. I went thru every symptom. And now I am just having Insomnia.

Yes, it is possible to have withdrawal syndrome even though you're on a second antidepressant.

 

How have your symptoms changed since you quit imipramine? Does your doctor recognize your withdrawal symptoms? Does he or she understand the need to gradually taper?

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Alto I see a Psychiatric Nurse Practitioner and she understands W/D (discontinuation syndrome and protracted w/d) thank heavens.

 

In looking back, my daughter was right...there wasn't a pill in the glaxay that could have shieled anyone from the economic downturn that alot of us felt.

 

God Bless Me....I kept plugging away, but the bouts of crying were awful. That was what led me to switch over to Celexa. I felt the effect right away (after two days).

 

I went into business for myself in March 2011 ~ and I wanted to have some clarity to continue to move forward without crying like I was.

 

 

A gradual reduction from 200mgs. Imipramine and a gradual increase to 40 mgs. Celexa wasn't bad. There was some mania, but that stopped. Insomnia set in with each decrease, but would lift after a few days.

 

The problems began after I was off Imipramine altogether: Flu like symptoms, mirgratory aches/pains, raging anxiety and pewking in the AM from anxiety (that lasted for weeks), fatigue, anhedonia, lack of motivation (That's not like me at all), some isolation.

Worst of all insomnia.

 

I am feeling better the last few days. Energy is coming back. Can't complain about

AM anxiety. Hopefully the w/d is over.

 

Still need to lose weight. Business is building. Definitely a light at the end of the tunnel ^_^

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If your withdrawal symptoms from imipramine last only a few months, I would count that as a success!

 

Are you planning to reduce Celexa?

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Hi Alto....

 

I guess I never thought of it as a success. W/D has never been easy for me, however the MD told me it would not be as bad as an SSRI and I found that to be true.

 

Right now I need to remain where I am which is 40mgs. Celexa. Would someday like to get off Celexa. Just can't put myself thru that stress.

 

Hugs

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I think these meds did more harm than good. Initially when I went on Paxil I really did need a med and it did help.

 

I know I can't handle a taper right now. However I do think about how I would do it.

 

40mgs Celexa right now

 

Get the liquid

 

I would drop 1mg. @ a time in the past. I can't help but wonder if dropping 1 mg. is better or worse than 10%. I suffered with a 1mg. drop.

 

What bothers me is the length of time tapering....it's like lost time. I never took anything for w/d symptoms like Xanax or Propanolol...This time around I would.

 

I can't bear the idea of the anxiety/depression/insomnia that tapers bring on.

 

Has anyone tried Hypnosis???????????????

 

Hugs

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Wish I had great advice to give...

 

I went off Celexa (20 mg) in August. I also was in the midst of a pregnancy attempt and loaded up on those good hormones. :rolleyes: It was relatively ok...I don't remember anything like the struggle I am going thru to get off neurontin and get my brain back to where it belongs.

 

As I look at my two experiences, I would recommend waiting until you are at a point where life is going well and other concerns will not get in the way of your discontinuing the drug.

 

For getting off Celexa, I had a mother who was very sympathetic, took took over driving, allowed me to just chill.

 

This time I have to deal with a mother who is sick of pmeds and me complaining about them. I also am having to deal with a major life disappointment...that the child I wanted is not coming...that I will have to relocate away from family in August for grad school.

 

Thanks for listening to my rambling, but if your supports are 100% there prior to starting your taper, it just may make it easier.

 

Elizabeth

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Thanks Elizabeth...

 

Maybe the baby is not coming 'now' and will at some other point in time. You are going thru Neurontin WD. Relocating and leaving family is tough, but this may be a wonderful experience living in a new city. It may serve you well.

 

How long did it take you to wean down from Celexa?

 

Hugs

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Nikki,

You've definitely landed in the best place for help. Someone had their pre-taper plan posted not long ago. I only have the advice 'don't do as I did'.

 

I don't recall anyone using hypnosis for w/d, but it has interested me in the past. Never tried it.

 

I definitely agree that the meds did far more harm in my case. I never responded to serotonergics.

