apace41: tapering Zoloft / sertraline

[apace41]

4 hours ago, Blondiee1915 said:

Just try to remember that there is nothing wrong with you health wise

'

Thanks for the visit, Blondiee.  As you know (health anxiety sufferer to health anxiety sufferer), sometimes easier said that done.  It's all part of the withdrawal as I NEVER had this so intensely prior to this process.

 

4 hours ago, Blondiee1915 said:

maybe your body is catching up to high stress situation on top of that

 

This is one possibility.  The other (in addition to food from last night) is that I take my liquid poison in a water bottle every day and drink the bottle with breakfast.  Then I refill it and take it in the car with me to work.  When I got to work yesterday I realized I didn't have my water bottle.  I don't know at what point it was when I left it, i.e., was it done but not yet refilled (I do that to make sure all the liquid from the sides is taken) or was it left somewhere in the middle of drinking the initial bottle and I missed a meaningful part of my normal dose.  No way to know but that could be a factor as well.

 

Anyway, thanks for your encouragement.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[apace41]

53 minutes ago, Shep said:

I'm sorry you've had such a horrible night, Andy. 

 

Thanks, Shep.  It was really not a pleasant time -- I have greater appreciation for the levels of suffering some experience.

 

54 minutes ago, Shep said:

perhaps you can figure out what it was so you can avoid it in the future

 

I had a lunch meeting and then we brought in kebabs for dinner.  I am wondering if I got some questionable meat or if it was something in the seasonings.  It could simply be that the stress of the night caused my GI system to react.  Hard to know.

 

Thanks as always, Shep.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Flowers]

Hi Andy

 

So sorry you had such an awful night. The nights are sooooo long when we are suffering! 

 

It is unfair and very cruel but hopefully this is just a blip and will settle soon. It's also very scary when these things flare up from nowhere. 

 

I am always trying to find an explanation when a wave hits so I can avoid it in the future. Unfortunately, I have never been able to pin anything down. I get stomach upsets during my waves but spicy food sometimes can be a trigger for me also. 

 

You may never know the reason  but you have always given good advice to me....... not to panic and stay as calm as possible. 

 

These weird feelings have got to be connected to WD so try not to worry about other illnesses. You have been through so much lately it might be catching up with you.

 

I hope you are more settled now and feel much better soon.  

 

In my thoughts.

 

Flowers xxx

 

 

[Dan998]

Hey, Andy.

 

You know there is a link between the brain and the gut. It has to do with our old friend serotonin. Quite often when we are anxious, nervous or excited our stomach is the first to know about it. That fluttering feeling that we are all too familiar with. I suppose it's feasible that this can work in reverse, where an upset stomach can trigger anxiety.

 

Personally, I think that anything that has a synapse attached to it can be affected by the drugs, or lack thereof. Unless it's broken or bleeding then it probably is withdrawal.

 

Hope it was just a dodgy kebab and that you're feeling better soon. 

 

BTW, totally agree about those pharma reps. They have far too many limbs.

[apace41]

On 8/12/2017 at 2:18 PM, Flowers said:

These weird feelings have got to be connected to WD so try not to worry about other illnesses. You have been through so much lately it might be catching up with you.

 

I think you are probably right, Flowers.  

 

Thanks for your visit. 

 

Best,

 

Andy

[apace41]

On 8/12/2017 at 7:37 PM, Dan998 said:

Hope it was just a dodgy kebab and that you're feeling better soon. 

 

Thanks, Dan.  Doing a little better so I'm thinking it was a blip of sorts.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[divalee]

Hello Andy

I am so sorry for your rough time -  you are in my thoughts and prayers -  you are always there for me and for so many others - just know that we are there for you too.

 

Love

Lee (f)

 

xxxx

[apace41]

Thanks so much, Lee.  I appreciate your coming by to say that.

 

I had that one bad night and things have leveled off since then so hopefully it was just a strange blip on the radar screen.

 

I hope you are doing as well as possible.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[elbee]

Good to hear things have leveled off for you a bit Andy. Go gently . . .

[apace41]

Thanks for stopping by, Elbee.  Every day is a new one it seems.  I never know from day to day how I will feel.  I'd love some positive patterns.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Marsha]

Hi Andy. I don't think I have stopped by yet. So saying hello, thank you,  and offering my best wishes for you. 

