Schmeg82 Paxil withdrawal and taper after 21 years

[Catwoman73]

41 minutes ago, Schmeg82 said:

I spoke way to soon yesterday, felt horrible in the later evening, and woke up feeling terrible again this am.  Have been consistently very shaky/tremors & weak as well as fighting a headache today.  Been laying down for a while, there’s a small hurricane coming anyway so it’s been raining off and on.  

 

I'm sorry to hear, @Schmeg82.  And @Willy.  It seems we're all a giant mess lol... I was feeling better this morning, but I'm back in bed now.  It is what it is... I'm just trying to roll with it.  I was quite weepy last night though.  No matter how calm and optimistic I am, it all gets under my skin sometimes.  We will all heal... so very grateful we all have this forum and each other. ❤️

[Schmeg82]

27 minutes ago, Willy said:

I’ve been terrible again today. Severe depression, anxiety, shakes, tinnitus, nausea, dizzy and more.

 

Hope we get relief soon!

We will! At some point it’s got to give!  I’ve had windows and you will too.

[Schmeg82]

2 minutes ago, Catwoman73 said:

 

I'm sorry to hear, @Schmeg82.  And @Willy.  It seems we're all a giant mess lol... I was feeling better this morning, but I'm back in bed now.  It is what it is... I'm just trying to roll with it.  I was quite weepy last night though.  No matter how calm and optimistic I am, it all gets under my skin sometimes.  We will all heal... so very grateful we all have this forum and each other. ❤️

I am definitely a mess!  I’m just happy I’m “well” enough to enjoy my animals when I can, and do small things now.  I do love the comfort of my bed with a good book and tv but not this much lol.  I know lighter days are coming again for us all.  I cried last night also, it’s good to cry and let it out.  

[Schmeg82]

This evening I still felt bad, I had a nice two hour nap but woke up absolutely drenched.  I have this feeling like my brain is just not getting enough oxygen to function, that’s kind of what this feels like.  Like my eyes don’t work right, and then I get bad eye pain and headaches every night when I go out and try to do things.  I still have tremors bad too.  Sometimes the head pain is associated with air hunger.  Especially when I get home and lay down.  I have learned to ignore these symptoms and go on with daily tasks but it’s very hard.  
 

I bathed all 3 horses tonight, I just wanted to keep myself busy and not think about how bad I felt.  Felt good to do something else productive today besides lay in bed, and I spent 2.5 hours outside with my animals which keeps me happy.  

[Schmeg82]

Well we’ve had some storms from the feeder bands of the hurricane passing over the other side of the state.  I still had farm duty and cleaned the whole barn/everyone’s stalls yesterday and this morning.  It’s storming off and on today, was muddy out this Morning, I was a little dizzy, weak and shaky but my mood was much lighter and I was able to complete all my work.  No morning anxiety either or sweats when I woke up.  Planning on reading in bed a lot today since it’s storming on and off still.  Will be back out to feed horses & donkeys this evening again.  

[Willy]

Glad you’ve had some better days

[Schmeg82]

Just now, Willy said:

Glad you’ve had some better days

Thank you.  I wouldn’t call them better days I pretty much just power through these symptoms.  I guess it could be worse though.   How are you feeling?  You get any bad weather down there? Not bad here at all

[Willy]

15 minutes ago, Schmeg82 said:

Thank you.  I wouldn’t call them better days I pretty much just power through these symptoms.  I guess it could be worse though.   How are you feeling?  You get any bad weather down there? Not bad here at all

Don’t feel great but symptoms are bearable right now though we know how quickly that can change. Today was my second dose reduction. 
 

Weather not too bad. Breezy and cloudy

[Schmeg82]

I do have a question - has anyone’s lips turned pale/bluish? During withdrawal?  I have low iron but I’ve never had pale bluish/purple lips before.  This has happened several times and a lot lately.  Is this a common WD symptom?  My hemoglobin is usually 12-13 ish and ferritin was 19 last reading.  I’m wondering if my iron is plummeting also.  I’m tired of going back to the doctors though.  @Catwoman73 @LostInCanada 

[LostInCanada]

@Schmeg82 my iron and ferritin are fine but at the base of my fingernails I often am blue as well as my feet. I have had my circulation checked and it has been fine. It can be from lack of oxygen and so try to be conscious of breathing deeply. I notice I don't when I am anxious or stressed.