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Barb, the pre-taper plan was me. It involved looking after myself, getting "ready" - organized, freezer full of dinners etc, paperwork sorted, taking vitamins (specific to me - I have a tendency to very low folate, for example), gentle exercise (mostly a couple of short daily walks at the moment) and sunshine, giving up caffeine. Also, lining up some distractions like audiobooks for days when I have to do ironing/housework/etc, but need a distraction anyway. The idea is to do as much as I can to head off the depressive symptoms as I taper, and have some wiggle room for bad days where I can just pull out a nutritious meal from the freezer, thus allowing me a bit of free time to take a walk or have a lie down or a coffee with a girlfriend.

 

Bubbles

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Thanks Guys...

 

Have you ever logged onto theroadback.org? They have a temendous amount of info of tapering, side effects, etc. ~ and ~ a list of supplements pre-during-after a taper.

 

Bubbles you really set yourself up well for your taper....thank you for responding.

 

Hugs

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It's been three months since I got off Imipramine. In August 2011 was when I began the wean off Imipramine and went onto Celexa. The crossover wasn't that bad. The trouble began once I was off the Imipramine.

 

When I was on a small dose of Imipramine (about 10mgs.) plus the Celexa, I felt very good. I had hope, fun, was able to think in a positive manner, the anxiety/depression were basically gone. If they showed up I could talk myself thru it or rely on friends, etc.

 

I am quite depressed. Have anxiety and it is a low I can't seem to escape.

Worry, fear and a complete sense of frustration from living like this for so long.

 

The problems started when in 2007 when I began a Lexapro taper. It took 2 years. I believe that taper set me up somehow for chronic anxiety. At that time I lost my job, my ex lost his job and I freaked out. Became really depressed. Took Imipramine.

 

The problems of job loss, moving, court with ex, daughter getting ill, and a host of other issues has been ongoing since 2009 with economy and prior to that 2007 from Lexapro wd.

 

I had several jobs with what were supposed to be reputable companies, and they were a nightmare. My anxiety grew ~ my self esteem went down the tubes. Money is an issue. I pay my bills, alimony was reinstated, but I went thru most of what I had.

 

In 2011 I went back into business for myself. It takes time to build a business and I am not where I want or need to be right now in terms of what I am pulling in...This week I paid my property taxes, HOA and a life insurance premium and I am a wreck over it. Alot of money. When pay huge bills, I get very anxious and depressed. Huge fear.

 

I am giving you these details, because there are situational things, and then there is medicine and I don't know for sure, where they separate. The line blurs for me.

 

I would really like to be med-free, but I can't go thru wd, not for a long time. I am actually thinking about taking a small amount of Imipramine to see if I can feel better.

BUT....that is a medication cocktail.

 

Basically, I have been living in hell for the last few years. Anxiety, depression, fear, worry. If I was told I had 6 months to live, I think I would feel relieved.

 

Please.....need some help, or just talk. Situational vs. medication, or both. How can I be on a full dose of Celexa and feel this way. Does the Imipramine over-ride the Celexa?

 

I can't seem to find peace or hope, just misery....

 

Need some help

 

Hugs

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Hi Nikki,

 

I just read a wonderful book called hope and help for your nerves by Claire WEekes. That may help you a little.

 

I undrstand excatly how you are feeling. There are days I wonder what the hell is the point of it all? I am not a docotor but I don't feel like that title has much merit these days anyway. All I may suggest. Is that you take note if your feelings before all the meds and then during, if you have new feelings/ symptoms during the meds, its most likely from meds. That advice was given to me by a wonderful neuro.

Also, from my struggles and research, the road to recovery is long and hard. I know excerciae and eating right can only take u so far then there's your own mind and God .

 

I wish the pain would go away for you, me and all of us.

 

I am happy to talk with you. Or listen. GOd Bless Nikki, prayers for you.

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Nikki, I'm tapering off Celexa, along with other meds. I cut by half a milligram at a time.

 

Since I'm tapering multiple meds it's slower going--but I think slow going is the most important trick for ANY drug taper. Don't worry about how long it's going to take. Maybe it will take a year, maybe it will take three. The important thing is to go slowly enough that your brain and body can adapt as you taper.

 

I've had some withdrawal symptoms after cuts but so far absolutely no return of depression. In the past, suicidal depression has always been my dominant symptom when I quit or tried to reduce a psych med (I always did it wrong, either CT or dramatic reductions or taking one every other day).