Take care.....fellow health anxiety sufferrer, Marsha.

[apace41]

1 hour ago, Marsha said:

fellow health anxiety sufferrer, Marsha

 

So, you know how much it sucks, Marsha.  I feel for you as well.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Marsha]

Yup. 

[apace41]

So, I've definitely fallen into a bad wave at this point.  I'm having rough sleep the past couple of weeks -- waking every couple of hours with anxiety, burning and tingling all over my my body.  Feeling very run down from the whole process.  The health anxiety has been really ratcheted up the past couple of days and I'm having a difficult time relaxing at all.  The fight or flight system is locked in "high" gear.  When I feel like this it is really hard to get any traction from the self-soothing techniques, try as I might.

 

I continue to hold at 14mg but it is very disconcerting.  I recognize that withdrawal causes bad thought patterns to emerge but it is really hard as I sit here right now to see the end of this process.  I feel totally and completely stuck and like I've been on a slow, inexorable slide downward.

 

Sorry for the downer but I'm really struggling today.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Shep]

Hi, Andy.

 

Sorry to hear about such a brutal wave, especially added on top of grief and battle fatigue from being sick for several years now.

 

Are you able to take some time off from work? I know you recently took a couple of weeks for your father-in-law's passing, but do you feel that a couple of weeks to rest would help? 

 

That's the only non-drug coping technique I can think of other than the usual "float" and "breathe" your way through this wave. 

 

It will get better. It's hard to see that when you're in the thick of the storm, so please believe those of us who are out of the storm and farther along.

 

I am concerned that you may be taking on too much for someone who is sick and may need to plan some breaks from work to rest more, if that's possible. 

 

Sending healing vibes your way. I hope this wave passes soon. 

[Flowers]

Hi Andy

 

So sorry to hear this. You normally seem to take everything quietly in your stride so I know it must be bad if you are posting here.

 

I was in the same place as you are right now a few weeks ago. Different symptoms but anxiety/cortisol driven. There wasn't anything I could do to relax - so I understand when you say there is little you can do to help yourself when things get this bad.

 

At that time you told me that I would heal but time was a great factor in our healing. You are so right and it will be the same for you. 

 

Sometimes an intense wave comes along and completely wipes us out and all we can think of is the doom and gloom. But it will pass and you will have a window again. I did!

 

I hope you are not overdoing it working all hours and still trying to carry on as normal whilst in this wave. 

 

Sometimes the only way to get some relief is to give in to it and rest as much as you can, especially if you are not sleeping well. 

 

I am thinking of you and sending positive vibes over the miles that you see some improvement very soon.

 

Please post and let us know how you are doing.

 

Love and hugs from Flowers xxx

[apace41]

1 minute ago, Shep said:

Are you able to take some time off from work? I know you recently took a couple of weeks for your father-in-law's passing, but do you feel that a couple of weeks to rest would help? 

 

Thanks for responding, Shep.  I will be taking a couple of days off next week but that's only to move my daughter into her college apartment (complete with a 7-8 hour drive).  I don't know about taking more time off.  As you referenced, I've been off a lot of late and it starts to get hard to take more time.  If I absolutely have to I will but I'm hoping this will settle down.  The hardest part, which I did not mention, is that I had a day or two where things were "less crappy" around the weekend and I was hoping that the hold was going to start to really take effect.  Getting slammed back down is so demoralizing.

 

4 minutes ago, Shep said:

It will get better. It's hard to see that when you're in the thick of the storm, so please believe those of us who are out of the storm and farther along.

 

Yes.  I know.  I hear that but, as you say, in the middle of the battle it is hard to see out. Thank you for the reminder.

5 minutes ago, Shep said:

I am concerned that you may be taking on too much for someone who is sick and may need to plan some breaks from work to rest more, if that's possible. 

 

This is the fallout from nobody really understanding and me having given up on trying to get them to do so.  My family has the same level of expectation of me that always existed and I am caught between trying to satisfy their needs and mine.  Add to that the notion of guilt that comes along with me not doing what "I'm supposed to do" and it's a recipe for elongation of the wave.

 

Thanks for your care and concern, Shep.  I will try to make time for myself in this process.

 

Best,

 

Andy

 

P.S.  The following is so good to see.  You ARE farther along and while I wish I was I'm thrilled for you.

