success ☼ scottly9999: Lexapro nightmare

July 31, 2017

Only a few days ago and so much has changed..

Not long after I wrote that update, I crashed into a huge pile of depression.

It seems the waves come in a bit faster and it appears harder - but I'm getting a few little windows...

glimmers of things that I once was, and remember being.

I've had 2 windows since I wrote that... and 2 huge crashes.

I'm taking all this as I'm healing.

i can't go back to exactly how I was before meds, as so much has happened in that time.

I've lost both parents, coping with that - dealing with being an only child with 1 remaining uncle - who is very ill currently...

I can see that I'll need therapy on this - but it feels too raw right now.

Also with my wife who is dealing with a few pretty major health issues of her own.

I'm booked in to see a clinical psychologist tomorrow. I'm stressing that I don't want to touch any psych medication at all.

How that my biggest struggle is coping with the changes in my life, and the intense struggle of the intensity of the waves of crippling bad emotions.

One other aspect of my signs of healing is getting INTENSE amounts of desire flooding me... and just purely sexual - like I need it.

my "guy" is extra sensitive - don't remember it being quite this sensitive before.

It is a current positive - and I'm def seeing it as a sign of healing.

I was able to sort of talk myself through one of the bad waves on the weekend... the emotions followed my thoughts - which is also a fairly new experience for me - so many years of being MEH and lazy with your thoughts - as they didn't really seem to matter in the same way.

That is happening - not fully, and not always, but it's happening.

I was able to try and breathe through and around the anxiety and fear and ACCEPT it - not like it, but accept it was there - and expand around it.

That sort of worked.

It's a little bit like these negative emtions are with me - and I'm SLOWLY getting ability to cope with them again - slowly...

I was up later than I wanted to be last night, I saw a friend, and as per usual, sky high anxiety - about everything and nothing... I do feel less anxiety at home currently - music is just too upsetting and enjoying just bland TV shows.

I managed to enjoy Thor the other night with the wife - during a window.

Anyway - I felt really sh*tty last night, huge fear, dread, despair, deep sadness...

went to sleep ok - woke at 6 with mind racing... one of my worst wake ups yet.

Tried to breathe through it... sort of worked.

Listed thnigs I was grateful for...

and while I got up... my libido really kicked in ... but I controlled it... sheesh!!

The brakes have come off there!!!!

I got to work - been stressful today... not much staff, big issues to start the day.

But I noticed the warm winter sun on my back as I walked up from the factory - and I stopped and noticed it, for what felt like the first time in ages...

I started looking at things around me that i"ve looked at so many times, and SAW them.

I do still need to process some very painful emotions, but at the moment, which window is giving me a little breather from it.

I'm taking it as it is.

I don't feel HEALED, or PERFECT, but just better than I have been.

I do recall a period very similar to this about 9 months ago... I had some problems with dropping doses... and fell into a very insecure - dulled and depressed, and hyper sensitive period... and coming outof it, my sex drive went crazy too!....

August 1, 2017

Update time again.

Ok - have been in a fairly good little window - not entirely symptom free - have lingering sadness and anxiety - but feels like a normal level - was getting glimpses and flashes of being a bit happy.

Sometimes I worry if my window is a bit of a hypomanic state - as it's hard to tell if I'm a bit "up" or just NORMAL compared to wallowing in the pits of depression in a wave???

BUT it's given me that LITTLE shred of hope - a sign that i'm on track - I AM healing.

BUT what makes it so hard to cope with is the thoughts and hurt and loss and despair that closes in SO QUICKLY.

Like your subconscious doesn' tknow what to throw at you first, so it gives you ALL of it.

Am I still greiving my father 5 years later?? OR is it a neuro-emotion???

I SORT of felt like I THINK i grieved him.

I just feel lost, like my life is sort of meaningless.

YET - this isn't AS STRONG as it has been, it feels different.

I'm doing my best to fight this - beat it - NOT LET IT BEAT ME - I'm better than this - I'm stronger.

It feels like a midlife crisis, berevement, identity crisis, and abandonment issues all together...

ANd years ago - I had NONE of this.

I think the drug erodes your sense of self - that centre of your being that you can RELY on in times of crisis.

When you need it most - it's not there.

Thats the type of pain I'm sure we're all experiencing, but can't quite put into words.

These thoughts and feeling cannot hurt me - they are just my mind - they feel real, but they can't hurt me.

I'm grateful my sleep hasn't been disturbed too much - in fact I'm sleeping a LITTLE better.

physically I feel fine - although had INTENSE nausea come out of nowhere yesterday for an hour.

My psych session seemed to go - but early days - had to cover a lot of ground.

He doesn't know anything about SSRI's and withdrawal at all... but was validating!!

I've started on the issues that SEEM to be plaguing me currently, as in a great sense of loss - seems to be around my parents and the sense of family that they gave me - although I have my lovely family now, the Lexapro eroded my loving feelings - I'm going through the motions, and they can't tell - and I'd never be able to feel the same way about anybody else again... but when you lose your parents, YOUR family that YOU GREW UP IN - gone... being an only child, and dad being only child from another country - the sense of family being SO SMALL is something I just seem stuck on currently.

Amplified by the withdrawal process.

All this is an opportunity to grow though - as you don't grow as a person if you're comfortable!!!!

Wishing anybody reading happy healing and hope a window is due to you soon!

August 3, 2017

Hi All

Any advice greatly appreciated..

I've been reading and re-reading lots of topics, but can't seem to find something that relates to me currently.

I seem to be experiencing waves and windows, or ups and down quite rapidly at the moment.

It's hard to tell if my window is the REAL me - of it it's a bit "up" or "hypomanic"? Could be just in relative terms to the anxiety and depression I've been feeling?

I have had a few happy moments, where I started to experience some actual joy and happiness - just being in my skin, the room and surroundings felt more "real".

It lasted a little while.

Now I've woken with mild dread, and hopelessness again.

I'm telling myself that it's JUST FAKE.

It pervades and seeps into every nook and cranny in your mind though - there isn't a "safe place" when it hits.

It really does feel like your life is crap and useless and stupid and dumb.

I catch myself with "whats the point" thoughts - but then see one of my dogs so happy to see me.

Can feel the struggle with the thoughts.

silly brain!

August 7, 2017

right in the middle of a wave.... very bad depression... just swirling around me.

The dread and fear SEEMS to have subsided a little... and it's just a sinking - sadness depression.

Ruminating over what I've lost (which isn't a huge amount) but the amplification is there.

The obsessive thinking....

I seem to have lost a most of the followers I had on my thread at the beginning.... maybe as I was doing sort of ok - during most of my taper down - that I didn't have much to comment on, and left the forums for a bit...

I could do with a little encouragement from others - if thats ok???

I have had a little breakthrough in thinking..

I can tell it is fake and chemical.... as when I was before Lexapro - sure you would think about something sad or depressing, but it wouldn't last... something else would come along and pop into your mind - or be distracted with something else more pleasant - came and went etc.

This is just about 100% constant - all the time.

And that is what must be driving my thoughts.

Instead of the emotions following the thoughts, your thoughts are following and scrambling to justify the emotions you're feeling.

It really isn't my life situation that is making me depressed. I wasn't like this during my taper... but maybe this was bubbling away - and masked during the taper?

I started telling myself "I am exactly where I need to be right now - it sucks, but it's part of the healing"

I'm going to be ok.

but those are words I'm not currently feeling right now.

I could do with a new window please.

August 7, 2017

The road travelled after reaching 0 mg is as unpredictable as the road to get there. Each person deals with whatever comes up. The awareness you're bringing to the thoughts that are occurring is great! You are having the thoughts, the thoughts are having you.

If we knew who to call to grant windows, we'd post the number in HUGE font, maybe even create a .gif.

August 7, 2017

Nice one Scallywag - thanks for that.

Boy this ruminating - and endless loops in your head, and how it's trying to dig out eVERY painful thought and feeling and memory is relentless.

You have to CATCH yourself and firmly say to your brain "Oi - knock it off! It's JUST bull**** W/D!!!!!"

It sometimes actually works - but remembering to do that - getting OUT of your head.

Watched TV last night - just a bunch of shows...

and found it mostly pretty distracting which was good - almost as soon as it stopped, boom mood tanked.

The crippling FEAR and anxiety has slowly faded into horrible hopelessness and despair and depression.

It's horrible stuff.

clinging on ... just.

August 8, 2017

We are all behind you, Scottly.

August 9, 2017

Ok - update.

Thanks Gridley for commenting! Every comment helps.

So I'm in a window of sorts currently..

I could feel the wave SLOWLY receeding a bit during the day yesterday... by time I got home from work, it was sort of gone - but not really.

Sat and had a nice chat with the wife - I've not gone on and on about how I've felt - as don't want to burden her with it..

But opened up a bit more.

She is of Christian faith - quite new too - it's been wonderful for her.

She said that she believes I'm about to have a revelation..

I said I'm just tortured by my thoughts and feelings and emotions all the time currently.

The relief I've had has been short lived..

It's as if that nice - safe place inside me was gone - missing, closed off...

Anyway - I said I'm going to do a guided meditation - not sure what drew me to it, but felt compelled to.

So I did one that focused on depression.