 

And the effects of the drug itself (and I agree, for me ADs always made me worse rather than better) have decreased as I have been tapering. I feel great now, down to 3.5 mg of Celexa.

 

So a long slow taper isn't really wasted time; you can be healing, getting yourself back, and living your life the whole time (because you will have such minimal symptoms of withdrawal that you can still live your life).

 

I've seen SO many tapers in my years on these boards and although some people do well with quick ones, by FAR the most successful are the long slow ones. Especially in the case of someone with a history like yours (previous attempt, went too fast, rebound).

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I'm so sorry for your suffering, Nikki...

 

I just want to let you know that it's very common for people getting off ADs to experience a worsening of depression and anxiety somewhere around three months out. It's a common pattern. Three months seems to be most common but sometimes it's three to six. It's another withdrawal symptom. It won't last forever, this isn't the "new you".

 

I'm not very familiar with imipramine, as far as tapers and reinstatement. Maybe somebody else has more experience. I know with benzos, reinstatement after three months usually doesn't work, but I think ADs are different.

 

If you do reinstate, though, I do know that you don't usually need to reinstate to the full original dose.

 

And then taper very, very, VERY VERY slowly once you're stable.

 

But personally if it were me I would try every other kind of intervention for depression that I know of before going back on another med. The things that work for me are exercise, light therapy (that is, therapy using natural sunlight and therapy lights), and being very careful with my diet (no sugar, processed carbs, etc., keeping my blood sugar regular by eating low carbs in general, and lots of veggies and nonprocessed foods).

 

Exercise is the most powerful and in studies it works better than placebo or medications.

 

Regular talk therapy is also helpful, especially in combination with the other lifestyle interventions above.

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I remember being told that a Lexapro & Celexa taper were easier than Paxil. Although that is true for me, it was still a murderous process.

 

What I am learning from the people here is that slow and small cuts are easier. That's where I get into trouble. I have such a rush/desire mindset to be drug-free that I may have caused more anxiety/depression.

 

Rhi you and Summer are both tapering Celexa and in both your posts you sound very well considering.

 

Elisabeth you finished your taper in August and that is when I jumped on board the Celexa Express :rolleyes:

 

Elizabeth how have you been doing since August and did you do a slow taper?

 

To be honest, I think I may be on too much Celexa (40) and I think I felt bette @30mgs.

which is why I am considering getting myself down to 30 and then staying put.

 

I don't know what makes me crazier....being on the stuff or worrying about how lousy I can feel....and the "Oh no here I go again jockeying around with this stuff".

 

Hugs

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Elisabeth you finished your taper in August and that is when I jumped on board the Celexa Express :rolleyes:

 

Elizabeth how have you been doing since August and did you do a slow taper?

 

 

I did it completely wrong. I had hormones flowing in me from a fertility attempt which I think helped balance things for a CT withdrawal Don't follow my path. It is now months out and I still feel crappy.

 

 

How are you doing on the Celexa now? Do you feel like you can wake up and attack each day?

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Thanks Elizabeth....

 

I am actually quite depressed. I just finished reding Strawberry's Blog & it opened my eyes a bit more.

 

When I tapered off Imipramine, the cuts were big. Initally I was able to handle them.

I was weaning onto Celexa at the same time. Shortly after I made the last drop in dose 12.50 mgs. from Imipramine the **** hit the fan. I went thru every symptom. One would pass and then another would begin.

 

Unfortunately, what I have now is big depression and anxiety. Anxiety can be like a fly in your face, but depression is a whole different thing.

 

I know that it can't all be situational. Look at how many people are on this site and other sites, all battling depression, anxiety and othe issues after dropping a dose or getting off a med.

 

WD + Situational Stress = for me equals the miseries = depression/anxiety.

 

I really admire the people who got off ad's. I don't know how anyone could deal with ongoing depression from drug withdrawal. There are alot of people who have had it for years.

 

Hugs

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Alto I have looked at their site for years, but never made a purchase, therefore I never followed their pretaper schedule/advise. It is very expensive and that was probably the reason, in conjunction with having tried many supplements on my own which did nothing and cost me a bundle.