 

23 minutes ago, Shep said:

those of us who are out of the storm and farther along.

 

[apace41]

10 minutes ago, Flowers said:

At that time you told me that I would heal but time was a great factor in our healing. You are so right and it will be the same for you. 

 

Sometimes an intense wave comes along and completely wipes us out and all we can think of is the doom and gloom. But it will pass and you will have a window again. I did!

 

Thanks, Flowers. I appreciate your holding up the mirror of my words to me.

 

11 minutes ago, Flowers said:

I am thinking of you and sending positive vibes over the miles that you see some improvement very soon.

 

You are a love.

 

Thank you,

 

Andy

[Blondiee1915]

Hi Andy,  

 

Hope it will start to get better for you soon.  I so understand the doom and gloom and how we have to continue on with responsibilities and other expectations of us .  It is definetly challenging and can be a struggle.  But we have to continue on and what is that saying ? 'Fake it until you make it' .   I think you are so strong and doing incredibly well.  You are working full time and providing and taking care of your loved ones.  That is a lot .  I try too not to be judgmental and question my abilities in doing or not doing certain things, and have to remind myself I am doing the best I can .  

I also think sometimes stress and anxiety creep up and trigger things after a certain stressful event passes (this is based on personal experience).  I had some family drama on Wednesday and was so upset Wednesday and Thursday but my symptoms were okayish then 3 -5 days later I am getting slammed with brain fog,  bad dp and dr, this anxiety and breathing difficulties and nausea.  I am thinking why am I reacting this way when the upsetting thing happened some days ago ? But I think my body is catching up or something of that nature .  Perhaps the loss of the family member and its impact on your well being is still effecting your nervous system.   

 

B 

[apace41]

26 minutes ago, Blondiee1915 said:

Perhaps the loss of the family member and its impact on your well being is still effecting your nervous system.

 

This is a great point, Blondiee.  I think that may well be a big part of what is going on.  

 

Thanks so much for your visit.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Shep]

4 hours ago, apace41 said:

This is the fallout from nobody really understanding and me having given up on trying to get them to do so.  My family has the same level of expectation of me that always existed and I am caught between trying to satisfy their needs and mine.  Add to that the notion of guilt that comes along with me not doing what "I'm supposed to do" and it's a recipe for elongation of the wave.

 

Forgive me, but I'm going to play devil's advocate here, Andy. Who is it that defines what you're "supposed to do"? Or what any of us is supposed to do?

 

Sometimes asking for help and taking a step back is what we need to do in order to survive withdrawal and to prevent waves. 

 

And sometimes when we step back, it encourages others to step forward. And this may be exactly what they need. Perhaps that can help with the guilt factor. 

 

Just some thoughts, as I'm concerned you still have a couple more years of dealing with some difficult waves and learning to pace yourself (even if it means "training" those around you to do a little more), may be necessary. During withdrawal, we are not as strong as we were before, so keeping up with prior levels of expectations may simply be too much. It's not your fault, you didn't ask for this. 

 

 

4 hours ago, apace41 said:

 I will try to make time for myself in this process.

 

This should be on your non-drug coping skills list as a "non-negotiable". I believe withdrawal happens in part to teach us things we wouldn't otherwise learn. And learning how to delegate and to say "no" may be something that withdrawal is trying to teach you.

 

I found out it's best to listen to these symptoms-as-teachers before withdrawal ramps up the teaching process and the end result is being completely incapacitated. The SSRI / benzo combo is one of the most difficult combinations of drugs to withdrawal from, so please take good care of yourself. Many people have destroyed their nervous systems during the withdrawal process, but I do believe that withdrawal comes with a kind of "check engine" light just like the light that comes on in your car when something is wrong. The car still runs, but you know you need to go to the mechanic and find out what's wrong. 

 

From what you're writing (and have been writing for awhile now), your "check engine" light is on. And that may be the scary part because we don't always want to slow down and look into things. A lot of times, it's simply easier to keep busy.

 

So perhaps when you do take time for yourself, schedule something that you like to do, especially if you need to keep your mind busy. 

 

I would really encourage you to formally schedule in at least a day or two a month for some "Andy time". I really believe in the long run, it will speed up healing. And really, is that too much to ask of the people around you, especially with as much as you do? 