It started with me being in a cave, which I didn't like, as I've been struggling with feeling abandoned, and isolated, and alone - even though I'm not!!!

Slowly during it, talked about carrying heavy bags that were weighing me down.

slowly light filled the cave, and an opening appeared... and in came my guardian - and INSTANTLY I pictured my Dad there.

Remembering, I lost him SUDDENLY 5 years ago... dropped dead.

He was my family - my everything really. He sheltered me and looked after me, and I was the apple of his eye.

He adored me, and I knew it.

Losing Dad was MASSIVE to me.

and I burst into a few tears... he offered to take my "heavy bags" of sadness and grief for me.

There was more to it, but it was very profound, and really resonated with me.

I did another medidation focusing on strength, ease and clarity.

Again, felt that... not overly strongly at the time - but since then last night, it's been building in me..

I've felt a sense of peace and calm in my own skin that I've not felt in a long time.

I finally started to feel safe, and could relax, and I wasn't really alone afterall...

It's actually been during the day that it's become more and more profound. I've been walking like my head is in the clouds currently.

I FOUND my safe place again - it's in me... and I needed that so badly.

It felt like I let go of my fear of letting go of Dad, and of being left alone.

This morning I awoke to racing thoughts, anxiety kicking in etc... but I was able to acknowledge it, and move past it back to the feeling of I WILL BE OK - and I CAN FEEL at peace right now.

I don't know if it fully qualifies for a window, but SOMETHING had to give with the emotions.

I REALLY REALLY REALLY think it dulled me out SO MUCH that I wasn't able to fully process my grief at losing Dad.

It was a monumental shift for me - he pretty much represented my core family to me.

I can tell it's not fully over, but WOW - it's a BIG step in the right direction.

The peace, and calm and inner serenity is lovely.

I was able to slice through IT problems like a hot knife today at work too.

Maybe I was destined to be on Lexapro - to go through this process - to be a better person??

I hope that anybody reading is experiencing some relief from the torturous W/D...!

August 10, 2017

Annnnnd crashed back into depression again...

Although it's not QUITE as intense - it's still seeped into every facet of my mind.

It feels like there is just about no part of my life that hasn't been affected or eroded away.

It HAS to have been the medication - that stopped you feeling good about anything.

It becomes quite a crisis and desperate in your mind.

My little family - with Dad - was so important to me, and I felt GOOD and COMPLETE just being at home...

that feeling disappearing slowly over time - was what led me to getting OFF the meds.

It has SORT of come back in fits and starts...

I have to remind myself it HAS to be CHEMICAL IMBALANCE FROM W/D thats causing this **** depression...

As it's chemical, and not just an external event that is making me down about something specific, therefore, it's every aspect.

I'm not a religious person - but feeling a tad more spiritual lately - esp after that profound meditation I had.

But most of th epositive feels like it's been washed away - these mood swings are insane and bl00dy hard to cope with.

This process of W/D is almost like reassessing every single aspect of your life - no element is untouched.

It's horrible.

I'm not plagued with sinking stomach anxiety though - so thats something.

I really hope that this is the drugs interfering with my reward pathways of feeling joy and love from my family.

As I picture anybody else in their place, and I can't do that - I just can't imagine anybody other than my wife - AS my wife.

It's really a re-birth process.

August 10, 2017

I noticed today since my update earlier in the day - that somehow I was going to tank into another horrible wave..

but it sort of stopped itself.

I didn't fight it too much - a little.

Was getting slight pangs of panic feeling - that it's all doomed, but they were slighter than previously.

I also had a VERY flat - blah depressed feeling though - but again - not ALL consuming, and wasn't second by second intolerable that I've experienced.

This has felt different, less severe, a little easier to live in and cope with.

It's been more of a BORED type depressed feeling - as opposed to bordering on clinical depression.

I think a LOT of my issues the last few months when I fully stopped, was I just grossly under estimated the effect of jumping from 0.2mg - even though I held it for a while - I should have dropped by smaller and smaller amounts.

That was the smallest amount I could measure with the syringe in the concentrastion that the liquid came in.

I thought I would be fine.

I seem to be over the worst of 3.5 months of almost constant fear and dread and hopelessness.

It breaks your spirit apart - really does.

You find out what you're made of on this journey..

I feel a small glimmer of hope.

August 10, 2017

hi scottly ,I feel your pain and worries in your 2 posts ,I'm plagued with doubt myself why am I coming off medication ,I have crippling symptoms ,I just have to believe in my decision and keep pushing through ,depression has to be the worst thing to experience ,I do all the research I can on depression ,it can really twist our thinking ,so I try to be mindful of every nasty though and just let it pass on through my mind .

I try to eat healthy ,avoid toxic people like the plague also .I used to try tough it out being around toxic people but its just to much work so I avoid it at all costs .yesterday was a bad day but I believe today looks to be a better day .that's how I take it .

when your going about your day and you have depression or crappy thoughts ,try witness them as just thoughts and do your best to tackle your day as normal .

I was very self conscious yesterday out walking so I put it into YouTube and got a good explanation and a way to reduce it .

withdrawl is truly brutal beyond belief

take care

PB

August 11, 2017

Hi Powerback!

Yep - withdrawal is brutal - it's long lasting, and so confusing.

It's a trial by fire for sure.

The Anxiety, fear, dread, despair, depression - although just words on this page... are truely horrific, and take you right upto your absolute limit on what you can cope with.

I completely agree with your approach - which is effectively mindfulness.

It's using your observing self to detach from the thinking self.

I've been starting on using guided meditation from youtube, and those seem to be really helping.

At first I was treating all the feelings that were raging around as JUST withdrawal..

But it's a bit more than that.

It appears there are some issues that I need to tackle... but in tackling them, the first step is accepting them.

Accepting that horrible anxiety that says I can't relax, at home, where everything is ok.

That depression that tells me that my life is worthless.

I'm noticing that my waves have gradually become a little less intense - a bit more manageable, less crippling.

The fear induced early waves were just mindbending.

I'm now into my 4th month of fully off Lexapro - and although still in the early days, I think I'm approaching stage 2, which is starting to get windows etc.

Whats seemingly positive about them, is I feel I'm creating them more myself - with mediation, mindfulness and a level of acceptance - that yes they're ****, and horrible, and bad,and I'm miserable, but breathing into them, and relaxing around it..

together those thigns seems to be helping - PLUS time - good old time.

My 2 things seems to be almost constant anxiety to the point of causing physical pain and crushing depression.

But they're breaking up - and a little more manageable.

You really need to re-build yourself in this healing.

So much of your identity is built up with the happy and positive things in your life - the daily reminders of who you are and what you are.

When thats taken away so gradually over so many years of the blunting of those drugs, you lose track of who you are, and what you have!!!!

It's a time to refocus and rebuild.

I still don't know if my windows are mild mania - or normal... my baseline really doesn't seem to exist, except for a Lexapro fuelled haze.

I hope everybody out there thats reading has a positive and healing weekend!!!!

August 11, 2017

17 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

You really need to re-build yourself in this healing.

So much of your identity is built up with the happy and positive things in your life - the daily reminders of who you are and what you are.

When thats taken away so gradually over so many years of the blunting of those drugs, you lose track of who you are, and what you have!!!!

It's a time to refocus and rebuild.

Scottly. This is absolutely spot-on. We tend to focus on getting off the drugs and forget that once we have achieved this goal then the real hard work of rebuilding our lives and rediscovering our identity has to begin.

Congratulations on getting to zero and I hope you continue to make progress in this endeavour.

August 14, 2017

If anybody is reading this - I've posted a VERY important question at the very end of this post...

The Neuro-fear... sheesh!

It really digs out your deepest fears and amplifies them, magnifies them... and makes you sit in them, living them out...

Even if they are sort of true - to you anyway...

The intensity is something else.

Even in moments of clarity - the way your brain finds these hidden fears and just tortures you with them.

In saying that - my emotions were spiralling over the weekend.. slowly building and building - in a negative tense way.

By Sunday afternoon - they were pretty full on - the tension down my neck was bad.

I was trying to accept them, and breathe around them, but wasn't working - they were tightly focused and hard to exist with.

I did some housework, and went out and mowed the grass and raked some leaves.

Enjoyed it a little more than I thought I would.

I stopped - and went upstairs to do some meditation... I did a few generic ones that were just positive, and affirmative.

They really did seem to help short circuit the spirals.

At first I didn't seem to notice much...

I do find it hard sometimes as one of my current fears is of being alone - and meditating is a solitary thing - but visualizing times when I was a child and felt safe came to me.

I started to notice my mood started to ease up - just relaxed... the mind quietened down, it stopped with the incessant traumatic feelings.

It ALMOST feels as if I'm being traumatized in some way with this.

It's just ****.

Anyway - it did help.. and for the rest of the evening, I started to feel more at peace, not as worried - still am I bit, but more normalized about it all.

I didn't sleep too much - I felt a tad "hypomanic"..

This morning, the usual bullsh*t on waking up - racing mind, sinking feeling with thoughts intertwined.

I started to ask myself - what exactly are you stressed about?

How is your life any different now as opposed to 1 year ago?

5 years ago?

8 years ago?

what exactly IS different?

You DID feel a sense of relative peace and no fears taunting you then - why now?

It started to sort of break the cycle a bit..