[Schmeg82]

18 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

@Schmeg82 my iron and ferritin are fine but at the base of my fingernails I often am blue as well as my feet. I have had my circulation checked and it has been fine. It can be from lack of oxygen and so try to be conscious of breathing deeply. I notice I don't when I am anxious or stressed.

Yes I’m wondering if I need to start taking iron and b12 again was just trying to avoid it because my stomach was such a mess for a while, but I’m back to normal now.  I don’t necessarily feel out of breathe when this happens either so no idea why unless it’s just a part of WD.

[LostInCanada]

Both these supplements can cause a flare up in symptoms. If you decide to take them, start one at a time, very small doses to begin with. 

It is preferable to eat iron rich foods instead. Some forms of iron are easier to tolerate as well. Do a google search to see which ones. Also Methylcobalamin is a less reactive type of B12 to take.

[Schmeg82]

7 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

Both these supplements can cause a flare up in symptoms. If you decide to take them, start one at a time, very small doses to begin with. 

It is preferable to eat iron rich foods instead. Some forms of iron are easier to tolerate as well. Do a google search to see which ones. Also Methylcobalamin is a less reactive type of B12 to take.

Yes ma’am, I need to find a gentler iron on my stomach.  I have actually taken b12 in withdrawal and was fine, I find it helps my lethargy as well.  I am deficient and b12 deficiency can also cause neuro symptoms.  My body doesn’t absorb vitamins and nutrients like it should be, not sure why, I’ve had tons of testing but I never have.  

[Catwoman73]

46 minutes ago, Schmeg82 said:

I do have a question - has anyone’s lips turned pale/bluish? During withdrawal?  I have low iron but I’ve never had pale bluish/purple lips before.  This has happened several times and a lot lately.  Is this a common WD symptom?  My hemoglobin is usually 12-13 ish and ferritin was 19 last reading.  I’m wondering if my iron is plummeting also.  I’m tired of going back to the doctors though.  @Catwoman73 @LostInCanada 

 

Not from withdrawal, but this happens to me regularly with long covid. 

 

In your case, it is likely connected to your low iron stores.  You may have to start taking iron, even though I know it worries you.  I know it's not typically recommended here, but cyanosis is concerning, and would represent some seriously low iron stores.  It does seem like you don't absorb your nutrients well, and for people like that, food sources are sometimes just not enough.  I totally agree that you should start low and go slow.  Iron bisglycinate tends to be easiest on the stomach, but you will have to take vitamin c with it for optimal absorption. 

[LostInCanada]

Methyl cobalamin is the form of B12 they give to people who can't absorb the synthetic usual junk they use.

 

[Schmeg82]

2 hours ago, Catwoman73 said:

 

Not from withdrawal, but this happens to me regularly with long covid. 

 

In your case, it is likely connected to your low iron stores.  You may have to start taking iron, even though I know it worries you.  I know it's not typically recommended here, but cyanosis is concerning, and would represent some seriously low iron stores.  It does seem like you don't absorb your nutrients well, and for people like that, food sources are sometimes just not enough.  I totally agree that you should start low and go slow.  Iron bisglycinate tends to be easiest on the stomach, but you will have to take vitamin c with it for optimal absorption. 

I have simply heme iron here, I ordered it and never took it. I wonder if I should start it.  I can take vitamin C that usually doesn’t bother me.  I’m just wondering why sometimes my lips go blue and pale and then a couple hours later they are back to normal 🤷🏼‍♀️  I told my husband I wanted steak for dinner tonight too lol.  So steak on the grill it is 🤤 

 

I need to go get more bloodwork again I guess, my pcp is probably getting annoyed with me.  

[Schmeg82]

Very dizzy, sick feeling, air hunger kind of/upper gi tightness/throat tightness, eyes were flashing bad bad last night.  Sick reading screens or looking around.  Very depressed today.  Feel like this is never going to end, month 8 and I’ve lost so much of my life.  Scared this is going to get worse as I start to taper.

[Willy]

19 minutes ago, Schmeg82 said:

Very dizzy, sick feeling, air hunger kind of/upper gi tightness/throat tightness, eyes were flashing bad bad last night.  Sick reading screens or looking around.  Very depressed today.  Feel like this is never going to end, month 8 and I’ve lost so much of my life.  Scared this is going to get worse as I start to taper.

I’m really sorry this is happening to us. I’m also terrified that things will get worse since I just started tapering and was in wd before the taper.  I don’t know how or when this will end but if I get worse I’m not sure I can handle it. It’s not fair that the Dr gets away with ruining peoples lives. I’m trying to get through each hour at this point desperately hoping for a better day. 
 