 

Actually some of the supplements made me feel worse. Like B's = anxiety.

Black Tart Cherry did not help me to sleep.

 

I don't know if Fish Oil works, but I took it. If I take it after 3pm, it can cause bad dreams. I always took Flaxseed for breast health and that worked for cysts (nothing to do with withdawal).

 

I don't really know if Rescue Remedy works. I never took it consistently.

 

I did just log onto their site and there are liquids which are specific to your problems.

 

Has anyone done this, or is this another waste of money??????

 

I did take Ativa Sativa (not sure of spellling), which is basically oatmeal, and I actually felt better, HOWEVER, and there is always a HOWEVER with WD I cold not tell if I had stabilized at 15mgs. Lexapro and had a good window ~ or ~ if it was the Sativa??????????????????

 

So here are two questions RR and Ativa ;)

 

Alto Bless you Heart, you have a vast knowledge of this whole issue :)

 

Hugs

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The information about supplements you can get on this site for free is as valid as what they're selling on their site.

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"I really admire the people who got off ad's. I don't know how anyone could deal with ongoing depression from drug withdrawal. There are alot of people who have had it for years."

 

Just want to reiterate that I am having NO trouble with depression during my withdrawal, but my withdrawal is very very slow. BUT IT'S WORTH IT because I feel so good so much of the time.

 

And I historically had TERRIBLE rebound depression every time I cut or quit any psych med, ADs in particular, over the 20 years I was on the stuff.

 

I do get other kinds of withdrawal symptoms when I cut, which go away as I hold between cuts. And the effects of the drugs themselves do seem to be decreasing as I taper, which is great. But I am certain I would be having a very bad time if I weren't going so slowly. I've got a lot of history of that.

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Rhi....1/2mg at a time works well for you... wonderful. Do you think you were on too much

Celexa and if so, how did it make you feel.

 

Honestly, I would have thought anxiety would have subsided at this point, but it hasn't.

I wouldn't say I am depressed but there isn't any joy in my life. Just burden & worry ~ a heaviness.

 

I was posting with Alto (where I don't remember) that 40mgs. may be too much Celexa. Alto was saying that most meds are being prescribed by too high a dose. I agree.

 

Somewhere on this site someone posted about taking a nail file and making one swipe across the top of the pill to reduce the dose. After 4-6 weeks take 2 swipes. I thought that was a great idea as it only amounts to 'dust' in what it removed.

 

Lots of Cyber Hugs

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40 mg sounds like a lot of Celexa.

 

When I was taking Wellbutrin I'm absolutely certain it was contributing to my anxiety. I don't know if the Celexa was. This time around I only took 10 mg and wasn't on that for long before I began tapering and now I'm down to 3.5.

 

At 40 mg you could probably start with a faster taper, I think 1 mg at a time would certainly be a reasonable speed to start with, and if you did well with that you could try cutting a little more or going a little faster. As your dose reduces you would probably need to slow the taper. That seems to be how it goes for people.

 

May I also add PLEEEEASE don't take Xanax unless you are very careful to not take it two days in a row and not take it more than twice a week. It's a very nasty very addictive drug that's really hard to get off of once you develop tolerance. I've encountered so many people who started benzos just intermittently but then their anxiety became worse (due to withdrawal effects between doses) and they ended up taking more and more until they were hooked. If you use a benzo be very careful.

 

I don't know about propanolol but I don't think it's anywhere near as addictive.

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I agree with Rhi.

 

With Celexa available as a liquid, highly recommend using that to reduce. The nail file method is very approximate. See Tips for tapering off Celexa (citalopram)

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Even with a miniscule decrease in Celexa I have felt a difference for the better. Go figure..

 

I really do understand the whole Xanax thing. I don't do it very often and don't want to, however once in awhile I need to interrupt the anxiety cycle.

 

I am so sensitive to WD that I would probably start of (using the liquid) a possible 14/ mg. drop in dose, or at the most 1/2 mg. for starters.

 

WD is the absolute Thief of Lifefor me. Thank you so much for you input :)

 

Hugs and have a marvelous weekend....very rainy in South Florida...it's a Movie kind of weekend - or - retail therapy :D

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Question...

 

With a tiny, tiny drop in Celexa I noticed I am agitated. I have alot on my plate as well.