YES I have lost my parents since then, but they only visited. I wasn't dependant on them.

It feels like I'm a small child again - who has been abandoned... but I really haven't.

So many things seem to trigger this cycle for me - almost even the ABSENSE of it itself can make me think - whats missing? Oh thats right the horrible nasty soul crushing fear of being on your own.... thanks!

ALong with losing my parents, being an only child - with minimal extended family now - I catch myself thinking, is this even HOME anymore???

Where I'm living...

The feeling of having lost my roots.

Mum never left a legacy of friends - she lost nearly everybody because of her mental illness.

Dad lost a lot due to supporting her - he did have some friends, through his stamp collecting connections, and associations, but they stayed at arms length.

I guess I'm so afraid of the same thing happening to me - and alienating my kids with how I am currently..

There was a thought or phrase I was going to write here, it was important, but it's gone now.

I'll do another meditation tonight.

BUT also - I felt a heightened sense of everything last night - more vivid, more real..

little nice thoughts did pop in...

I had a sense of somehow I WILL be in a happy place soon enough and will have moved past this.

I also felt more vulnerable, more open and a bit scared, but not of anytihng in particular, just of being hurt..

It's very strange.

All along, this feels very different to previous waves, and different from last 3-4 months.

There is more clarity to my thoughts and feelings.

How much of this needs to be DEALT with? And how much will just settle down of it's own accord?????

August 14, 2017

5 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

If anybody is reading this - I've posted a VERY important question at the very end of this post...

The Neuro-fear... sheesh!

It really digs out your deepest fears and amplifies them, magnifies them... and makes you sit in them, living them out...

Even if they are sort of true - to you anyway...

The intensity is something else.

Even in moments of clarity - the way your brain finds these hidden fears and just tortures you with them.

In saying that - my emotions were spiralling over the weekend.. slowly building and building - in a negative tense way.

By Sunday afternoon - they were pretty full on - the tension down my neck was bad.

I was trying to accept them, and breathe around them, but wasn't working - they were tightly focused and hard to exist with.

I did some housework, and went out and mowed the grass and raked some leaves.

Enjoyed it a little more than I thought I would.

I stopped - and went upstairs to do some meditation... I did a few generic ones that were just positive, and affirmative.

They really did seem to help short circuit the spirals.

At first I didn't seem to notice much...

I do find it hard sometimes as one of my current fears is of being alone - and meditating is a solitary thing - but visualizing times when I was a child and felt safe came to me.

I started to notice my mood started to ease up - just relaxed... the mind quietened down, it stopped with the incessant traumatic feelings.

It ALMOST feels as if I'm being traumatized in some way with this.

It's just ****.

Anyway - it did help.. and for the rest of the evening, I started to feel more at peace, not as worried - still am I bit, but more normalized about it all.

I didn't sleep too much - I felt a tad "hypomanic"..

This morning, the usual bullsh*t on waking up - racing mind, sinking feeling with thoughts intertwined.

I started to ask myself - what exactly are you stressed about?

How is your life any different now as opposed to 1 year ago?

5 years ago?

8 years ago?

what exactly IS different?

You DID feel a sense of relative peace and no fears taunting you then - why now?

It started to sort of break the cycle a bit..

YES I have lost my parents since then, but they only visited. I wasn't dependant on them.

It feels like I'm a small child again - who has been abandoned... but I really haven't.

So many things seem to trigger this cycle for me - almost even the ABSENSE of it itself can make me think - whats missing? Oh thats right the horrible nasty soul crushing fear of being on your own.... thanks!

ALong with losing my parents, being an only child - with minimal extended family now - I catch myself thinking, is this even HOME anymore???

Where I'm living...

The feeling of having lost my roots.

Mum never left a legacy of friends - she lost nearly everybody because of her mental illness.

Dad lost a lot due to supporting her - he did have some friends, through his stamp collecting connections, and associations, but they stayed at arms length.

I guess I'm so afraid of the same thing happening to me - and alienating my kids with how I am currently..

There was a thought or phrase I was going to write here, it was important, but it's gone now.

I'll do another meditation tonight.

BUT also - I felt a heightened sense of everything last night - more vivid, more real..

little nice thoughts did pop in...

I had a sense of somehow I WILL be in a happy place soon enough and will have moved past this.

I also felt more vulnerable, more open and a bit scared, but not of anytihng in particular, just of being hurt..

It's very strange.

All along, this feels very different to previous waves, and different from last 3-4 months.

There is more clarity to my thoughts and feelings.

How much of this needs to be DEALT with? And how much will just settle down of it's own accord?????

hi scottly this a very well put together and interesting post ,you have written exactly a lot of my own thoughts and experiences.

Its extraordinary how my mind is being ripped apart by withdrawl ,every bad decision and mistake and ill informed decision in my past attacking me ,its like having the Spanish inquisition living in my head .

we become so vulnerable ,I haven't come across any research on why we become like this ,its soul destroying .

as to what needs to be dealt ,that's a very open question for each persons own life ,our age ,back round ,life experience .

we all mop up life experience differently .I really struggle with this neuro emotion stuff ,at times I'm convinced I've got PTSD.

childhood memories mostly negative ,my new one is walking around a dingy hospital as a child [asthma as kid],but I do counter act the uncomfortable feeling with the fact I was always brought to feed the ducks after these appointments ,that's progress I suppose .

I wonder for my self how it will settle down ,if I think back before meds ,there was issues in my life and I had certain confidence issues due to a lifetime of anxiety[unaware I had it at the time ] ,so the nuero emotions definitely have an origin from ones life in general ,its just so dam hard navigating them .

I'm trying to cope and be kind to myself but its very tough at times.

Take care

PB

August 14, 2017

Hello Scottly9999

I'm very new here and I found your thread because I am just beginning my taper off 10mg Escitalopram - it looks like your journey is similar to the last time I tried to get off the meds. In 2012 I got down to about 1.5mg then stopped suddenly because I went away and forgot to take the drops with me. I then experienced six months of hell very similar to what you are describing. I'm sending you lots of love and a massive hug because it's such a terrible, terrible place to be. Eventually I went back on my original dose because I couldn't handle it - if I'd found this forum sooner I would have reinstated at 2mg to see how I got on. I am absolutely NO expert on this, but do you think it's worth reinstating a teeny amount to see if it helps? It looks to me that you tapered really slowly so that might not be the issue - can anyone else advise please? It just breaks my heart to know what you're going through.

Could I please ask for your advice? I'm currently shifting from 10mg tablet to liquid and I've been advised to take 7.5mg as tablet and 2.5mg as liquid with a view to getting to 5mg tablet/5mg liquid then start decreasing the drops. I started on the 7.5mg/2.5mg last Thursday so it's only been a few days and I feel fine so far - should I stay here for a month do you think? Or could I move to 5mg/5mg a bit quicker as I'm not actually decreasing my dose, just switching the form of it? Any advice from anyone would be helpful!

I hope you feel better Scottly, just remember that the pain and the fear are really truly NOT REAL. They are chemical. In terms of what needs to be dealt with, I think perhaps you are grieving and you need to feel that. I think withdrawal does throw up things that might have been suppressed. But you will get through that grief - that is a normal emotion and you just have to give it time and it will definitely get easier. I lost both my parents too - my dad only 2.5 years ago - and I feel much better about it now than I did a year ago. But the other stuff - the really awful feelings and thoughts - that's not real, that's withdrawal so you don't need to deal with it you just have to somehow endure it - that's what I think anyway, like I said I'm not an expert AT ALL but I did go through this before and once I was back on the meds and stable I could see those terrible emotions for what they were.

If someone more experienced than me could comment on the idea of Scottly reinstating a tiny amount of Lexapro that would be much appreciated! And apologies if you really don't want to consider that! x

August 14, 2017

1 hour ago, Debby said:

Hello Scottly9999

I'm very new here and I found your thread because I am just beginning my taper off 10mg Escitalopram - it looks like your journey is similar to the last time I tried to get off the meds. In 2012 I got down to about 1.5mg then stopped suddenly because I went away and forgot to take the drops with me. I then experienced six months of hell very similar to what you are describing. I'm sending you lots of love and a massive hug because it's such a terrible, terrible place to be. Eventually I went back on my original dose because I couldn't handle it - if I'd found this forum sooner I would have reinstated at 2mg to see how I got on. I am absolutely NO expert on this, but do you think it's worth reinstating a teeny amount to see if it helps? It looks to me that you tapered really slowly so that might not be the issue - can anyone else advise please? It just breaks my heart to know what you're going through.

Could I please ask for your advice? I'm currently shifting from 10mg tablet to liquid and I've been advised to take 7.5mg as tablet and 2.5mg as liquid with a view to getting to 5mg tablet/5mg liquid then start decreasing the drops. I started on the 7.5mg/2.5mg last Thursday so it's only been a few days and I feel fine so far - should I stay here for a month do you think? Or could I move to 5mg/5mg a bit quicker as I'm not actually decreasing my dose, just switching the form of it? Any advice from anyone would be helpful!