All we can do is stay alive long enough for the body to heal. Please keep up the fight! 

[Schmeg82]

Just now, Willy said:

I’m really sorry this is happening to us. I’m also terrified that things will get worse since I just started tapering and was in wd before the taper.  I don’t know how or when this will end but if I get worse I’m not sure I can handle it. It’s not fair that the Dr gets away with ruining peoples lives. I’m trying to get through each hour at this point desperately hoping for a better day. 
 

All we can do is stay alive long enough for the body to heal. Please keep up the fight! 

I know it’s easy to say I can’t take this anymore but in reality I can and I will, it just really sucks.  I’m not going to let a medication take me out that’s for darn sure.  
 

it may be hard at first but since we are both in poop out I feel like we may get some relief also coming down on doses.  I would just really like for my vision symptoms to subside a tiny bit and I’d be much happier.  I could handle a lot of the other symptoms - or manage them better.  I’ll pray for us both. 

[RachelSusan]

@Schmeg82 I hope you feel better soon. Sadly it is very slow going. 

[Catwoman73]

3 hours ago, Schmeg82 said:

Very dizzy, sick feeling, air hunger kind of/upper gi tightness/throat tightness, eyes were flashing bad bad last night.  Sick reading screens or looking around.  Very depressed today.  Feel like this is never going to end, month 8 and I’ve lost so much of my life.  Scared this is going to get worse as I start to taper.

 

So sorry to hear, @Schmeg82.  Sounds like a nasty wave, and as you know, all waves do come to an end!

 

This may not get worse as you start to taper... it may actually get better.  You won't know until you try.  Just hang in there!  

[Schmeg82]

4 hours ago, Catwoman73 said:

 

So sorry to hear, @Schmeg82.  Sounds like a nasty wave, and as you know, all waves do come to an end!

 

This may not get worse as you start to taper... it may actually get better.  You won't know until you try.  Just hang in there!  

I’m hoping that’s the case or my withdrawal symptoms at least ease as I go.  I was fed up and went for a drive to the corner store today and drove around the neighborhoods for a while, I had to get bottled water anyway and then I went to a friends house to chat for a couple hours, I didn’t feel the Best But I refuse to be a prisoner of this house.  

[Schmeg82]

6 hours ago, RachelSusan said:

@Schmeg82 I hope you feel better soon. Sadly it is very slow going. 

Thank you.  Definitely slow 😞

[Schmeg82]

So I’m trying to find the best way to start my taper right now, I did reach out to a few tapering coaches online to get prices for tapering help but have not heard back yet.  I know @LostInCanada gave me some really good tapering advice so I’m going to look back at previous responses and see which seems easiest to do for me.  My withdrawal coach would like me to start with a 1-3% decrease first and see how I do, I feel like this is a good plan for me.  I guess it’s time to order a scale and figure out how to do this.  Crossing my fingers it helps more than it hurts! 

[Schmeg82]

On 7/9/2024 at 1:34 PM, LostInCanada said:

 

Yes so 10 x 0.0125= 0.125. So week one would be 10- 0.125= 9.875/ week 2 would be 9.875- 0.125 = 9.75/ week 3 is 9.75-0.125=9.625/ week 4 is 9.625-0.125=9.5 Then a 2 week hold. At any time you can hold if having an increase in symptoms. 

 

The next drop calculations start with 9.5 x 0.0125= 0.118

 

So I would weigh and crush them

 

LostInCanada

Replied: 9 minutes ago

 

You just take your 10 mg pill and make your liquid from that. Say 10 mg pill with 10 ml water. Then just draw up 9.875 ml on the syringe. It depends on the lines on the syringe. It might be 9.9 or 9.8 and you would adjust your next drop accordingly. The smaller the syringe the more accurate so you could use a smaller syringe to do a partial dose with a bigger syringe doing the larger amount. 

 

The tricky part is going from pill to liquid. That transition needs to happen before starting the taper. 

 

 

This seems like it would be the easiest for me, now I need to find a scale I can weigh these small amounts with and a syringe.  
 

someone also mentioned using maple syrup to use as a binder? Anyone heard of this?  

When I start making my liquid with my 10mg how long should I give it before I start my first drop.

[LostInCanada]

So you want to slowly transition from pill to liquid.