 

Heal first and then you can get back to living life at that "level of expectation" that you and your family have grown accustomed to. 

 

Okay, I'm getting off my soap box now. 

 

[bubble]

I needed to hear that too Shep.

 

Andy, does it really have to be you to move your daughter into her college apartment? I would think there would be some services who could do that... what if your leg was broken or you had a concussion or something similar? Would you still do it?

 

I fully agree with Shep that WD is trying to teach you to prioritise yourself and let go off other people's expectations (which are actually our own expectations). I need to learn the same lesson and boy am I a slow student...

 

And you are so hostile to my dear friend holding It can't fix you in no time but believe me, it's doing you lots of good.

 

Try to change the perspective: instead of looking at how much you still have to go, look at how much you have accomplished: got off one drug and taking so much less of the other!

[apace41]

Shep and Bubble,

 

My dear friends and colleagues.  I SO appreciate your coming here and being straight up and providing a dose of reality.  You are, of course, right that the best way to survive withdrawal is to take a step back when the need arises.  I certainly can't argue with that.  I have, unfortunately, allowed myself to get into a situation where I have certain obligations that I HAVE SIGNED ON FOR and changing them at this point will be rather difficult.  Having said that, I fully intend to take steps to make it easier on myself than it would be ordinarily, e.g., I have requested my daughter line up some of her guy friends to help lift some of the heavier stuff in the move.  

 

The challenge is in part due the fact that I was in a slight wave for the better part of the past week to ten days but saw some improvement over the weekend so I did not see a reason to change up the plans.  Then last night into today I got hit hard and that prompted my post this morning looking for some comforting words.  I recognize the truth in the notion that I need to learn to say "no" a little better.  I DO however block out some time for myself, Shep.  Now if I could only feel human enough to enjoy that time...!

 

1 hour ago, Shep said:

 

From what you're writing (and have been writing for awhile now), your "check engine" light is on.

 

This is true but, like most, I suspect I am guilty of coming here and writing most often when I am suffering.  I have been good at monthly updates but the inbetween posts are usually when things suck.  So, while it is true that my "check engine" light is on, I have been checking it from time to time -- this was more of a "run out of gas" situation I think, i.e., it came on suddenly rather than a slower build up.  All this is to say that I appreciate your words, will take them to heart, and will do more to apply them on a go forward basis. While pushing through the next week might cause some modest regression, I think I will be okay with a little rest along the way.

 

1 hour ago, bubble said:

And you are so hostile to my dear friend holding It can't fix you in no time but believe me, it's doing you lots of good.

 

I am counting on that, Bubble!  And, just to be clear, I'm holding you personally responsible if it doesn't help me!  

 

For the record, I am not hostile -- just tired and wish this was all in my rear view mirror (enough with the car references).

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Dan998]

Andy, 

 

I have no advice to offer that hasn't already been given. I just wanted to let you know; that storms always pass and the tide always goes out. 

 

Hope you feel better soon mate.

[Frogie]

Hi Andy:

 

I read your post and I'm sorry to hear you aren't feeling well.

 

I just wanted to stop by and say hi and hope you are better soon.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[apace41]

Just now, Frogie said:

I just wanted to stop by and say hi and hope you are better soon.

 

Thanks, Frogie.  Very kind of you.

 

I hope things get sorted out with your partial and your virus and that you get some rest. 

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Frogie]

Just now, apace41 said:

 

Thanks, Frogie.  Very kind of you.

 

I hope things get sorted out with your partial and your virus and that you get some rest. 

 

Best,

 

Andy

You just worry about yourself.

 

My problems are resolving themselves, thank goodness.

 

You get some much needed rest.

 

Take care,

Frogie xx

[apace41]

22 hours ago, Dan998 said:

Hope you feel better soon mate.

 

Thanks for the visit and kind words, Dan.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[Junglechicken]

Hi Andy,

 

Just stopping by to say hello.

 

I know you're in a bad wave and are also dealing with health anxiety.  

 

These go hand in hand and are emotionally very draining.

 

You will make it through this wave, but I wondered if your alternative practitioner had mentioned anything to you about "Herbal tinctures"?  Reason I ask is because I have found these VERY effective at calming the entire nervous system right down.

 

I was reacting to everything but not these.