I hope you feel better Scottly, just remember that the pain and the fear are really truly NOT REAL. They are chemical. In terms of what needs to be dealt with, I think perhaps you are grieving and you need to feel that. I think withdrawal does throw up things that might have been suppressed. But you will get through that grief - that is a normal emotion and you just have to give it time and it will definitely get easier. I lost both my parents too - my dad only 2.5 years ago - and I feel much better about it now than I did a year ago. But the other stuff - the really awful feelings and thoughts - that's not real, that's withdrawal so you don't need to deal with it you just have to somehow endure it - that's what I think anyway, like I said I'm not an expert AT ALL but I did go through this before and once I was back on the meds and stable I could see those terrible emotions for what they were.

If someone more experienced than me could comment on the idea of Scottly reinstating a tiny amount of Lexapro that would be much appreciated! And apologies if you really don't want to consider that! x

Hi Debby.

Thanks heaps for your reply.

I swapped from chopped tablets to just liquid. I didn't have any adverse effects apart from the fact that I was practically in withdrawal while on full dose, but muted due to the drug itself.

Is there a reason you are on a mix of liquid and tablet? Are you aiming to go just to liquid in the future?

I think in terms of me, I'll avoid reinstating, as it feels like I'm through the really really worst of it. It feels different now somehow.

It feels that I have grieved my dad passing 5 years ago... But it's something else.. a very deep seated fear of being all alone.

I'm sitting here on couch with step son who will be 20 in a few weeks with his girlfriend watch tv. He still lives here and will do for a while yet, and girlfriend pops over regularly. Wife is upstairs went to bed early and daughter in bed too.

But even with that.. feel so alone.. like these people aren't my real family.. only mum and dad would have stayed with me...

What if my wife's died or my daughter disowned me later in life?

Just irrational crap like that... But it's always there either concious or subconscious.

It makes me think it's acting like a form of psychological trauma.

I could sort of sense a feeling of unease during most of my taper but could never pin point it.

Maybe this has been manufactured by my subconscious to "make the feeling real?". Now the slightest though triggers it.

It makes me think that it's really neuro emotion .

Thanks again for your reply!!

I want to be able to feel relaxed about my life situation and sink I to that feeling of relaxation and it'll be all ok!

August 14, 2017

2 hours ago, powerback said:

hi scottly this a very well put together and interesting post ,you have written exactly a lot of my own thoughts and experiences.

Its extraordinary how my mind is being ripped apart by withdrawl ,every bad decision and mistake and ill informed decision in my past attacking me ,its like having the Spanish inquisition living in my head .

we become so vulnerable ,I haven't come across any research on why we become like this ,its soul destroying .

as to what needs to be dealt ,that's a very open question for each persons own life ,our age ,back round ,life experience .

we all mop up life experience differently .I really struggle with this neuro emotion stuff ,at times I'm convinced I've got PTSD.

childhood memories mostly negative ,my new one is walking around a dingy hospital as a child [asthma as kid],but I do counter act the uncomfortable feeling with the fact I was always brought to feed the ducks after these appointments ,that's progress I suppose .

I wonder for my self how it will settle down ,if I think back before meds ,there was issues in my life and I had certain confidence issues due to a lifetime of anxiety[unaware I had it at the time ] ,so the nuero emotions definitely have an origin from ones life in general ,its just so dam hard navigating them .

I'm trying to cope and be kind to myself but its very tough at times.

Take care

PB

Hey PB!!

Thanks heaps for replying.

I agree... It feels like it's PTSD!

Makes me wonder constantly has our brain manufactured this?

Have we legit got PTSD now as a result of the constant ruminating???

It's bloody mind bending.

The feeling are things I can sort of relate to.. but really can't think of a time where it was ever like this.

Stress so strong it cramps up muscles in your neck.

I can find that sometimes I can throw logic at it and realise it's bullsh*t.

The reaction anyway.

The over reacting sense of threat it exhausting.

I'm not going to reinstate... Bit move through this.

I can actually feel healing almost perceive it happening.

The way the feelings are evolving and changing.. something is def happening.

It really.does feel like.ptsd.. as you can imagine talking about it doesn't help. Just seems stuck in a terrifying loop.

I'm able to sort of deal with it.. and fake it until I can make it enough.

Holding down job and marriage and friendships.

It annoys me as I'm a bit of an Introvery by nature but the knawing feeling of being scared to be alone is driving me constantly from being by myself. I can't relax on my own.

It must be withdrawal.

Boy am I gonna be one tough cookie at the end of this.!!!

August 15, 2017

Hi FSL.

Thanks for popping in.

I still think my symptoms have been somewhat mild compared to many many others..

However in saying that.. it's taken me to the edge of what I could possibly cope with.

It's horrible to be shown in an uncontrollable way how much pain and suffering your own brain can subject you to.

I'm also expericing more windows.. and they feel more and more normal each time.

Currently I had a Chinese massage on neck and shoulders, was quite painful thought to loosen my neck which had become incredible tense over the last week.

It helped. A bit before that I started to also ease into a window.

My wave wasn't nearly as intense this time.. still not good.. but not as deep.

The with down seems better too.. not high.. just more emotions more subtle and more complete.

Not fearing being on my own or being in my own skin.

I think my mistake was tapering at 50% drops the last few drops and stopping g at 0.2mg

As much as I didn't think it was doing much at all, it clearly was.

And now this far out on 0mg I can feel how much effect it was still having on me in general.

I'm not feeling anxiety right now and haven't realised how much it's been my constant companion for years while in poop out... An uneasy feeling. That was what I sensed was wrong and how my emotions weren't flowing as they should.

Today in the evening has been quite good.

August 22, 2017

Update time again.

Boy - am I sick of this - I really want to drop my membership to the invisible club that nobody wants to be a part of.

My mood has been exceptionally low and nasty for a while.

My windows seem to last about a day at most - usually a bit less so far.

And I'm noticing that my Windows seem to be a bit "up"...

Which is don't really like - it's only very mildly manic... but I don't like it.

It's better than depression!!! OR Anxiety - and terror... but still not ideal.

At least I get a break from the all encompassing doom and gloom, and hopelessness...

I can see things a bit clearer too.

I'm due to have my 2nd session with a psychologist tonight.

But like last time, seem to have a window - which isn't as helpful, as my weaker points are glossed over a bit.

I went into the city to goto an expo - and I'd normally be quite into the tech and stuff on display - but for a long time - while on these damn drugs - my interests slowly eroded - to the point where I was left behind with stuff I was into - like PC gaming and how it's evolved a lot, and how tech has marched on.

So when I get windows, it's a bit of burst of interest, but it's not sustained.

It's that apathy that robs us of our identity - THAT is hugely distressing.

ANyway - so went to the show - felt a very strong sense of being out of place - which I'd normally NOT feel there.

But it's also evident that I feel that "out of place" feeling a lot of the time, even at home.

It's really just the W/D depression talking - and all the misfiring regions of my BRAIN (not mind) doing it... creating emotions as they're firing incorrectly.

I can't wait to have a nice calm, sense of self again - not happy - just content.

My mood was very dark over the weekend.

I went to the hospital to visit my sick uncle (pretty much last of my family in Australia - on Mum's side - Dad's side is UK based, and not much contact their either)...

And on the train there and back - on my own - It was horrible - I wasn't wracked with teh TERROR and PANIC feelings as last time, but the feeling of "don't belong anywhere" and hopelessness and despair was hard to endure.

However, I've noticed I struggle LESS with it, and sort of let it happen.

It's almost impossible to not be dragged into the bullsh*t and lies your brain swarms you with - thats where some meditation helps.

I tried some last night - not sure if it helped a lot (at the time) but today I woke feeling better - and felt better as the day went along.

BUT I'm in a mild manic UP - very very mild.

Nobody would know - my mind works a bit quicker, able to come up with funny replies better, able to think of stuff for work better.

And I can feel a sort of pressure building - only mild not full on mania.

BUT I wish it was just a normal feeling.

At least I'm starting to see positive changes - as for a long time - 3 months or so - there were no windows.

I'm not sure if this is a window, but its a change from crippling depression and anxiety.

Even my daughter last night asked if I was ok.

I tell her that Daddy is a bit low, and have explained about the tablets - and how they have affected me - and I'm working on getting better.

I remember years of my Mother sitting doped out on her anti-psych meds - but did NOT understand it at all.

NOW I DO.

The drugs overtake how your brain SHOULD work - and force it into ways that aren't normal.

stupid meds!

August 22, 2017

4 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

Update time again.

Boy - am I sick of this - I really want to drop my membership to the invisible club that nobody wants to be a part of.

My mood has been exceptionally low and nasty for a while.

My windows seem to last about a day at most - usually a bit less so far.

And I'm noticing that my Windows seem to be a bit "up"...

Which is don't really like - it's only very mildly manic... but I don't like it.

It's better than depression!!! OR Anxiety - and terror... but still not ideal.

At least I get a break from the all encompassing doom and gloom, and hopelessness...

I can see things a bit clearer too.

I'm due to have my 2nd session with a psychologist tonight.

But like last time, seem to have a window - which isn't as helpful, as my weaker points are glossed over a bit.

I went into the city to goto an expo - and I'd normally be quite into the tech and stuff on display - but for a long time - while on these damn drugs - my interests slowly eroded - to the point where I was left behind with stuff I was into - like PC gaming and how it's evolved a lot, and how tech has marched on.

So when I get windows, it's a bit of burst of interest, but it's not sustained.