The recommended ratio of water to pill is 2:1. So for 10 mg of pill you need 20 ml of water. Let dissolve thoroughly and the refrigerate for a maximum of 3 days. Maple syrup is not necessary. Just shake well before drawing up the liquid. Paroxetine is fully dissolvable. If anything doesn't dissolve it is just filler or coating. Some crush the pill between 2 spoons to aid in dissolving.

A 10 mg pill will weigh more due to filler. Mine weigh 118.4 mg for example. 

 

4-7 days of 2.5 mg(5ml at the above ratio) of liquid form and 7.5 mg of actual drug in pill form

4-7 days of 5 mg(10ml) of liquid/5 mg pill

4-7 days of 7.5 mg(15 ml) of liquid/ 2.5 mg pill

Then full liquid dose of 20 ml.

I would suggest holding a month at this point to make sure the transition is going well. 

If all is well, then start to taper. 

 

 

[Catwoman73]

I'm excited and hopeful for you, Schmeg!  ❤️

[Schmeg82]

I’m also searching for a video that someone posted about shaving your pills down and weighing them? I believe it was on this site @LostInCanada 

[Schmeg82]

1 hour ago, LostInCanada said:

So you want to slowly transition from pill to liquid.

The recommended ratio of water to pill is 2:1. So for 10 mg of pill you need 20 ml of water. Let dissolve thoroughly and the refrigerate for a maximum of 3 days. Maple syrup is not necessary. Just shake well before drawing up the liquid. Paroxetine is fully dissolvable. If anything doesn't dissolve it is just filler or coating. Some crush the pill between 2 spoons to aid in dissolving.

A 10 mg pill will weigh more due to filler. Mine weigh 118.4 mg for example. 

 

4-7 days of 2.5 mg(5ml at the above ratio) of liquid form and 7.5 mg of actual drug in pill form

4-7 days of 5 mg(10ml) of liquid/5 mg pill

4-7 days of 7.5 mg(15 ml) of liquid/ 2.5 mg pill

Then full liquid dose of 20 ml.

I would suggest holding a month at this point to make sure the transition is going well. 

If all is well, then start to taper. 

 

 

Did you have any issues going from pill to making your own liquid?

[LostInCanada]

7 minutes ago, Schmeg82 said:

Did you have any issues going from pill to making your own liquid?

I am still cutting my pills. I bought a really decent scale thinking it would take me to the end. Because of how sensitive I am, it probably won't and I will have to switch to liquid. 

If done slowly you should be fine.

[LostInCanada]

 

 

[Schmeg82]

1 minute ago, LostInCanada said:

I am still cutting my pills. I bought a really decent scale thinking it would take me to the end. Because of how sensitive I am, it probably won't and I will have to switch to liquid. 

If done slowly you should be fine.

I would like to cut my pills if I can first, I’m still on 10mg so should be fairly easy, how do you cut yours?

 

edit: just saw above video sorry! Thank you 

[LostInCanada]

I use a pill cutter and a one sided razor. I always slowly shave by keeping my pill on a hard surface. 

[Schmeg82]

7 minutes ago, LostInCanada said:

I use a pill cutter and a one sided razor. I always slowly shave by keeping my pill on a hard surface. 

I think I would like to do this until I get down to 5mg.  If the pill has a coating on it is that why you use the pill cutter? And shave the center bits out?

[Schmeg82]

Any recommendations on scales? I can order on Amazon! I don’t care the cost (well I mean I do but doesn’t have to be the cheapest)

[LostInCanada]

Most people on here use the Gem 20 jewelry scale on Amazon

https://www.amazon.com/Smart-Weigh-GEM20-Precision-Milligram/dp/B00ESHDGOI/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=1CFSM2IOG6HHZ&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.qR248DJ2hsRVplK3FXJ_dyxTqD1xccCUXqDbaR9ADP7_pkzvSbVyGSfyRpErvgUIDYnXFqZKVMzaTC_jbgZhL0gcRfbTcya-7yixMtWTcFVeCMVONK2GiKfY_4zsHw6FOQqwBHgA6eqjFJ5zlbiYX6Q5RbQkFSl6Qk6kYbe_fdgJ4UnVGnSvGluEmLQGgq9Q5qe5lcGo21B_IOeehCkdbA.VMngMlsjvY2XihFrasrkvDtfGGWYV35c_bjf9Wbz2zQ&dib_tag=se&keywords=gem+20+milligram+scale&qid=1723151444&sprefix=gem+2%2Caps%2C171&sr=8-3