 

Best,

JC

 

 

[apace41]

23 hours ago, Junglechicken said:

I know you're in a bad wave and are also dealing with health anxiety.  

 

These go hand in hand and are emotionally very draining.

 

Thanks for visiting, JC.  Yes on both counts. Been VERY bad the last few days.  Lots of pain coming and going and anxious thought patterns along with them. Not in a good place right now.  Must be accumulation of factors as there's no one thing I can point to as being responsible.  

 

23 hours ago, Junglechicken said:

 

You will make it through this wave, but I wondered if your alternative practitioner had mentioned anything to you about "Herbal tinctures"?  Reason I ask is because I have found these VERY effective at calming the entire nervous system right down.

 

My doctor is a functional medicine doc as opposed to a naturopath.  I don't know if he has any experience with tinctures but I see him this week and will ask.  

 

I could really use a window about now.

 

Thanks, JC.

 

Besr,

 

Andy

 

 

[apace41]

Well, the fun just keeps on coming!  I've been struggling with sleep of late and had the dreaded washout last night. Up all night with tons of cortisol surges and myoclonic jerking.  I guess things have caught up with me and my system is shutting down and my CNS is saying "NFW".  

 

Now, if only I could really manage that acceptance thing so that I could just float through all this.  Unfortunately, it still needs a lot of work.  Pain triggers health anxiety which triggers pain.  Wash, rinse, repeat.

 

This feels like a winner take all fight and I'm on the wrong side at the moment.

 

Hope all are doing well.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Edited August 27, 2017 by apace41

[Shep]

Hi, Andy. There's a three-day weekend coming up next weekend for Labor Day. I hope you get a chance to rest.

 

It's always best to listen when the CNS says "NFW".  

 

Sending healing vibes your way. 

[bubble]

I was forced into doing a lot of acceptance practice recently. A major meltdown. I know how you feel: it always feels like the first time.

 

Each time we have to dig in deep for more strength and endurance. I think your acceptance has increased a lot! I for one would be mad with fear about all those symptoms. Now I know they will pass. It's still far from easy but it's a lot different.

 

You floated through them the whole night. Maybe the moves where not as graceful as you would want them to be but you did it!

 

I'm hoping for a peaceful night! You've had enough practice!

[Flowers]

Hi Andy

 

I wish I could make this go away for you but the only thing I can do is offer you words of comfort and encouragement.

 

So sorry things are not going well for you. When you can't sleep are you able to concentrate enough to read something? Sometimes when I can't sleep I am so ramped up with anxiety that I can't do anything but lay there and worry about everything. Other times I do manage to distract myself by reading.  I have my current book on the bedside table ready! 

 

What else can you do to distract and relax? Listen to music, watch a favourite film. I expect you have thought of all of this already!

 

Where is your pain?  Can you try some magnesium oil on it? 

 

This is hard and scary sometimes but you will get through it. You have before. I have before. Hold on to that thought my friend.

 

Love from Flowers xxx

 

 

[apace41]

5 hours ago, Shep said:

Hi, Andy. There's a three-day weekend coming up next weekend for Labor Day. I hope you get a chance to rest.

 

Thanks, Shep.  Other than one lunch on Friday it will be a 4-day weekend so I hope to get some good relaxation time.  It's been a rough couple of weeks -- hoping to see some stabilization soon.

 

Hope you are well.

 

Best,

 

Andy

[apace41]

3 hours ago, bubble said:

I was forced into doing a lot of acceptance practice recently. A major meltdown. I know how you feel: it always feels like the first time.

 

Yes.  The withdrawal brain has a hard time learning from experience.

 

3 hours ago, bubble said:

Each time we have to dig in deep for more strength and endurance. I think your acceptance has increased a lot! I for one would be mad with fear about all those symptoms. Now I know they will pass. It's still far from easy but it's a lot different.

 

I was more pissed than scared. I read through the list of symptoms on Recovery Road and I was feeling like "hey, I've had most of these!" which irritated the crap out of me.  But it is anything but easy.

 

3 hours ago, bubble said:

You floated through them the whole night. Maybe the moves where not as graceful as you would want them to be but you did it!

 

More like repeated "almost drownings".  Not graceful at all. But I appreciate your putting it in a good light.

 

Thanks as always, Bubble.

 

Best,

 

Andy

Edited August 27, 2017 by apace41