It's that apathy that robs us of our identity - THAT is hugely distressing.

ANyway - so went to the show - felt a very strong sense of being out of place - which I'd normally NOT feel there.

But it's also evident that I feel that "out of place" feeling a lot of the time, even at home.

It's really just the W/D depression talking - and all the misfiring regions of my BRAIN (not mind) doing it... creating emotions as they're firing incorrectly.

I can't wait to have a nice calm, sense of self again - not happy - just content.

My mood was very dark over the weekend.

I went to the hospital to visit my sick uncle (pretty much last of my family in Australia - on Mum's side - Dad's side is UK based, and not much contact their either)...

And on the train there and back - on my own - It was horrible - I wasn't wracked with teh TERROR and PANIC feelings as last time, but the feeling of "don't belong anywhere" and hopelessness and despair was hard to endure.

However, I've noticed I struggle LESS with it, and sort of let it happen.

It's almost impossible to not be dragged into the bullsh*t and lies your brain swarms you with - thats where some meditation helps.

I tried some last night - not sure if it helped a lot (at the time) but today I woke feeling better - and felt better as the day went along.

BUT I'm in a mild manic UP - very very mild.

Nobody would know - my mind works a bit quicker, able to come up with funny replies better, able to think of stuff for work better.

And I can feel a sort of pressure building - only mild not full on mania.

BUT I wish it was just a normal feeling.

At least I'm starting to see positive changes - as for a long time - 3 months or so - there were no windows.

I'm not sure if this is a window, but its a change from crippling depression and anxiety.

Even my daughter last night asked if I was ok.

I tell her that Daddy is a bit low, and have explained about the tablets - and how they have affected me - and I'm working on getting better.

I remember years of my Mother sitting doped out on her anti-psych meds - but did NOT understand it at all.

NOW I DO.

The drugs overtake how your brain SHOULD work - and force it into ways that aren't normal.

stupid meds!

Boy - am I sick of this - I really want to drop my membership to the invisible club that nobody wants to be a part of.

Ile second this .

I don't even have the energy for my walk up the hills today .wondering if I should force it .

August 23, 2017

Updates.

Hiya all.

Was in a terrible depression yesterday - pretty much from the moment I woke up - wasn't aware of any specific thoughts that triggered it.

It's not like normal depression - if there even is such a thing...

I had a half day - took time off to go see daughter perform in a school concert performance against other schools.

Was at a different venue about an hour drive.

Was in a TERRIBLE low - sad, depressed, hopeless and totally joyless mood.

During the performance, I was numb and distant and felt totally alone - surround bystrangers.

I was sitting next to wife - and sat next to another Dad of one of my daughters friends - but she doesn't play with her anymore - so haven' tseen him in a while.

But this depressino really has robbed all sense of continuation and interest in me - so it's harder and harder to talk to people - as I feel I have very little to contribute to a conversation.

So even in the brighter spots, I struggle to remember what I was really into!!

Stuff reminds me - of how depressed I feel and down I go again.

When we got home last night, I struggled to maintain a happy face - had to put balloons and banners up for step-son's birthday today.

All I was feeling was sadness, emptiness and hollowness and felt alone - even in my family - but my FAMILY FEELS alone too.

IT"S just the depression talking, but it's all I'm hearing currently.

I was NOT like this pre-meds

I couldn't think of anything better than just chilling at home - being with my family - I felt complete and whole and content.

I was overwhelmed with stress sure, but I didn't have this chasm of despair in my heart.

I had an inner strength and identity...

I'd worry about silly things, and insecurities, but still had an inner place that was ok.

These drugs slowly erode that from you - and you don't know it, coz it's blunted!

It's only when you remove them do you notice whats been eroded.

I guess my question is - people talk about recovery and just wait it out etc...

does that eroded sense of self come back?

OR do we have to REBUILD it?

As the morning has gone on - I've felt a little bit lighter.

I'm still not letting this beat me - or define me.

I will be happy and content again!!

August 24, 2017

Hi Scottly,

im so sorry you are still struggling, and sounds even more since completely off in the emotion department. I actually still read all you posts directly in my email, only that I have been so sick and out of the wold with mental dysfunction and severe DR unable to post much this year.

Initially i I was wonder if the emotion issue maybe somehow partially due to the pre- meds situation, but now I heard you saying twits different from the pre- meds, which is good, meaning it's purely caused by the drug, So giving time, it will resolve like all other symptoms each of us has.

From most other ppl timeline, I feel you are very close to the turning point being off 3 months.

Even everyone is different, from my own experience, 0.2 mg is still a huge dose, I can feel the crazy power of 0.0004mg some days it can be a life saver when I'm in WD phase and some days it sucks my brain immediately when I was in reaction phase. The difference between us is, the effect of dropping dose takes longer for you and why you could stopped 0.2 mg easily but experiencing it post taper, while for me, I react immediately so can't stop or even drop dose bigger than 0.004 mg. it's possible regardless the pattern difference, fundamentally the overall timeline will be same. I believe when your time is up, these nasty emotion will be gone along with the normal and happy emotions surfacing up.

you are very close I truely believe even though you don't feel that way, just like me feeling dying just two days ago from the most severe and long lasting headache, losing all the hope and believing it would be like that forever, it passed the next day and my thinking changed immediately. These drugs trick our brain in all ways making us believe in only what we feel at that moment, similarly for time when we feel good. I told ppl that I was recovering and out of the woods many times only next day or hour I would tell a complete opposite story! Stupid drugs!

with a bit more patinece, you will soon find you are feeling lots better and truely survived.

lex

August 24, 2017

Hi Lex.

Wow - you've had a very hard time of it too!!!

DR is horrible - I get glimpses of it here and there, but doesn't hang around for long - but it's very yuck when it hits.

ALL this time we're dealing with all these things, and yet the parts of our brains that give us pleasure and enjoyment and contentment in life are just SWITCHED OFF currently - so it makes it so much harder to endure.

I do think that the MAJORITY of my issues are W/D.

However, I have lost both my parents in the space of 5 years - all while I was on the stupid drugs (which I should not have ever been on in the first place!!!)

So I'm noticing some strange emotions - and feels like I'm trying to come to terms with my life without my parents anymore.

The loss and sorrow and emptiness it's left behind - was mostly masked by the drugs.

Again - not sure if I really HAVE processed it, or not, as it FEELS like I haven't fully.

BUT it's very very difficult, as you just can't seem to bring up happier memories in this state.

I'm nearly 4 months off Lexapro - in some ways feels longer, in others shorter.

I do think that I'm almost out of the ACUTE phase - where the fear and trauma feelings have slowly ebbed to the background - and front and centre is depression now.

I hear ya with what you said about your headache (mine being intense emotions) and how you think thats it - this is me forever!

AND a day later, can be different - and then an hour later different again.

ALL the while, your mind is being tricked.

I feel like I have aged so much in this process!!

August 24, 2017

4 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

Hi Lex.

Wow - you've had a very hard time of it too!!!

DR is horrible - I get glimpses of it here and there, but doesn't hang around for long - but it's very yuck when it hits.

ALL this time we're dealing with all these things, and yet the parts of our brains that give us pleasure and enjoyment and contentment in life are just SWITCHED OFF currently - so it makes it so much harder to endure.

I do think that the MAJORITY of my issues are W/D.

However, I have lost both my parents in the space of 5 years - all while I was on the stupid drugs (which I should not have ever been on in the first place!!!)

So I'm noticing some strange emotions - and feels like I'm trying to come to terms with my life without my parents anymore.

The loss and sorrow and emptiness it's left behind - was mostly masked by the drugs.

Again - not sure if I really HAVE processed it, or not, as it FEELS like I haven't fully.

BUT it's very very difficult, as you just can't seem to bring up happier memories in this state.

I'm nearly 4 months off Lexapro - in some ways feels longer, in others shorter.

I do think that I'm almost out of the ACUTE phase - where the fear and trauma feelings have slowly ebbed to the background - and front and centre is depression now.

I hear ya with what you said about your headache (mine being intense emotions) and how you think thats it - this is me forever!

AND a day later, can be different - and then an hour later different again.

ALL the while, your mind is being tricked.

I feel like I have aged so much in this process!!

Hi scottly ,I suggest putting a plan in place for grief because these drugs don't fix anything they just pour tonnes of concrete over our feelings ,learn to navigate the emotions ,these drugs actually rob us of normal human emotion .maybe interview a few therapists for the future and see if there background can help you navigate your feelings .[if we don't wont drugs a therapist needs to respect this ].

August 24, 2017

9 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

Updates.

Hiya all.

Was in a terrible depression yesterday - pretty much from the moment I woke up - wasn't aware of any specific thoughts that triggered it.

It's not like normal depression - if there even is such a thing...

I had a half day - took time off to go see daughter perform in a school concert performance against other schools.

Was at a different venue about an hour drive.

Was in a TERRIBLE low - sad, depressed, hopeless and totally joyless mood.

During the performance, I was numb and distant and felt totally alone - surround bystrangers.

I was sitting next to wife - and sat next to another Dad of one of my daughters friends - but she doesn't play with her anymore - so haven' tseen him in a while.

But this depressino really has robbed all sense of continuation and interest in me - so it's harder and harder to talk to people - as I feel I have very little to contribute to a conversation.