A little difficulty falling asleep. Can granules of this stuff cause reactions????

 

Anxiety is better. This week I woke with not anxiety, until this morning, Sunday (I go into a funk on sundays). I wanted to have a parade for not waking with anxiety for a good 4-5 days :D How wonderful that felt.

 

Will probably get the liquid and pill. Would like to work my way down to 30 mgs. and coast there if possible.

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Yes, a tiny drop can cause symptoms. Remember, your nervous system is still recovering from switching. Using the liquid will give you greater control than guesstimating the amount of your decrease.

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Yes, a tiny drop can cause symptoms. Remember, your nervous system is still recovering from switching. Using the liquid will give you greater control than guesstimating the amount of your decrease.

 

Given how sensitive you are to very small changes I think having precise control over the amount you remove will be helpful for you.

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Thanks:)

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I stopped my Celexa taper. It lasted a short time. The liquid is the answer for this.

 

I don't know for sure if now is the right time. Then again is there ever a good time to do this???

 

Taking my mother to the Lung Doctor to find out the results of the PET Scan to see if the mark is a malignancy.

 

I was thinking back....I actually felt better physically while on Imipramine then I do on Celexa. More energy, slept better, more able to lose weight.

 

Something is not right with me. Is it my life and the worries/fears I have currently - or - is the Celexa just not a good mix. OR....both.

 

Always looking for answers...

 

Hugs

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I stopped my Celexa taper. It lasted a short time. The liquid is the answer for this.

 

I don't know for sure if now is the right time. Then again is there ever a good time to do this???

 

Taking my mother to the Lung Doctor to find out the results of the PET Scan to see if the mark is a malignancy.

 

I was thinking back....I actually felt better physically while on Imipramine then I do on Celexa. More energy, slept better, more able to lose weight.

 

Something is not right with me. Is it my life and the worries/fears I have currently - or - is the Celexa just not a good mix. OR....both.

 

Always looking for answers...

 

Hugs

 

I feel like psych meds just make us "not right." If you haven't read Breggin on that subject yet, I highly recommend it.

 

Really, if you felt excellent and well on that dose of Celexa, I would be shocked.

 

I don't know if there's ever a good time to do it, but there are definitely worse times than others. It's always fine to hold a taper whenever you're not feeling well or you're under stress. It doesn't have to be fast. I think once you get the liquid and begin taking it down in very small increments with long holds, you'll discover that it's more do-able than you thought. And I suspect that as your dose decreases slowly, you will find yourself feeling better, too.

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Rhi thank you soooo much. Really appreciate your thoughts. The beauty of this site is that we (I) really need the input.

 

In all honesty, tapering down has always been a nightmare and I have that hesitation (big hesitation) about going thru the BS again.

 

Somethings got to give here...will call and ask for liquid. The pills comes in 10-20-40mgs.

Your Celexa drops are in 1/2mgs. increments?

 

Thanks again

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My thinking is not right. It was much better when I was on Imipramine. It was better while I was tapering Imipramine and weaning onto Celexa.

 

Can't concentrate

 

Obsessive thinking like it's going to change a situation

If I hear a song, I hum it for days on end, until I hear another song I haven't heard in a long time and then begin with that one. Do other people hum like this????

 

Cannot tap into positive thoughts or emit a new frequency

 

Stuck in negativity and worry

 

Vivid, disturbing dreams

 

Absence of happiness and joy

 

Having trouble getting out the door to exercise. I do work and run all sorts of errands, but not exercise.

 

Forgetful and short term memory loss. I go blank on names...WTH?

 

Reading from Mariann Williamson "Return To Love" ~ "We tend to attract what we think about most."

This is where I am having a huge issue. I know that I need to 'emit a new frequency' and tap into the power of positive thinking and I can't seem to do it.

 

SOS

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CVS called.....think the liquid Celexa is ready for pickup. Got to do something, this is misery. I have AM anxiety that won't let up. My thoughts just aren't right. Can't infuse happy thoughts, forgetful, tired. Was better off on Imipramine.

 

Lots of regrets with these meds....And I know you can all relate :P

 

I will be using liquid and pills.

 

Hugs and chances are I will be posting more than I do now...LOL

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