So even in the brighter spots, I struggle to remember what I was really into!!

Stuff reminds me - of how depressed I feel and down I go again.

When we got home last night, I struggled to maintain a happy face - had to put balloons and banners up for step-son's birthday today.

All I was feeling was sadness, emptiness and hollowness and felt alone - even in my family - but my FAMILY FEELS alone too.

IT"S just the depression talking, but it's all I'm hearing currently.

I was NOT like this pre-meds

I couldn't think of anything better than just chilling at home - being with my family - I felt complete and whole and content.

I was overwhelmed with stress sure, but I didn't have this chasm of despair in my heart.

I had an inner strength and identity...

I'd worry about silly things, and insecurities, but still had an inner place that was ok.

These drugs slowly erode that from you - and you don't know it, coz it's blunted!

It's only when you remove them do you notice whats been eroded.

I guess my question is - people talk about recovery and just wait it out etc...

does that eroded sense of self come back?

OR do we have to REBUILD it?

As the morning has gone on - I've felt a little bit lighter.

I'm still not letting this beat me - or define me.

I will be happy and content again!!

You've got to believe this depression is withdrawl related if you didn't have it before .I'm in the same boat and its horrendous ,but the one change Is I respect I'm sick [well trying ]and I take the help and care from loved ones .try not to worry about other people ,sure the dad beside could have anything going on in he's own mind .

We need to be practicing self compassion in this process .

If you sit back and read your post ,just look at what you did while depressed ,worked/daughters performance .

You see that's why depression is so insidious its like a dark spell ,my whole day consists of what better foods to eat and nutrition because our body's are using loads of energy to get through this ,just had my turmeric water and all I wanted to do was gag .

Take care and there's one thing for sure ,your not in this fight alone .

http://www.stressnomore.co.uk/health/sad-light-therapy/bright-light-therapy.html?utm_source=msn&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=light therapy lamps&utm_content=8887039939&utm_campaign=17330723596

I'm looking ahead for winter because of the depression and have a read up on this ,do your research so your comfortable before buying it .

Take care .

PB

August 24, 2017

Hi pB

We are in winter here in australia.

I can tell I'm not thinking straight.

My emotions are spiralling again.

Keeps feeling like I'm circling a traumatic event or vision or something..

But I never thought about this before WD kicked in.

That's what makes it hard to unravel between WD and grief.

It must be related.

I don't think it's just grief. It feels like I'm traumatised by the thought of so.ething.. of being abandoned and co.pletely alone.

Yet.. my life situation isn't totally new.

Same wife for 17 years.

I used to be very content just being at home with the wife.. I think subconsciously I knew my parents were there.. they would visit. And offer companionship.. and would offer a break to routine when we celebrate birthdays and Xmas.. as otherwise nobody would visit.. not family.

And that makes me feel like I can't cope.

Yet I'm still not enjoying just what I have.. always looking g over shoulder.. or seeing the blackness out the night window that's just lurking hiding waiting for me to drop my guard.

I feel unsafe with this.

It's weird.

Really weird.

Don't ever really remember this... Having lost my 2 parents my life has changed.

And I have started seeing a therapist. Although only 2 sessions in.. and I do seem to be circling around losing my dad.

Really feels like my whole life turned upside down in the WD.. and that I can't imagine how it'll feel good.

In saying that.. I asked myself would I feel better if dad was suddenly back... And strangely no. Maybe that means I've accepted his loss??

Or that my depression knows that being fully alone is my deepest fear... And it's just activating it???

And that it's not overly real.. and the feeling of isolation is just in my mind.. as I can't actually think of a way that I would feel better... Which tells me it's just lies!!

August 24, 2017

55 minutes ago, scottly9999 said:

Hi pB

We are in winter here in australia.

I can tell I'm not thinking straight.

My emotions are spiralling again.

Keeps feeling like I'm circling a traumatic event or vision or something..

But I never thought about this before WD kicked in.

That's what makes it hard to unravel between WD and grief.

It must be related.

I don't think it's just grief. It feels like I'm traumatised by the thought of so.ething.. of being abandoned and co.pletely alone.

Yet.. my life situation isn't totally new.

Same wife for 17 years.

I used to be very content just being at home with the wife.. I think subconsciously I knew my parents were there.. they would visit. And offer companionship.. and would offer a break to routine when we celebrate birthdays and Xmas.. as otherwise nobody would visit.. not family.

And that makes me feel like I can't cope.

Yet I'm still not enjoying just what I have.. always looking g over shoulder.. or seeing the blackness out the night window that's just lurking hiding waiting for me to drop my guard.

I feel unsafe with this.

It's weird.

Really weird.

Don't ever really remember this... Having lost my 2 parents my life has changed.

And I have started seeing a therapist. Although only 2 sessions in.. and I do seem to be circling around losing my dad.

Really feels like my whole life turned upside down in the WD.. and that I can't imagine how it'll feel good.

In saying that.. I asked myself would I feel better if dad was suddenly back... And strangely no. Maybe that means I've accepted his loss??

Or that my depression knows that being fully alone is my deepest fear... And it's just activating it???

And that it's not overly real.. and the feeling of isolation is just in my mind.. as I can't actually think of a way that I would feel better... Which tells me it's just lies!!

Ye these feelings and thoughts are horendous,withdrawl mimics an awful lot of horrible uncomfortable feelings.

Im writing from my phone on a walk and ive gone from feeling good in the sun to awful in a split second.

One day im glad of the peaceful surroundings to the next feeling cripiling loneliness ,but even strangers that say hi when walking past fills me with nice feelings so I welcome that .

Keep writing in a journal or on here get it out of your mind.

.I just walked past 3 men in there 80s up the hills and that fills me with hope .

We simply never give up .

Take care

PB

August 28, 2017

On 8/24/2017 at 9:34 PM, powerback said:

On 8/24/2017 at 8:29 PM, scottly9999 said:

Ye these feelings and thoughts are horendous,withdrawl mimics an awful lot of horrible uncomfortable feelings.

Im writing from my phone on a walk and ive gone from feeling good in the sun to awful in a split second.

One day im glad of the peaceful surroundings to the next feeling cripiling loneliness ,but even strangers that say hi when walking past fills me with nice feelings so I welcome that .

Keep writing in a journal or on here get it out of your mind.

.I just walked past 3 men in there 80s up the hills and that fills me with hope .

We simply never give up .

Take care

PB

Hi PB

When you said you felt crippling loneliness too - was that a recurring theme for you before you took anti-depressants???

I havent' had a good few days at all.

The depression is just relentless and exhausting and consuming.

I had a little bit of relief on Friday morning - but took Codeine for a headache, and think it was related to that.

had a sense of peace and calm - but again - thats what codeine can do.

I just keep thinking about how with no parents now (I'm 42 for goodness sake) thats it...

but I feel how much I've let my small family down - taking my wife from the UK (she has lost both her parents too)... and had 3 brothers.

So that we are 4 people stuck now.

Aaron step-son is 20 now and has a girlfriend - she visits regularly - we provide a very calm and quiet house - compared to her Mum place, and her Dad's place.

But I feel mostly that I've let Rose down - that I've doomed her to crippling loneliness if I should die, or worse, Vikki (she's exceptionally close to her) she loves me - but REALLY close to Vikki.

I DO hope this is just withdrawal bullsh*t.

I also read a new success story on SA over the weekend - about how the depression came back with a vengence and it LIES all the time - makes you think it's not worth it.

He also talked about fighting it.

So I've been reading The Happiness Trap which uses ACT - which is all about acceptance of feelings and emotions.

BUT as this is just unrelenting - I think this is not a positive thing.

I need to swap to CBT I think.

I picked up a PDF of a book I read years ago - but didn't get very far with it.

Feeling Good by Dr Burns (I can't help but think Mr Burns from the Simpsons)...

Flicked a few pages, and thought this is more along the tlines of what I need.

I try and find a way to PROVE the bullsh*t distorted thinking is crap.

I DID have issues like this years ago - had low-ish self esteem, compared myself negatively to others ALL the time - almost no matter what.

Everybody had bigger families than I did, everybody had a "life" and I was just bumbling around - no girlfriend - wasn't actively engaged in anything.

I feel like I've gone RIGHT BACK THERE... where I'm not even feeling the happiness of my lovely little family.

All I feel now is that Vikki isn't happy coz her her constant back pain, and worry about Rose (she might be on the autism spectrum)... and her diet is bad, as she's gluten free (diagnosed - not hippie! - ha ha)... and that she's now 12, and sort of getting a bit moody - so needs her Dad to be stable now.

Also Aaron is at an age where he's a bit aimless - and no idea what he wants to do in life, so he's a bit directional.

Feels like the EASY and SAFE days when they were all younger in school, are gone now.

That is a GUILT feeling isn't it - depression!

It's also got a LOT of hopelessness in it!! - depression.

Man this is the worst and unrelenting depression you can imagine.

Is this what people who get Chemotherapy go through?

When it's really CHEMICAL depression - as opposed to very specific thing.

All my insecurities - worries, fears, sadness - all mixed up together.

And VERY LITTLE to no joy coming from basic things.

I WAS in a good place before meds - enjoyed the simple things in life... I felt mostly calm and content a lot of the time.

I feel like I'm a wreck right now - that so much has gone wrong with me.

I'm still fighting this.

It's been really bad, but I'm not letting this win.

Somewhere - there is a way out of this mess.

August 28, 2017

2 hours ago, scottly9999 said:

Hi PB

When you said you felt crippling loneliness too - was that a recurring theme for you before you took anti-depressants???

I havent' had a good few days at all.

The depression is just relentless and exhausting and consuming.

I had a little bit of relief on Friday morning - but took Codeine for a headache, and think it was related to that.

had a sense of peace and calm - but again - thats what codeine can do.

I just keep thinking about how with no parents now (I'm 42 for goodness sake) thats it...

but I feel how much I've let my small family down - taking my wife from the UK (she has lost both her parents too)... and had 3 brothers.

So that we are 4 people stuck now.

Aaron step-son is 20 now and has a girlfriend - she visits regularly - we provide a very calm and quiet house - compared to her Mum place, and her Dad's place.

But I feel mostly that I've let Rose down - that I've doomed her to crippling loneliness if I should die, or worse, Vikki (she's exceptionally close to her) she loves me - but REALLY close to Vikki.

I DO hope this is just withdrawal bullsh*t.

I also read a new success story on SA over the weekend - about how the depression came back with a vengence and it LIES all the time - makes you think it's not worth it.

He also talked about fighting it.

So I've been reading The Happiness Trap which uses ACT - which is all about acceptance of feelings and emotions.

BUT as this is just unrelenting - I think this is not a positive thing.

I need to swap to CBT I think.

I picked up a PDF of a book I read years ago - but didn't get very far with it.

Feeling Good by Dr Burns (I can't help but think Mr Burns from the Simpsons)...

Flicked a few pages, and thought this is more along the tlines of what I need.

I try and find a way to PROVE the bullsh*t distorted thinking is crap.

I DID have issues like this years ago - had low-ish self esteem, compared myself negatively to others ALL the time - almost no matter what.

Everybody had bigger families than I did, everybody had a "life" and I was just bumbling around - no girlfriend - wasn't actively engaged in anything.

I feel like I've gone RIGHT BACK THERE... where I'm not even feeling the happiness of my lovely little family.

All I feel now is that Vikki isn't happy coz her her constant back pain, and worry about Rose (she might be on the autism spectrum)... and her diet is bad, as she's gluten free (diagnosed - not hippie! - ha ha)... and that she's now 12, and sort of getting a bit moody - so needs her Dad to be stable now.

Also Aaron is at an age where he's a bit aimless - and no idea what he wants to do in life, so he's a bit directional.

Feels like the EASY and SAFE days when they were all younger in school, are gone now.

That is a GUILT feeling isn't it - depression!

It's also got a LOT of hopelessness in it!! - depression.

Man this is the worst and unrelenting depression you can imagine.

Is this what people who get Chemotherapy go through?

When it's really CHEMICAL depression - as opposed to very specific thing.

All my insecurities - worries, fears, sadness - all mixed up together.

And VERY LITTLE to no joy coming from basic things.

I WAS in a good place before meds - enjoyed the simple things in life... I felt mostly calm and content a lot of the time.

I feel like I'm a wreck right now - that so much has gone wrong with me.

I'm still fighting this.

It's been really bad, but I'm not letting this win.

Somewhere - there is a way out of this mess.

Hi scottly ,OMG you have written and explained so many of my own fears and predicaments .

I never had this feeling of loneliness before ADs and its at its strongest this year ,totally connected to the madness of withdrawl .I wonder about my lifestyle since I was young and I was always on the go ,work ,pubs ,way to much partying .maybe subconsciously avoiding being alone [but I'm not sure ].

Don't judge the fact you feel lonely and thinking about your parents at this age ,its the dam madness of these disgusting drugs .

I'm putting a hold on any self help at this stage ,I think its impossible for me to retain anything so its mayor distraction for the next 7 months

.

I still live In my home town and its getting impossible to live here too many people and memories are ripping my brain apart ,I now travel a few days a week an hour each way for a walk so the fact I feel more at ease doing this makes me realise I mite have to leave,atleast for a year ,but my partner is having none of it .so its tricky what to do ,I haven't had the most productive life before withdrawl so its getting very tough to live with the demon critic in my head .with the symptoms I have I don't think I could even sign up for some charity work in foreign country's .#

OMG again scottly ,I'm the same with esteem and comparing myself also ,this has got terrible again the last while but I'm aware of it so I can distract [but still painful].

I had this terrible habit of going through the local paper and reading about people I knew and my mind would just compare about everything ,especially

the sport sections ,because I loved sports in school and tried most things but it never amounted to anything and then when alcohol came along at age 16 well that was the end of all that .I've been on this quest to understand why it was like that back then .

I'm realising the last 2 years I've had crippling anxiety my whole life and its basically destroyed any ability to have a normal life [painful feelings to admit but I believe it has to be approached if I never want meds again].so a total miss spent youth and young adult life .there was always this feeling of a want to do something and the ability to do it not connecting for me ,[dam this painful ]

Once kids get to certain age it can be hard to influence them to do anything so Aron will find he's own way you cant really control that ,take the pressure off yourself .aprentihips

I can well imagine the depression you have solidarity my friend ,its plagued me the whole year ,as dark as it gets ,your just coming out of winter I see,I'm getting my winter toolkit together because if its anything like the last it will be tough [depression].

take care my friend and keep up the fight

PB

August 28, 2017

14 hours ago, powerback said:

Hi scottly ,OMG you have written and explained so many of my own fears and predicaments .

I never had this feeling of loneliness before ADs and its at its strongest this year ,totally connected to the madness of withdrawl .I wonder about my lifestyle since I was young and I was always on the go ,work ,pubs ,way to much partying .maybe subconsciously avoiding being alone [but I'm not sure ].

Don't judge the fact you feel lonely and thinking about your parents at this age ,its the dam madness of these disgusting drugs .

I'm putting a hold on any self help at this stage ,I think its impossible for me to retain anything so its mayor distraction for the next 7 months

.

I still live In my home town and its getting impossible to live here too many people and memories are ripping my brain apart ,I now travel a few days a week an hour each way for a walk so the fact I feel more at ease doing this makes me realise I mite have to leave,atleast for a year ,but my partner is having none of it .so its tricky what to do ,I haven't had the most productive life before withdrawl so its getting very tough to live with the demon critic in my head .with the symptoms I have I don't think I could even sign up for some charity work in foreign country's .#

OMG again scottly ,I'm the same with esteem and comparing myself also ,this has got terrible again the last while but I'm aware of it so I can distract [but still painful].

I had this terrible habit of going through the local paper and reading about people I knew and my mind would just compare about everything ,especially

the sport sections ,because I loved sports in school and tried most things but it never amounted to anything and then when alcohol came along at age 16 well that was the end of all that .I've been on this quest to understand why it was like that back then .

I'm realising the last 2 years I've had crippling anxiety my whole life and its basically destroyed any ability to have a normal life [painful feelings to admit but I believe it has to be approached if I never want meds again].so a total miss spent youth and young adult life .there was always this feeling of a want to do something and the ability to do it not connecting for me ,[dam this painful ]

Once kids get to certain age it can be hard to influence them to do anything so Aron will find he's own way you cant really control that ,take the pressure off yourself .aprentihips

I can well imagine the depression you have solidarity my friend ,its plagued me the whole year ,as dark as it gets ,your just coming out of winter I see,I'm getting my winter toolkit together because if its anything like the last it will be tough [depression].

take care my friend and keep up the fight

PB

It does seem that we are all stuck in this confusing and empty existence - that when you THINK you enjoyed looking at some flowers - you're not really sure again.

It's a horrible messed up state to be in.

It's not just depression, or anxiety, it's an absence of self.

It's a real crysis of the soul.

You relive SO MANY painful memories and experiences.

It's literally as if the most messed up, saddest parts of your brain are playing endlessly in your head.

Yet the irony is really, that I've NOT lost THAT MANY things in my life - yes, i"ve lost my Mum and Dad - and thats big, but my brain is looking at everythign very nostalgically - with an air memorabilia and that NOBODY else CARES about the memories I have.

Why is that important to me?

Shouldn't it be enough THAT I CARE?

ANyway - back onto you - it seems YOU are feeling the exact same things I am - too many painful memories!!

But a lot of them aren't even painful memories - it seems as I've lost so much - maybe it's mourning the "lost time" on the drugs for 7 or so years and the passage of time???

I do suddenly feel pangs of regret that the kids are as old as they are already!

Aaron will be fine - He's a good lad.

He has good friends, an amazing girlfriend of 5 years (already!)

It seems that the withdrawal process puts our brains into SUPER MEGA EPIC depression mode.

It's about the most ultimately depressed you can be while still being able to function - just.

I never knew I had this much pain and sadness in me!!!!

Not giving up - not going to.

Going to have a crack at some CBT type books - needle out some bad thoughts and beliefs...

August 29, 2017

This is a great thread and I have learned so much. It is hard for me to tell what is the depression returning and what is w/d. I have been trying to non-drug things for withdrawal and depression. Some days are better than others. I wonder if that is the w/d alone and my other efforts don' really matter.

Unlike some people here, I started taking SSRIs because I had severe non-drug treatment resistant depression. I know some of you were given the drugs for headaches, pain other reasons or sometimes no reason at all. How can you tell the difference? I am just not sure what to do when the depression hits. The meds certainly didn't cure me and I was fairly depressed on the meds.

August 29, 2017

Scottly, you described it so precisely how these drugs twisted a human brain and the suffering it put a person into! We can tell ppl our physical pain and mental nonfunctional status, but these weird and torturous pshyc feelings are impossible for others to imagine even the tiniest part of it.

These me drugs are the most crazy thing ever created for any living thing of all forms! I remember reading the reaction of animals to the trial of these drugs ( and how those inventors discovered these drugs could treat depression, only if those animals can talk they would hear the terror effect of these poison). As I always say, this is the greater crime in human history! No life deserves such abuse!

This makes me more determine to go through whatever the suffering to get rid of the poison.

August 30, 2017

21 hours ago, JenJen said:

This is a great thread and I have learned so much. It is hard for me to tell what is the depression returning and what is w/d. I have been trying to non-drug things for withdrawal and depression. Some days are better than others. I wonder if that is the w/d alone and my other efforts don' really matter.

Unlike some people here, I started taking SSRIs because I had severe non-drug treatment resistant depression. I know some of you were given the drugs for headaches, pain other reasons or sometimes no reason at all. How can you tell the difference? I am just not sure what to do when the depression hits. The meds certainly didn't cure me and I was fairly depressed on the meds.

Hi JenJen

Yes - exactly what you said, it's so hard to tell what is W/D, and what is returning depression.

Do you mind me asking your age and if you've tried CBT and proper therapy before SSRI's??

They just blunt and mask SO MUCH of your inner psyche it's hard to know whats real, whats imagined, whats relived and whats unresolved in the mess of confusing emotions that gets dumped into your consciousness when you awaken from the SSRI slumber.

For me in particular I was (looking back) suffering a lot of depression and anxiety in my late teens and early 20's... from ages 19-22 or so... I wasn't in a good place mentally.

It wasn't anything in particular about my life situation - although being at home with Mum and Dad on my own and Mum's own mental health declining over the years - she was so doped out on anti-psych meds and was depressed and effectively a zombie - the feeling was palpable..

But I had no drive, no goals, no ambition - was a part time student, and fell into a yucky hole.

I can almost instantly recognize the feelings of what I'm going through esp the last month or so of my withdrawal currently (not the first 2 months)...

It feels almost as if I've been transported BACK to that time - which I never really thought of since.

I'm HOPING this is just the hippocampus playing tricks on me - but the feeling of hopelessness and dread is strong.

It's mixed in with a deep fear trigger of that I'm older now and haven't got time to be wasting and if there is something else - deeper - and darker that I can't relax because of.

I cannot quite put my finger on what that is - but it was growing inside even when I was on full dose of Lex - but in the poop out phase.

My life IS different to that time in my life 20 years ago.

I have friendships that date back - well... one of them, since I was 3-4 years old.

Another from about 30 years, another from 30 or so years too.

For the most part these are my current friends, so very deep relationships.

I've had friends come and go - but not a lot that was actively in touch with.

But feels like we've got busy with our lives, so we're not as ACTIVELY in each others lives as we used to be - not regularly with emails, or messages etc..

sort of some here and there..

I wonder how much of my blunted emotions and lack of MANY interests during my withdrawal and few years on the meds pre-wd is the blame??

Less to share, less to offer??

Two of my good mates live far away - like other side of world, and other - a plane trip away.

BUT we do see them here and there.

the other side of the world mate, is THINKING about relocating back here - with his wife and 2 young kids - that woudl be wonderful if they did!

It feels like the last 4 months, I keep reliving - not just remembering - but really reliving all the most painful moments in my life.

ALL of them, going through them over and over....

I seem to have a bit of a mild window currently, but even then, I can feel a "thing" thats lurking around the corner, just out of my minds eye.

Like some sort of deep fear - and for some reason it feels like my brain has connected all the dots and realized that my life currently resembles that greatest fear.

My brain keeps connecting the dots and MAKES it real, makes it the reality that I so fear.

Also the thing that seems to happen the most - is the parts of your brain - as I've touched on recently - how it evaporates your ability to enjoy little things, and happy moments, here and there - and how you string them together to form your identity... how it also manages to completely stuff up the part of your brain that is responsible for your self-esteem - it all seems linked into the fears and doubts and sadness... and all the reasons we have felt bad about ourselves, and our lives, and identity.

How it can affect something so deeply entrenched - your self worth?

It's incredible really.

How your brain and mind gets SO incredibly distorted while it's depressed - like really depressed - the convincing you do - as I said - the mind MAKES it real, makes it your reality.

It's not just a simple "drug", it changes literally how you think, how you relate, how you connect thoughts and emotions.

It just seems that we are bogged down in so much negative emotions, and it's almost impossible to elicite a positive emotion - that you cannot link into it, to build back.

You have to wait for those windows to shine in again.

As it's all our OWN memories and thoughts, and experience - it's impossible to know what is stuff that has come flashing into our minds that is unresolved issues from our past, stuff that needs to be let go of, accepted, passed through... or what is just simply being relived - and re-remembered???

We normally ONLY face negativity and sadness and fear when it's something that needs to be addressed - or experienced... and worked through.

It's so hard to accept that this is all here and not serving a specific purpose - other than our brains healing.

To me thats the hard part of this, is our brains aren't working the way we are used to them working...

And if you were on the SSRI's for long enough - you almost forget how our brain should be working - so many processes blunted and switched off to the point of unawareness.

I do wonder why we aren't flooded with HAPPY memories - I've thought about some times in my life that were happy - but they are tinged with a melancholy sadness - that tthat time has gone - never to be repeated.

As opposed to remembering it for what the memory is.

I do seem to have woken into a mild window - mind is thinking a bit quicker and clearer... mood more stable.

Feel a bit more normal.

It was strange to wake with it - but it's not a strong one. I'll take it!

I'm now reading even more books - re-reading a classic I read 20 years ago "the way of the peaceful warrior" again.

The movie was terrible and really didn't do it justice.

I certainly can't relate to the main character in terms of his youth and achievements etc.

But it has a good message of mindfulness - that everything we fear is in our minds.

We need to live in the moment... which is a repeating theme in so many of these books.

I was journaling, but it was just repeating, and very dark and not going anywwhere - it wasn't like I needed to express the sadness - but was stuck in ruminating and obsessing with it.

Decided I need to take more control and more action in my mind. To try and face these fears and inner demons - and try and get to a point where I can see them for what they really are - and move through them to the better me on the other side of this process.

Hope everybody gets a window!!!!!!!!!

August 30, 2017

On ‎29‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 4:23 AM, LexAnger said:

Scottly, you described it so precisely how these drugs twisted a human brain and the suffering it put a person into! We can tell ppl our physical pain and mental nonfunctional status, but these weird and torturous pshyc feelings are impossible for others to imagine even the tiniest part of it.

These me drugs are the most crazy thing ever created for any living thing of all forms! I remember reading the reaction of animals to the trial of these drugs ( and how those inventors discovered these drugs could treat depression, only if those animals can talk they would hear the terror effect of these poison). As I always say, this is the greater crime in human history! No life deserves such abuse!

This makes me more determine to go through whatever the suffering to get rid of the poison.

OMG lexAnger I so agree the crazy of the drugs .

This makes me more determine to go through whatever the suffering to get rid of the poison. I'm so glad to go alongside you with this quote .

what I got through the other night just makes me realise to keep going .

Hope you well

PB

August 30, 2017

On ‎29‎/‎08‎/‎2017 at 0:36 AM, scottly9999 said:

It does seem that we are all stuck in this confusing and empty existence - that when you THINK you enjoyed looking at some flowers - you're not really sure again.

It's a horrible messed up state to be in.

It's not just depression, or anxiety, it's an absence of self.

It's a real crysis of the soul.

You relive SO MANY painful memories and experiences.

It's literally as if the most messed up, saddest parts of your brain are playing endlessly in your head.

Yet the irony is really, that I've NOT lost THAT MANY things in my life - yes, i"ve lost my Mum and Dad - and thats big, but my brain is looking at everythign very nostalgically - with an air memorabilia and that NOBODY else CARES about the memories I have.

Why is that important to me?

Shouldn't it be enough THAT I CARE?

ANyway - back onto you - it seems YOU are feeling the exact same things I am - too many painful memories!!

But a lot of them aren't even painful memories - it seems as I've lost so much - maybe it's mourning the "lost time" on the drugs for 7 or so years and the passage of time???

I do suddenly feel pangs of regret that the kids are as old as they are already!

Aaron will be fine - He's a good lad.

He has good friends, an amazing girlfriend of 5 years (already!)

It seems that the withdrawal process puts our brains into SUPER MEGA EPIC depression mode.

It's about the most ultimately depressed you can be while still being able to function - just.

I never knew I had this much pain and sadness in me!!!!

Not giving up - not going to.

Going to have a crack at some CBT type books - needle out some bad thoughts and beliefs...

It's not just depression, or anxiety.

It's a real crysis of the soul.

I so agree with these scorpio .nice post ,you have it worded very well .

Hope you well today .

PB

success ☼ scottly9999: Lexapro nightmare

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